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Brock McLean

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Jeremias said:
Can't see us making 5 list changes.

We don't need to use 3 draft selections.
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I reckon we will definitely use 2 picks minimum, and 3 selections are not out of the question either seeing the depth of this year's draft looming "as good as" the 2001 super draft.
 
LanceRomance said:
I don't think he would go back.. I got the impression he wasn't happy.

I can't see him being happy as the leader of the most dysfunctional footy club.

If he gets delisted (which I think is unlikely) he is more likely to end up at Collingwood who are now in desperate need of a player like him.

There are probably 5-6 guys on the list that would get delisted before Brock.

I don't think he will get a massive contract this time around.
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Who are the 5-6 guys to go before him. The players like Mitchell, McCarthy Mciness and Watson will not be delisted after 2 years. There only Rohan Kerr in his 3rd year, he can be rookied. Simon White has no spot for him in the back or forward. Andrew Collins 2nd year so maybe he might get a 3rd. There no one else unless Jordan Russell or Robbie Warnock ask to be traded. Heath Scotland will possibly continue if his form is good. Bret Thornton, you would be crazy to delist him if Waite or Gibbs go down.

Brock Mclean played 10 games in 2 years and the games he played were poor. The only way he could stay is if David Ellard and Aaron Joseph or both ask to be traded. Brock Mclean will always do well in the VFL mean absolutely nothing in a lot of cases in the AFL look at Digby Morrell. He hasn't done that great, the Northern Blues should have won most or all games so far with the side they have. This usually points to a midfield getting the ball but not really doing a lot of damage.
 

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Azzurri Blue2 said:
He wouldn't get a game at any AFL club...

Game passed him by a few years back...

Credit to Melb for getting extreme overs for him... The deal was done before trade week was even started... Fees would have sleep over night at AFL HQ to make sure trade was completed in the first minute of trade week...
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He would at a bottom sides but they also may say 27 next year forget it, we rebuilding and will not be good until his 31. The top sides would not bite maybe Sydney Swans might get him for very cheap and a last pick.
 
HARKER said:
Whether we like it or not the following players must be seriously looked at, come years end:

Senior list: Collins, McInnes, McLean, Bower, Russell, Thornton and White.
Davies and Kerr may also be in the trigger, if given only a one year contract, last year.

Rookie List: Casboult, Bray, Carter, O'Keeffe and Heyne

Possible Retirement: Scotland.

Needless to say not all will go, but I doubt that any of those boys would be completely comfortable right now.
The point is that none of the above are currently first picked players, excepting Scotland.
We have 28 - 30 players in front of that grouping and must start planning for players to start stepping up in 2-3 years time, so that we don't bottom out.

The mechanics of what we do come years end will be interesting, a little painful, quite prudent and very necessary.
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Why would McInnes be on the list is he as bad as Tiller?
 
Dale Gribble said:
Who are the 5-6 guys to go before him.
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Harker had a good list earlier in the thread

Whether we like it or not the following players must be seriously looked at, come years end:

Senior list: Collins, McInnes, McLean, Bower, Russell, Thornton and White.
Davies and Kerr may also be in the trigger, if given only a one year contract, last year.

Rookie List: Casboult, Bray, Carter, O'Keeffe and Heyne

Possible Retirement: Scotland.

Needless to say not all will go, but I doubt that any of those boys would be completely comfortable right now.
The point is that none of the above are currently first picked players, excepting Scotland.
We have 28 - 30 players in front of that grouping and must start planning for players to start stepping up in 2-3 years time, so that we don't bottom out.

The mechanics of what we do come years end will be interesting, a little painful, quite prudent and very necessary.
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Azul said:
I largely agree with Harker's list. I'm not sure why mcinness in particular would be cut - the other draftees from that year (excl duigan) haven't shown anything at senior level either.

O'Keeffe, White, Casboult are probably gone - pretty unlucky due to injuries and Davies would be stiff.
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O'Keeffe and Casboult do not count as major list as they rookies but more likely will go after being in there for 3-4 years. You think Nick Heyne and Tom Bell maybe also would have to do very well to continue a second year as a rookie. I say that as both are muture age recruits and Wade Twomey got cut and he did ok. I think the rookie list will be only Dale, Bray, Lodge and maybe Carter for a 3rd if he performs well with 4 new ones. Brock Mclean could be picked up as a rookie if the club want him, give him a chance at another club or stay a emergency as a rookie. The club could do that along with McInnes, Davies etc, they give them a chance another club or if not picked up promise a rookie spot.
 
Dale Gribble said:
O'Keeffe and Casboult do not count as major list as they rookies but more likely will go after being in there for 3-4 years. You think Nick Heyne and Tom Bell maybe also would have to do very well to continue a second year as a rookie. I say that as both are muture age recruits and Wade Twomey got cut and he did ok. I think the rookie list will be only Dale, Bray, Lodge and maybe Carter for a 3rd if he performs well with 4 new ones. Brock Mclean could be picked up as a rookie if the club want him, give him a chance at another club or stay a emergency as a rookie. The club could do that along with McInnes, Davies etc, they give them a chance another club or if not picked up promise a rookie spot.
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I would say that would be the only way McLean, short of a HUGE turn of fortune in 2012 (and a fairly big salary cut) will be at Carlton in 2013. Tuohy and Curnow will (or should) be upgraded at the end of the year, so de-listing McLean and taking him as a mature aged rookie would basically be swapping Tuohy and McLean on the senior/rookie lists respectively (and it would count as a forced change of personal which shouldn't be an issue)


This year will be brutal IMO. It is GREAT that players have to EARN a slot on our list, apposed to the years when you didn't have to earn a spot in our starting 22 due to a lack of depth :D:thumbsu:
 
juzz88 said:
All this talk about de-listing players is making me sad. :(

Especially ROK and Casboult.
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All this talk about de-listing players is making me happy. :)

Harker's list is spot on , these guys will never be in our best 22
(Scotland excluded)

If you stand still you go backwards in AFL footy , its tough but thats life and Carlton must keep turning over the dead wood in search of players capable of being best 22 .
 
Red Bull said:
All this talk about de-listing players is making me happy. :)

Harker's list is spot on , these guys will never be in our best 22
(Scotland excluded)

If you stand still you go backwards in AFL footy , its tough but thats life and Carlton must keep turning over the dead wood in search of players capable of being best 22 .
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I know, but I get too emotionally attached to the players. :p
 
coryne said:
I would say that would be the only way McLean, short of a HUGE turn of fortune in 2012 (and a fairly big salary cut) will be at Carlton in 2013. Tuohy and Curnow will (or should) be upgraded at the end of the year, so de-listing McLean and taking him as a mature aged rookie would basically be swapping Tuohy and McLean on the senior/rookie lists respectively (and it would count as a forced change of personal which shouldn't be an issue)


This year will be brutal IMO. It is GREAT that players have to EARN a slot on our list, apposed to the years when you didn't have to earn a spot in our starting 22 due to a lack of depth :D:thumbsu:
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Guys he won't be picked up it was painful to watch his leg speed exposed time and time again, he just isn't afl standard.

Let's just realize this trade is an all time shocker and move on.
 

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Despite any good things McLean can do, his lack of speed means any good work done is undone by not making the next contest or being unable to push forward and provide another option.

The midfielders game now requires sprinting bursts. Repeatedly. Brock cant sprint. Thus cant play midfield. I think alot goes back to when he hurt his achillies at Melbourne and kept playing. Maybe if he had an elite kick or vision so very rarely he was required to follow up with making the next contest or push forwards after passing off, but those players are rare.
 
mikeythemoocow said:
Despite any good things McLean can do, his lack of speed means any good work done is undone by not making the next contest or being unable to push forward and provide another option.

The midfielders game now requires sprinting bursts. Repeatedly. Brock cant sprint. Thus cant play midfield. I think alot goes back to when he hurt his achillies at Melbourne and kept playing. Maybe if he had an elite kick or vision so very rarely he was required to follow up with making the next contest or push forwards after passing off, but those players are rare.
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He wasn't getting a game in ds midfield in his last season with them.

Late in year he was playing fwd and really struggling .. We didn't do proper due dil, reckon rats was thinking he was the player he was when rats was assistant at ds.
 
Have defended Brock till I'm blue in the face and now with a red face I say: gaaaawn. Could well win the Liston medal but is just too slow to play AFL. Pity for him cos he works his arse off. Bigger pity for us cos it has cost us. But such is life.

SO....I was wrong. All you Brock baggers were right. There, I said it.

And I don't feel better at all.
 
A lot of money and time has been invested in McLean - he was always too small to be a hard nut and too slow to be a general. The reason players like Gibbs and Murphy and Simpson look to have time on their side whenever they have ball in hand is that they have the leg speed to get in the right position in the first place and /or the leg speed to buy time under pressure.

The thing people have to realise is that McLean actually slows fast players down - because they can't use their speed when they have to wait and if they have to wait too often - they don't even try and support his gives. Thsi sees them caught flat footed and hospital passed all the time - when Mclean gives teh ball in slow motion.

The other thing to realise is that there is a place for a slower player if they have the size to create damage in contested situaitons. McLean doens't have the size to hurt or slow people in tackles. He doesn't have the size to block or bump and he can't keep up with his match ups.

Carlton isnt being fair to him or to the team in persevering - the game isn't played in slow motion.
 
Peete said:
A lot of money and time has been invested in McLean - he was always too small to be a hard nut and too slow to be a general. The reason players like Gibbs and Murphy and Simpson look to have time on their side whenever they have ball in hand is that they have the leg speed to get in the right position in the first place and /or the leg speed to buy time under pressure.

The thing people have to realise is that McLean actually slows fast players down - because they can't use their speed when they have to wait and if they have to wait too often - they don't even try and support his gives. Thsi sees them caught flat footed and hospital passed all the time - when Mclean gives teh ball in slow motion.

The other thing to realise is that there is a place for a slower player if they have the size to create damage in contested situaitons. McLean doens't have the size to hurt or slow people in tackles. He doesn't have the size to block or bump and he can't keep up with his match ups.

Carlton isnt being fair to him or to the team in persevering - the game isn't played in slow motion.
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Great evaluation, without the boots being layed in:):thumbsu:
 

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Unfortunately Brock just does not fit in our side. The game is to quick for him and especially our game style.
 
Afl football has passed him by..his body isn't up for the running game of afl, not to mention his slow decision making. I don't see him getting another team selection this year, the only touch at an afl game for him will be at the canteen..
 
EL_b4GG4 said:
Afl football has passed him by..his body isn't up for the running game of afl, not to mention his slow decision making. I don't see him getting another team selection this year, the only touch at an afl game for him will be at the canteen..
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Well with Carrazzo and Curnow injured Id bet my bottom dollar he is still in the team this week.
 
I bleed Blue said:
Well with Carrazzo and Curnow injured Id bet my bottom dollar he is still in the team this week.
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I bet Ellard gets his spot. And keeps it.
 
Sorry Brock, but time's up. You were great in your day, but your day's over. Thanks for your efforts and good luck in the VFL.
 

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