Clearances - New tricks take time

[AM]

I think its easy to single out 1 stat and say "OMG LOOK HOW BAD WE ARE!!", what I want to see is a more detailed breakdown, how many goals from clearances we have scored/conceded, turnover numbers and goals scored/conceded from turnovers, how many effective clearances for and against etc.

It's the sort of detailed information the clubs have SG. That's why listening to what those who know from the club say about these things is instructive.

A simple example is looking at inside 50s. How often is way less significant than how deep the entry is; where the ball enters from and where it finishes; how quickly in enters; the type of delivery (high, low, contested. uncontested); the set-up of players when it enters; whether it results in a scoring opportunity; whether that was from a snap, mark (contested or uncontested); where the scoring opportunity originated; whether the ball was rebounded; how that happened and much much more. All data we have no idea about but the club does.

You would assume the club made the changes it has to the coaching in the clearance area and the often expressed concern of the coaching staff about our clearance issues is based on data way more detailed than we would know or understand. It's instructive to watch what the club does and note whether the public message is consistent. As it has been on the clearance matter.

 

[Partridge]

We would want to hope the rucks is a fair proportion of it though because the cupboard is pretty bare for mids ready to go and certainly not one capable of giving us the ascendance around the ground.
I'm afraid we are going to have to work around combination with what were seen so far and maybe George for cover.

It's a tricky situation. Plenty of promising youngsters but apart from Selwood only Christensen is really starting to look like a ball-winning midfielder in his own right. Duncan is almost there but doesn't see too much action inside the centre square. It's not helped by the fact that nearly all the decorated veterans either aren't played there now, or play there sporadically (Corey, Bartel, Chapman, Johnson). Kelly seems to be the one who is still a full-time midfielder and nothing else.

However, if Kelly and Horlin-Smith both come in it could suddenly become a lot better. Trick is getting the balance right.

 

[Senatorguesty]

It's a tricky situation. Plenty of promising youngsters but apart from Selwood only Christensen is really starting to look like a ball-winning midfielder in his own right. Duncan is almost there but doesn't see too much action inside the centre square. It's not helped by the fact that nearly all the decorated veterans either aren't played there now, or play there sporadically (Corey, Bartel, Chapman, Johnson). Kelly seems to be the one who is still a full-time midfielder and nothing else.

However, if Kelly and Horlin-Smith both come in it could suddenly become a lot better. Trick is getting the balance right.

Short term I agree we need Kelly and ghs in there, long term though I don't think it will be an issue with guys like selwood, caddy, ghs, shredder and maybe eardley. That's enough tough inside mids to win most clearances I'd say.
Another point we might be looking past is we might be getting first possession but lack the outside run from the stoppage to actually win the clearance, now that's something Ablett was the best at but it could be another reason.
I don't mean outside run, but the ability of some players to work through a stoppage and hit it at speed to receive a handball or win the clearance outright and get out of the stoppage before being tackled, but I think also we have some kids who could do that in coming years.

 

[you pick one]

Short term I agree we need Kelly and ghs in there, long term though I don't think it will be an issue with guys like selwood, caddy, ghs, shredder and maybe eardley. That's enough tough inside mids to win most clearances I'd say.
Another point we might be looking past is we might be getting first possession but lack the outside run from the stoppage to actually win the clearance, now that's something Ablett was the best at but it could be another reason.
I don't mean outside run, but the ability of some players to work through a stoppage and hit it at speed to receive a handball or win the clearance outright and get out of the stoppage before being tackled, but I think also we have some kids who could do that in coming years.

I wish I shared your optimism Senator,but other than Joel the others have some work to do,I reckon right now on the main board they would be scored thus Selwood A,Caddy C, GHS E the other two GtoH . Their all young but will have to put in a lot of hard yards before they will be winning most contests there is some great young mids coming through in the other sides so grabbing Caddy could be a master stroke.

 

[Partridge]

I wish I shared your optimism Senator,but other than Joel the others have some work to do,I reckon right now on the main board they would be scored thus Selwood A,Caddy C, GHS E the other two GtoH . Their all young but will have to put in a lot of hard yards before they will be winning most contests there is some great young mids coming through in the other sides so grabbing Caddy could be a master stroke.

Yeah really only Selwood, Caddy and Horlin-Smith are senior level at the moment. Hard to gauge how much difference there is between the last 2, hopefully we can get a better idea in the coming weeks.

 

[nickztaa]

Duncan is our next Bartel-like player.

 

[DanA]

It's a huge issue that was an issue last year and I think a large factor in our loss to Freo. The club has identfied it as an issue and tried to address it. I think its why we chased first Boak, then Caddy along with McIntosh.


Right now I think the big problem is we only have two full time midfielders (Selwood & Kelly) where as in the past it's been Corey, Ling and Ablett as full time mids as well. The advantage in having so many part time mids now is that we can rotate more and I think that spread of workload is a large part of why we can come from so far behind. The disadvantage is they are not as good at winning clearances and its why were having poor starts.

Hopefully McIntosh can make a difference but really until we get a couple more pure midfielders that win more than the lose we're going to struggle in the clearance stat.

 

[DanA]

It's a huge issue that was an issue last year and I think a large factor in our loss to Freo. The club has identfied it IMO and I think its why we chased first Boak, then Caddy along with McIntosh.


Right now I think the big problem is we only have two full time midfielders (Selwood & Kelly) where as in the past it's been Corey, Ling and Ablett as full time mids as well. The advantage in having so many part time mids now is that we can rotate more and I think that spread of workload is a large part of why we can come from so far behind. The disadvantage is they are not as good at winning clearances and its why were having poor starts.

Hopefully McIntosh can make a difference but really until we get a couple more pure midfielders that win more than the lose we're going to struggle in the clearance stat.

 

[Kayaz]

Would love to see the clearance stats with West, Selwood, Kelly and Christensen in the middle although I don't think that they have been in the middle once together would think that would be our best centre bounce line up.

 

[AM]

Comments on clearances lifted from the presser by CS and posted on the AFL website.

http://is.gd/8Cvvxo

 

[Micksy]

Won't clearances become less of an issue now that the AFL is trying to eliminate stoppages?

 

[you pick one]

Duncan is our next Bartel-like player.

Look out Bobby 28 posts and a paint job,you could have a rival here for the rainbow award.

 

[nickztaa]

Look out Bobby 28 posts and a paint job,you could have a rival here for the rainbow award.

I already won it.

 

[catempire]

Not sure Chris Scott will be too happy about this, but afl.com.au in its regular "The Inquirer" column (http://www.afl.com.au/news/2013-06-28/the-clearances-conundrum) today focuses on clearances and finally sheds some light on why, despite being hopeless at clearances as a raw number, Geelong excels overall.

In short, Geelong, while being -97 against its oponents this season (ranked 17th in the league only ahead of Melbourne), ranks a clear 1st for "effective clearances" and effective clearance differential. Geelong also ranks 2nd in % of clearances scored from and 1st in points from turnovers.

So obviously Geelong puts far more work into the quality rather than quantity of its clearances and in so doing is very effective at scoring when it does manage to get the first take away from a stoppage.
Interesting stuff.

 

[cynical]

a lot of our effective clearances would be towards the end of the game when the opposition is tired and our midfielders and/or Hawkins start kicking more goals with less defensive pressure

what the article should say is that winning clearances is good but there is a whole bunch of other stuff that determines whether you win a game not just 1 stat

If we were no1 in clearances we'd be top of the ladder with a percentage of 150

 

[footscore]

1st for effective clearance?
I'm shocked at that stat to be honest because I would never have thought that would be the case after losing Ottens, Ablett and Ling.

I am not surprised we are 2nd for scoring from clearances because we often pile on 3-5 goals in succession because of the clearance frenzy that sometimes happens during a game but to be leading the comp for effective clearances and without a genuine no.1 ruck is surprising.

 

[SJ]

1st for effective clearance?
I'm shocked at that stat to be honest because I would never have thought that would be the case after losing Ottens, Ablett and Ling.

I am not surprised we are 2nd for scoring from clearances because we often pile on 3-5 goals in succession because of the clearance frenzy that sometimes happens during a game but to be leading the comp for effective clearances and without a genuine no.1 ruck is surprising.

When a team has a good/great ruckman, then the opposition will often try to rove to that ruckman. That ruckman will get a lot of the hitouts but I would expect the hitouts to advantage and effective clearances as a proportion of total hitouts and clearances for team with a good ruckman to be lower than that of a team without one.

 

[footscore]

When a team has a good/great ruckman, then the opposition will often try to rove to that ruckman. That ruckman will get a lot of the hitouts but I would expect the hitouts to advantage and effective clearances as a proportion of total hitouts and clearances for team with a good ruckman to be lower than that of a team without one.

and your point speaks volumes with someone like Sandilands who's hitouts to advantage were quite ordinary for such a powerful big figure.

We were winning clearances quite significantly though up until halftime last week with Simpson in the team as opposed to having West/Blicavs rucking so shall be interesting to see how we fair in the 2nd half of the season.