Bruce Francis (Part3)

[gavaniacono]

I'm old enough to have seen 5 premierships. That always helps!

I've also experienced them but 72 was a day of dread I still dream about and can't seem to get over. Still couldn't bear watching highlights. 82 similarly (I saw Bourke re damage malthouses' shoulder at training). The rest is farce and dark history entwined.

 

[Reality rules]

AOD cream?

Bingo!

 

[Reality rules]

I'm old enough to have seen 5 premierships. That always helps!

Squash or darts?

 

[Ancient Tiger]

I've also experienced them but 72 was a day of dread I still dream about and can't seem to get over. Still couldn't bear watching highlights. 82 similarly (I saw Bourke re damage malthouses' shoulder at training). The rest is farce and dark history entwined.

It's hard to give up on them though. I just hope the hard times will just make success all the more sweet. Richmond supporters are obviously masochists!

 

[Reality rules]

It's hard to give up on them though. I just hope the hard times will just make success all the more sweet. Richmond supporters are obviously masochists!

They maybe masochists but I admire their commitment

 

[Valleyboy9]

Correct.
Players don't have to prove anything.
Onus is 100% on ASADA to prove that each and every one of the 34 players used TB4.

This comment is far removed from the five minutes you stated it would take before the ASADA case was to be thrown out.
Nonetheless, I suggest Essendon players and officials would be very worried.

 

[andrewb]

lets say everything you say here is correct.
What would you say would be a just outcome?

$2m fine
Removed from the 2013 finals?

 

[Gigantor]

This comment is far removed from the five minutes you stated it would take before the ASADA case was to be thrown out.
Nonetheless, I suggest Essendon players and officials would be very worried.

A lot of people have said that.

No one has ever been able to pull up a direct quote.

I find that interesting.

 

[Valleyboy9]

$2m fine
Removed from the 2013 finals?

That was for a slight book keeping error.

 

[bing181]

It's pretty straight forward AT, nothing has changed. ... As you progress down that series of statements, the certainty of the statement decreases.

But you don't progress down that series of statements. A circumstantial case is not necessarily built on a sequence of events, but a network of evidence. It's only when you stand back and look at the big picture that is formed from these individual elements that you see whether you have a case - or not.

(... this without going into your list, which is both subjective in its opinions and selective in its omissions ... not to mention either, we don't need certainty here, we only need comfortable satisfaction)

 

[BlueWorld]

All discussion, including bruce's most recent, seems to be that you cannot prove what was in each syringe even if you can prove TB4 was provided to the club with the intention of giving it to the playing group. This is the last bastion my friends.

Does he realize it's only comfortable satisfaction

 

[Tiger2709]

You seem balanced and unaffected by the travails of our club. Most tiger supporters I know are clearly marked by failure.

Hang on some of us are marked by the Tigers success how many supporters have had their club win 5 flags in there lives, dont worry the wheel turns and like those long suffering Cats supporters that waited 44 years between flags our time will come again.

 

[Boxhead_31]

$2m fine
Removed from the 2013 finals?

Correct me if I'm wrong but wasn't that fine levelled for poor HR practises?

 

[Reality rules]

They maybe masochists but I admire their commitment

There's something to respect supporters who have not bragged about a clubs numerous premierships, I respect those more who have had a lot more lean times and stuck like a rock! There's more dignity in that than mindless boasting.

 

[peppy la pew]

$2m fine
Removed from the 2013 finals?

Have you got a shock coming

 

[Reality rules]

$2m fine
Removed from the 2013 finals?

Ok Perry Mason.

 

[archibald23]

All discussion, including bruce's most recent, seems to be that you cannot prove what was in each syringe even if you can prove TB4 was provided to the club with the intention of giving it to the playing group. This is the last bastion my friends.

Does he realize it's only comfortable satisfaction

I don't believe so. The definition of those words would have been debated (both at Tribunal and in written submissions) to no end. Im no legal eagle, but in my view the tribunal needs to be comfortably satisfied the players were administered TB4. They can be comfortably satisfied even if they also hold a reasonable doubt. It is up to the players and their legal representation to ensure the panel has more then, in number or weight, a reasonable doubt.

 

[Blueyboy74]

A lot of people have said that.

No one has ever been able to pull up a direct quote.

I find that interesting.

I'll give you two "five minute references" GG

http://www.bigfooty.com/forum/threads/bruce-francis.1083004/page-19#post-36289181

http://www.bigfooty.com/forum/threa...eld-responsible.1079426/page-13#post-35765266

 

[BlueWorld]

It's pretty straight forward AT, nothing has changed.

There is evidence that TB4 was ordered by Charter.
There is some evidence that it was prepared by Alavi.
There is some evidence that it was provided to Dank.
There is some evidence that it made it to the club.
There is some evidence that it may have been used on players.

As you progress down that series of statements, the certainty of the statement decreases.

If you're willing to end careers because players unwittingly may have taken a substance that might be performance enhancing then you're not as intelligent nor as reasonable as you've portrayed yourself.

So you now admit Asada have evidence of tb4 being used at the club. Don't be so melodramatic. Careers ended? How long are they missing? Go read the Wada code. If players have taken a substance that is banned by Wada (forget unwittingly or might be performance enhancing) then there are no provisions for them to be let off.

 

[BlueWorld]

$2m fine
Removed from the 2013 finals?

That was for governance. Your clever club insisted that doping not be mentioned. It was a club penalty, not individuals.

 

[peppy la pew]

A lot of people have said that.

No one has ever been able to pull up a direct quote.

I find that interesting.

Oh C'mon Giggity, as respected former poster GG you were often saying that ASADA were a bunch of Shiny....... merchants who had nowhere near enough evidence, and the case will be thrown out in 5 minutes.

This was during the time when it was revealed that Charter and Alavi would not give evidence.

You remember you wily old fox.

 

[Blueyboy74]

$2m fine
Removed from the 2013 finals?

Yep that would set a great precedent and provide a big deterrent to other clubs that may want to go down the route that Essendon did

The conversation may go something like "Let's implement a programme that will give our players benefits that will last for years. We will miss one year of finals but are likely to win at least four. There may also be a fine imposed but our President will sort all that out ..."

 

[peppy la pew]

I'll give you two "five minute references" GG

http://www.bigfooty.com/forum/threads/bruce-francis.1083004/page-19#post-36289181

http://www.bigfooty.com/forum/threads/there-is-a-possibility-hird-cant-be-held-responsible.1079426/page-13#post-35765266

Gigantor I find this interesting

 

[Satan]

I'll give you two "five minute references" GG

http://www.bigfooty.com/forum/threads/bruce-francis.1083004/page-19#post-36289181

http://www.bigfooty.com/forum/threa...eld-responsible.1079426/page-13#post-35765266

hoisted on your own petard , that pesky search function bit like the pesky ACC and Asada

 

[Randomizor]

hoisted on your own petard , that pesky search function bit like the pesky ACC and Asada

Gigantor doesn't understand search functions. A bit like the Essendon players and Dank.