cam cloke

[BlueYoss]

I must have posted this on the wrong thread:

http://www.bigfooty.com/forum/showthread.php?t=467024&page=53

I believe Cameron Cloke offers a lot of potential as a permanent forward.

He's already got an accurate booming kick and his field kicking would be in our top 10.

He's a great pack mark, would perfectly compliment Fev who is great on the lead.

He has a lot of size about him and loves to throw it around, and also knows exactly when to stop -one of the best exponents of 'controlled agression' I have seen (him and Kreuze are equal for Avg Frees Against at much less than almost any of our players who get regular games).

He's got a decent footy brain on him and always seems to position himself well and know where to lead.

He's got a huge engine, may come as somewhat of a shock but I'll take the word of Nathan Buckley who trained for years with him over the keyboard heroes on here.

He's still very young (23) for a KP, who we all so often say 'take more time to develop'. Considering he's had a shoulder re-co every (?) year of his AFL career until 2008, and that since coming to Carlton he's been played as an undersized ruck when he is a natural forward, should add up to him having a LOT of development left in him as a forward.

He's got a fantastic work ethic, has done nothing but bust his gut since coming over and I have no doubt he will take any opportunity given to him and make the most of it.

Now let's look at the negatives:

He's slow according to most BF experts, I personally have never really noticed it as such a stand out weakness, but what do I know, I've never played the game.

Besides, he can work with specialist coaches to gain and extra yard or two of pace.

Just out of curiousity, was Fev always so fast on the lead? I distinctly remember him being more of a pack marker than a leading marker in his early years...and how long did it take him to develop his defensive side?

I'm not saying that Cameron is the next Fev, but IMO he's demonstrated more than enough to justify putting a year or two of development into him as a permanent forward if we no longer need him as an undersized ruck.

He might prove me wrong, but then again, he might just prove all those who have written him off wrong.

 

[ctacp]

As long he can legitimately fly for marks & sink his knees fairly into a few opposition rib cages just to let everyone know he's around - thats the biggest factor i reckon. if he can chip in with 2 goals a game that'd be huge- but more importantly get opposition defenders or just those trying to fill up Fevs space thinking twice about the thundering footsteps bearing down on them & how hard he's gonna hit them. We've missed a tough, uncompromising forward since Hamill.

ctacp
curlier than a catoggio pube

 

[4blues]

As long he can legitimately fly for marks & sink his knees fairly into a few opposition rib cages just to let everyone know he's around - thats the biggest factor i reckon. if he can chip in with 2 goals a game that'd be huge- but more importantly get opposition defenders or just those trying to fill up Fevs space thinking twice about the thundering footsteps bearing down on them & how hard he's gonna hit them. We've missed a tough, uncompromising forward since Hamill.

ctacp
curlier than a catoggio pube

Well said, hope he makes it, is really becoming a crowd favorite at the Blues, and thats all from his pride in the jumper and his excellent work ethic.

 

[TwiggleyFanClub]

The more Pies supporters I hear grumble "WTF didn't he do that when he was with us?", the happier I get.

 

[Shambolic]

realisitically is there anything he can do to speed up or are we just talking about playing him as amarking forward and accepting he'll get run off?

The training pictures he looks like he has slimmed down alot but I dont know how much faster he could get?

 

[Jezza U Beauty]

The thing i like the most about Cam is the fact that he adds a tall, pack-marking option to our fwd line. Fev's hard to stop if he's got space to work with and gets good delivery, but he's not a great option in hurried-kick-to-the-pack-at-the-top-of-the-square situations. Some of big Cam's leaping pack grabs last year were inspirational. Bonus goals almost.

 

[Kramer1]

realisitically is there anything he can do to speed up or are we just talking about playing him as amarking forward and accepting he'll get run off?

The training pictures he looks like he has slimmed down alot but I dont know how much faster he could get?

Dropping some bulk, more aerobic work, plyometrics, ground tiger penis...there's lots of things he can do to improve his speed. I've got plenty of faith that our high performance coach knows his trade.

The fact that Cam has returned slimmer and seemingly prertty motivated would suggest that Ratts and co have dangled the CHF carrot in front of him, and he's doing all he can to take it.

As for accepting he'll get run off...I think you and others are reading too much into the Hawthorn game last year. We were horrible to a man, and Hodge was left to do his thing all day. If Cam was posted at CHF on a more permanenet basis, I don't know too many guys that could match up on him physically and still exploit him for pace.

 

[Shambolic]

I accept that we werent that good in Round 22.

My problem is more that he qualifies up until now as 'lumbering' almost in the same way as Mott. He seems like a plod. My question goes to how much that can be reasonably improved upon to take a place even if only part time in the forward line.

 

[Kramer1]

I accept that we werent that good in Round 22.

My problem is more that he qualifies up until now as 'lumbering' almost in the same way as Mott. He seems like a plod. My question goes to how much that can be reasonably improved upon to take a place even if only part time in the forward line.

Well you'd be wrong then. He's never going to win the Grand Final sprint, but in general his ground coverage is pretty good.

Ricky Mott could have been used as a sundial, Cloke is certainly much quicker, and I would think average for someone of his size. Also bear in mind he has had to keep a little bit of bulk to be competitive as an undersized ruckman...I think losing a few kilos will make a big difference.

 

[Prem87]

Underrated player who gets bagged purely on his last name. He is your best option atm at CHF as Waite is great down back with the run he provides. Hopefully your team learns to be less reliant on Fev and honours the lead of Cam at CHF, because you team strucutre will improve immensely. Lets hope he stays injury free.

 

[SurreyBlue]

One of the players I am looking forward to seeing what he can offer as a permanent CHF in 2009. His time has come. Warnock/Hampson will and should be our ruckman in 2009.

 

[Kramer1]

Apparantly the Carlton football dept thought Bentick got quicker last year after dropping weight, sprint training , and consuming copious amounts of ground tiger penis.

Sadly on game day he was still awfully slow.

It is possible but highly improbable that senior players improve their pace a great deal. However it seems technique is a bigger factor than all others

Quantify a great deal.

I didn't say he would be lining up in our 4x4 relay team...but with a modified training program anyone can be trained to improve their speed, especially someone like Cloke who has been playing in a bullocking rouck role.

 

[BlueYoss]

I remember reading about a year or so ago that a team put on a specialist sprinting coach (maybe just for some specific players?) with some notable results. Could have been Collingwood from memory...

 

[BLUE BLEEDING]

is Lance still going there weekly?
or even more often now that he doesn't play?

 

[Shambolic]

Well you'd be wrong then. He's never going to win the Grand Final sprint, but in general his ground coverage is pretty good.

Ricky Mott could have been used as a sundial, Cloke is certainly much quicker, and I would think average for someone of his size. Also bear in mind he has had to keep a little bit of bulk to be competitive as an undersized ruckman...I think losing a few kilos will make a big difference.

I hope you're right but I dont share your confidence in his ground covering ability - thus why I asked about how much he can be expected to improve. He's shown great endevour, hands and is a lovely field kick for a big fellow but Ive always been concerned about his pace on the ground (Often rucks play off each other).

He has certainly lost some weight and looks set to have a crack at a forward role - i wish his well. God knows we're short of options (proven) at this level so he'll be given a number of chances you'd think.

It seems like Ratts has a number of players at his disposal in the forward line with questions ove rtheir ability at AFL level. Sure he has Fevola and Betts of AFL standard but the rest have some concerns:

Fisher - good hands, question over pace, ability to recover, dud kick for goal
Cloke - good hands, good kick, question over pace
Russell - good hands, poor shot for goal, question over ability to getinto the game
Hartlett / Edwards - many questions

Will be a big test for Ratts in 2009 - making a forward line that works.

 

[Dustyjackman]

As next season unfolds, I reckon Cam Cloke will be held in the highest regard by the Carlton faithful. Mark my words.

His a big strong boy. Full of testosterone. Can mark, kick, block, shepard and push a wheelbarrow.

This coming season Collingwood will be spewin' they let him go.



PS: Don't let a game against Luke Hodge have any bearing on his ability. Hodge beats everyone. In fact, I'm tipping Hodge to win a BOG in a Grand Final.