Can a minnow make the semis?

[usalion]

Are the wins by Bangladesh and Ireland a flash in the pan, or could we have one of the minnows make it to the semis of the World Cup? I'd put money on the mighty Tigers, I think....

 

[red+black]

I thought comments that minnows shouldn't play at the World Cup a bit harsh because I believe that England has the right to participate just like everyone else.

Bangladesh are a definite chance to make the semis. Ireland are not. Kenya would be a slight chance. If all 3 make the Super Eights, things will really be interesting. Let's remember though that these "minnows" will probably not carry any points through to the Super Eights.

 

[ShearMagic9]

No.

Can you see a minnow beating at least 4 of: Australia, South Africa, West Indies, Sri Lanka or New Zealand?

 

[statsman74]

I think the issue of the minnows is that most of the commentators have been half right.

The minnows should be in, but the problem is how many.

What we have seen this week is 3 of the 4 most one-sided one day matches in history.

What we have also seen are fantastic performances from Ireland.

The answer seems to be obvious - less ICC qualifiers to keep the standard up, with this still giving the opportunity of these smaller nations to play against the big boys.

 

[Ljam]

No.

Can you see a minnow beating at least 4 of: Australia, South Africa, West Indies, Sri Lanka or New Zealand?

I think the West Indies and the kiwis are vunerable to Kenya or Bangers

 

[Andre]

I think the issue of the minnows is that most of the commentators have been half right.

The minnows should be in, but the problem is how many.

How I'd do it -

Top 8 ranked ODI teams are in the world cup proper, seeded 1 - 8.
The next 8 ranked teams play immediately prior to the world cup - or call it the qualifying rounds if you like, (at the world cup venues), in 2 groups of 4. Top 2 teams from each go in world cup. Leaving 12 teams. How the teams went would seed them 9-12 in the cup proper.

It'd ensure minnows get games, but by the time the real teams get there, they are playing only those that at least will give a fight.

On current performances we'd have had Ireland, Zimbabwe, Kenya and Bangladesh joining the top 8 sides.

 

[red+black]

No.

Can you see a minnow beating at least 4 of: Australia, South Africa, West Indies, Sri Lanka or New Zealand?

That doesn't need to happen for a minnow to make the semis. If 3 minnows qualify, such as Ireland, Bangladesh and Kenya, then if one of them defeats the other two at the Super Eight stage, they would only have to defeat two of the more established teams to be 4/8. If the 5 teams you mention split their wins, maybe even 3/8 will be good enough for a minnow to get through depending on NRR.

And a washout in a particular game could change the whole complexion too.

 

[DOG GOD]

Are the wins by Bangladesh and Ireland a flash in the pan, or could we have one of the minnows make it to the semis of the World Cup? I'd put money on the mighty Tigers, I think....

An upset or 2 was bound to happen..it always does.I still think bangladesh might surprise again, and that's a BIG MIGHT.I think Ireland are really going to be shown up in the super eights.For their sake and their supporters i really hope they can pull off a least a win in their 7 games, but something tells me against the big teams they might cop a bit of a hiding.

 

[Romeo]

I think if there were only 12 teams it would be much more competitive ; just room for a few minnows. And you could have a qualification/relegation system to give an incentive to the minnows to play with the big boys.

 

[Cooldude]

Kenya did last time 'round, so why not

Although with the Super 8 system, it's a lot less likely that it'd happen this time 'round, instead of the Super 6

 

[mcphee_is_a_gun]

I dont consider Bangladesh a minnow anymore, they have a pretty good team nowadays.

 

[Matt_TY]

I think if there were only 12 teams it would be much more competitive ; just room for a few minnows. And you could have a qualification/relegation system to give an incentive to the minnows to play with the big boys.

I think Ireland at least have displayed incentive enough under the current system. And Kenya, as stated, made the semis last time, getting further than England, South Africa and Pakistan to name a few.

 

[Jeremias]

No.

Can you see a minnow beating at least 4 of: Australia, South Africa, West Indies, Sri Lanka or New Zealand?

No.

But could you see Ireland beating Pakistan or Bangladesh beating India?

 

[Romeo]

Woolmer backed the minnows, unlike Punter and Holding even before the Irish stew. And muppet for obvious reasons wanted to play them.


Woolmer backs World Cup minnows
March 17 2007 at 04:27PM [SIZE=+1][/SIZE]Kingston, Jamaica - Pakistan coach Bob Woolmer believes non-Test playing nations should be at the World Cup despite a series of humiliating results here.

Three of the four heaviest defeats in the history of the World Cup came in the first three days of the 2007 tournament.

Sri Lanka beat Bermuda by 243 runs, South Africa romped to a 221-run win against the Netherlands, in a match reduced to 40 overs each because of rain, while Scotland lost by 202 runs to Australia.

But Woolmer, whose Pakistan side were facing Ireland on Saturday, insists that the Associate member sides, comprised of mostly amateur players, will only improve by being exposed to top level competition.

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"My view is that the World Cup is a wonderful incentive for these countries to improve their cricket internally and help grow the game worldwide," Woolmer wrote in his www.cricinfo.com column.

"Ultimately, it's only when the players in those countries are playing regular top-class cricket and are paid professionally that they will start to make inroads into the Full Member nations.

"In addition, players who were born in the high-performance countries but moved overseas with their parents when they were young are now returning to the land of their birth to help with their experience and to try and gain a place in the team with the World Cup as their incentive.

"In fact the ICC has increased the funding 10-fold in order to narrow the gap between the full member countries and the Associates.

"The associate countries have been prepared better for this World Cup than ever before and it has started to show in their performances.

"Ireland, in particular, have shown a rapid improvement, captained by an Australian, Trent Johnston, a medium-fast seamer and, with a number of players who have county experience in England, they have a very good team. Any side underestimating them will be doing themselves few favours."

Woolmer said he was impressed by what he saw of the Irish in their warm-up game against world number one South Africa.

Ireland reduced South Africa to 98 for 8 before Graeme Smith's side escaped with a narrow win.

"That means that their bowling is very disciplined. The Irish have six out of seven left-handers in the upper order and they are young and fit on the field. They are, in other words, a serious banana skin fixture." - AFP

 

[ShearMagic9]

No.

But could you see Ireland beating Pakistan or Bangladesh beating India?

Yes.

That doesn't need to happen for a minnow to make the semis. If 3 minnows qualify, such as Ireland, Bangladesh and Kenya, then if one of them defeats the other two at the Super Eight stage, they would only have to defeat two of the more established teams to be 4/8. If the 5 teams you mention split their wins, maybe even 3/8 will be good enough for a minnow to get through depending on NRR.

And a washout in a particular game could change the whole complexion too.

I know it doesnt need to happen but what I was getting at is that they'd need to perform consistenly, not just have one good game.

 

[The_Reaper]

No.

But could you see Ireland beating Pakistan or Bangladesh beating India?

On their day Bangladesh can beat anybody

 

[Browney2006]

On their day Bangladesh can beat anybody

On their day anyone can beat anyone.

 

[red+black]

Woolmer said he was impressed by what he saw of the Irish in their warm-up game against world number one South Africa.

Ireland reduced South Africa to 98 for 8 before Graeme Smith's side escaped with a narrow win.

Yeah, South Africa got out of jail that day. We should have expected Ireland to be competitive.

 

[Romeo]

Yeah, South Africa got out of jail that day. We should have expected Ireland to be competitive.

Although the pitch was a bit dodgy and favoured the team batting second after a lot of early life so maybe that performance flattered the Irish.

 

[eddiesmith]

That doesn't need to happen for a minnow to make the semis. If 3 minnows qualify, such as Ireland, Bangladesh and Kenya, then if one of them defeats the other two at the Super Eight stage, they would only have to defeat two of the more established teams to be 4/8. If the 5 teams you mention split their wins, maybe even 3/8 will be good enough for a minnow to get through depending on NRR.

And a washout in a particular game could change the whole complexion too.

Of course with reserve days a washout is extremely unlikely

 

[BK Eaglesfan]

I think what the minnows need is more cricket against the top nations in between these tournaments. They get an 'opportunity' to play the top nations in the World Cup and Champions Trophy and no other time. I say 'opportunity' as meeting a fired up Australia, Sth Africa etc in a once every four year tournament with them needing strong results to position themselves for latter stages of the tournament would eb better described as feeding them to the wolves.

If the ICC was serious about helping netherlands or Scotland, Ireland etc...have a test playing nation tour their country and play a one off test and maybe 3 one dayers. Yes I know the cricket calender is already too full.......if they are serious about minnow progress, find something else to remove and give these guys an opportunity.

A 2 - 3 week tour with a few games from say Australia, and coaching clinics in between, would do a hell of a lot more for say the Netherlands, than copping them once every four years in the World Cup when Australia see them as a speed bump on the road to meeting South Africa.

 

[WhyAlwaysMe]

Would Bangladesh be considered a minnow seing they have have test status?

 

[Andre]

If the ICC was serious about helping netherlands or Scotland, Ireland etc...have a test playing nation tour their country and play a one off test and maybe 3 one dayers. Yes I know the cricket calender is already too full.......if they are serious about minnow progress, find something else to remove and give these guys an opportunity.

If the ICC wanted to go that route, then Australia's contribution should be every summer turn the current 3 team One day competition between 3 test nation teams into a 4 team one with 3 test nation teams + 1 minnow. You could cut the number of times each side plays one another down to 3 - you'd still get 18 one day game prior to finals, so you could have two in Brisbane, Sydney, Melbourne, Adelaide, Perth and Hobart (one each with Australia playing) and the remaining 6 games could go to venues like Darwin, Cairns and the like.

The 3 test nations easily do their bit for helping the minnows, the fans at non-standard venues get to see some games and the minnows get matches between major tournaments.

The only downside is it would corrupt averages and statistics. They may have to only include them if between nations ranked in the top 10 ODI sides (or playing minnows at the world cup/champions trophy).

 

[Thelionsrule]

Let's hope that one or more do!

More comments soon if they do!

 

[BK Eaglesfan]

If the ICC wanted to go that route, then Australia's contribution should be every summer turn the current 3 team One day competition between 3 test nation teams into a 4 team one with 3 test nation teams + 1 minnow. You could cut the number of times each side plays one another down to 3 - you'd still get 18 one day game prior to finals, so you could have two in Brisbane, Sydney, Melbourne, Adelaide, Perth and Hobart (one each with Australia playing) and the remaining 6 games could go to venues like Darwin, Cairns and the like.

The 3 test nations easily do their bit for helping the minnows, the fans at non-standard venues get to see some games and the minnows get matches between major tournaments.

The only downside is it would corrupt averages and statistics. They may have to only include them if between nations ranked in the top 10 ODI sides (or playing minnows at the world cup/champions trophy).

That's the kind of thought that I believe needs to go into it......the only reason i suggest going to the minnow countries, is realistically how quick are the Aussie fans going to tire of watching us destory a minnow team, and secondly we (or any other test playing nation) can do more good for a minnow's development by expanding their assistance to training more than just the national team's players.

If say Australia went to Scotland, crowds would probably match what we could gte here for a match of that quality, and our players could work with players deep into their system rather than just the national squad players that would tour here. Also would put less strain on their mostly part time players who by not having to leave their own country would have less trouble getting time off work etc.