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Opinion Butcher

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(WARNING WARNING Will Robinson...a Rucci article)
This is yet another article on Butcher, Kenny wants him to show something.
Wants him to do a Lobbe; if he has a solid pre-season there's every chance. YES PLEASE, make 2014 yours Butch.

Source
Hinkley, by contrast, wants that improvement to emerge from every player on his list - even the veterans such as former captain Dom Cassisi and Kane Cornes.
"Everyone on our list has to get better," says Hinkley.
"And I expect every player to get better next year. I expect pick No. 21 in this year's draft to get better. I feel every player on our list improved in some way this year, even some who did not play in the AFL."
But one player cannot hide from the burden of expectation: John Butcher. After 20 games in the past three season, Butcher needs to establish himself as a regular key forward working in tandem with Jay Schulz.
"John Butcher does need to get better - no doubt," said Hinkley.
"I've said publicly we would like a power forward to help out with Schulz. That's Mason Shaw and John Butcher.
"We need them to get better, but most importantly they need to get better themselves.
"The easy change in John Butcher comes from a pre-season. He has not had that opportunity. Look at (ruckman) Matthew Lobbe this year.
"He had a really strong pre-season and he had the opportunity to play a full season of football and his football improved.
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More
 
Butcher starting to grow his 2011 hair back. I hope he grows back his end of 2011 form too.
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Spadge said:
Hitchy hasnt pulled up with a hammy again has he... lol
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Hitchcock is neck and neck with Wingard just by strolling at a casual pace.
He's like the Flash. Flashcock.
 
Lots of talk on the Port Magpies board of turning Butcher into a KPD since his defensive efforts are his strong point.
Is 197cm so he would be our = 1st tallest defender if that was to happen.

IMO the only way this should happen is if Mitch Harvey is close to AFL standard and Redden is performing as a ruck at AFL and is scoring goals when resting forward.

EDIT: Budda Hocking played Butcher a little bit in the ruck and defense on the weekend vs WWT Eagles
 
RossFC said:
Lots of talk on the Port Magpies board of turning Butcher into a KPD since his defensive efforts are his strong point.
Is 197cm so he would be our = 1st tallest defender if that was to happen.

IMO the only way this should happen is if Mitch Harvey is close to AFL standard and Redden is performing as a ruck at AFL and is scoring goals when resting forward.

EDIT: Budda Hocking played Butcher a little bit in the ruck and defense on the weekend vs WWT Eagles
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Not a silly idea at all.

And who knows, it may eventually make a better KPF out of him too.
 
RossFC said:
Lots of talk on the Port Magpies board of turning Butcher into a KPD since his defensive efforts are his strong point.
Is 197cm so he would be our = 1st tallest defender if that was to happen.
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Haven't given up on him as a forward yet, but I'd rather try him as a defender before consigning him to the scrap heap. Chad Cornes was a so-so forward before turning into a gun CHB. I don't think Butcher would ever reach those heights, but a 195cm+ KPD is one of our key deficiencies, so if he could become a decent one it'd be a win (although a lesser one then him coming on as a forward).
 
Andre said:
Haven't given up on him as a forward yet, but I'd rather try him as a defender before consigning him to the scrap heap. Chad Cornes was a so-so forward before turning into a gun CHB. I don't think Butcher would ever reach those heights, but a 195cm+ KPD is one of our key deficiencies, so if he could become a decent one it'd be a win (although a lesser one then him coming on as a forward).
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I reckon he could even be a swingman.
 

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It's pretty obvious something has to change with Butcher.

3 weeks ago I'd have said playing him down back was a stupid idea. Now I'm not so sure, maybe we should throw him down to fullback for a month, it's a simpler game with the ball in front of you. After a that time, if he's regained some touch, we can then make a decision on whether to persist with him down back or make a return to the forward line.

I can't really see any harm in trying something like this, while he can't get a kick at SANFL level, he's offering nothing to our immediate prospects in any case.
 
It Just Is said:
It's pretty obvious something has to change with Butcher.

3 weeks ago I'd have said playing him down back was a stupid idea. Now I'm not so sure, maybe we should throw him down to fullback for a month, it's a simpler game with the ball in front of you. After a that time, if he's regained some touch, we can then make a decision on whether to persist with him down back or make a return to the forward line.

I can't really see any harm in trying something like this, while he can't get a kick at SANFL level, he's offering nothing to our immediate prospects in any case.
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Same here, a couple of weeks ago I would have said keep playing him up forward. But reading Macca's report last week (even though he kicked 5) and watching him on Sunday I wonder if he wouldn't be better served by not being the focal point forward. Maybe he's just out of form but his forward line production with the Magpies has never been great as any regular watcher (eg Powerstufff ) will tell you.
 
The club doesn't have a lot to lose in giving John Butcher a look at the ball from the other end of the ground, older posters may recall Trevor Sorrell, who was a very hit and miss half forward in the early 1970's, 5 or 6 touches was his average in that role.
Jack Cahill moved him to full back in the mid 1970's and he was so successful in the position he became the state fullback.

Jack did the same thing with Max James, he also went from a hot and cold forward to a state defender.

Dennis Errey was an average wingman /forward who became a state player when Fos Williams switched him to defence.

Arguably the clubs greatest fullback in its history, John Abley ( a 3 time All Australian in the position ) came to South Australia after a couple of seasons as the centre half forward for the Hawthorn magoos.

Another poster has already mentioned Chad Cornes, who was a pretty average forward, but absolutely blossomed when he was moved to chb.
 
1954 said:
The club doesn't have a lot to lose in giving John Butcher a look at the ball from the other end of the ground, older posters may recall Trevor Sorrell, who was a very hit and miss half forward in the early 1970's, 5 or 6 touches was his average in that role.
Jack Cahill moved him to full back in the mid 1970's and he was so successful in the position he became the state fullback.

Jack did the same thing with Max James, he also went from a hot and cold forward to a state defender.

Dennis Errey was an average wingman /forward who became a state player when Fos Williams switched him to defence.

Arguably the clubs greatest fullback in its history, John Abley ( a 3 time All Australian in the position ) came to South Australia after a couple of seasons as the centre half forward for the Hawthorn magoos.

Another poster has already mentioned Chad Cornes, who was a pretty average forward, but absolutely blossomed when he was moved to chb.
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Roger Delaney and Ben Harris too. George Fiacchi and Ivan Eckermann as small defenders, Carl Fragomeni was a state wingman for WA when he joined Port. Even Greg Phillips started out as a key forward. Peter Woite was a bit of a utility but found his niche in defence and won a Magarey Medal.
 
I personally wouldn't be against it 1954 but it's not an area of the ground that is an issue. I think Ken will persevere a little longer with him as a KPF. Being forward initially then changing to a defender is definitely an easier transition than the other way around.
 

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Yeah give him a run down back, and maybe make it clear to Butch, that if this doesn't work, then he may not have to many options at seasons end.
He didn't look completely out of place in the back line on the weekend, give him a few games in the SANFL there and see how he goes.
Having Butch down back might also mean that Westy doesn't need to go down back as often as he does, freeing him up in the midfield and forward line.
 
Ford Fairlane said:
... his forward line production with the Magpies has never been great .....
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He's an odd bird. His best games have been in faster but less congested AFL matches. He looks like nothing at all in the SANFL, although I've only been to 1/4 to 1/3 of our matches in recent years.
There is an element of theatre when playing for the Reserves, you are vying for limited chances for promotion. I have no doubt at all Mitchell, Hitchcock, Newton and Neade all understood that against WWT; I felt at times they were saying "Look at me!" as much as trying to win the game. Butch though seemed content to be a decoy when up forward, drawing a defender away from a contest. No fast lead, no speccies, no putting his hand up in any way.
 
Don't see the point really. He's our second best key forward and he'd be our fifth best defender. If he's gonna make it at AFL level it's as a forward, and that's where we need him to make it. All we can really do is persist for the year and a half that his contract lasts and hope that something clicks in that time. At least this year he has the best midfield in the SANFL delivering it to him to give him the best chance of success.
 
Ive always said he will be a better backman than a forward. I believe in Trengove as a forward as well as Redden those guys will kick goals.
 
Ford Fairlane said:
Roger Delaney and Ben Harris too. George Fiacchi and Ivan Eckermann as small defenders, Carl Fragomeni was a state wingman for WA when he joined Port. Even Greg Phillips started out as a key forward. Peter Woite was a bit of a utility but found his niche in defence and won a Magarey Medal.
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I thought Woite won his medal as a wingman?
 
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