News Coaching Thread: The Hardwick Era

[Fat Pizza]

Clayton's recruiting has been fine. He's not responsible for the injuries or the game plans.

 

[Fat Pizza]

If the Board decided on Monday that Rocket had to go, but he wasn't told for 3 weeks, word would have got out. Our club leaks like a sieve. He had to be told.

 

[The Matador]

Clayton's recruiting has been fine. He's not responsible for the injuries or the game plans.

Sorry mate, no way. Go back and review the AFL drafts since our inclusion, is is an absolute indictment on the club and the list manger. Especially the last few years. Our list is a joke. Blaming injuries is nothing more than an excuse. Who are our hard nosed, inside ball winning mids ?? We should have been picking up the best young elite talent in this area. Instead we have passed on guys like Cripps and Matt Crouch and traded the pick which netted Oliver and used our top picks to bring in the likes of Kade Kolodjashnij, Callum Ah Chee, Jarrod Garlett and Touk Miller. Hell we took Sean Lemmens 2 picks before GWS picked up Rory Lobb.

 

[SandyToes]

used our top picks to bring in the likes of Kade Kolodjashnij, Callum Ah Chee, Jarrod Garlett and Touk Miller. Sean Lemmens .

That's a whole lot of average right there

 

[kreglze]

That's a whole lot of average right there

Kade early on was awesome, needs to get that back, he is capable. Also have a lot of time for Ah Chee, very silky and has a good radar for goal. Miller has gone backwards, but is capable of being at a good level.

The only one I agree with is obviously Garlett.

 

[SandyToes]

Kade early on was awesome, needs to get that back, he is capable. Also have a lot of time for Ah Chee, very silky and has a good radar for goal. Miller has gone backwards, but is capable of being at a good level.

The only one I agree with is obviously Garlett.

Every one of those players would struggle to be a walk up start at another AFL Club

 

[kreglze]

Every one of those players would struggle to be a walk up start at another AFL Club

At his best Kade walks up to a lot of sides IMO.

 

[vide0n]

At his best Kade walks up to a lot of sides IMO.

At his best Daisy Thomas was a great player

 

[kreglze]

At his best Daisy Thomas was a great player

Yeah, very true, difference being Kade has a lot of time on his side, and doesn't have chronic foot issues that take away one of his biggest weapons.

 

[The Matador]

That's a whole lot of average right there

To further expand on my post, go through our list make-up. We have some very good talls, but for years on end spent all our top end draft picks on apparently the best outside players, who are severely exposed when we expect genuine plodders to be inside ball winning beasts. You are never going to have a competitive AFL side when it is comprised of all outside cream, and no cake.

I reckon you could make a case that Gary's injuries are a result of our list makeup, and the fact that he felt responsible for so much of the workload that he went in to do what others should have been doing, and as a result ends up battered and beaten up. He himself was always better when he was getting the ball on the outside of stoppages with his elite ball use and decision making. One of the very best going round in that department. Again, all cream, no cake.

 

[vide0n]

Yeah, very true, difference being Kade has a lot of time on his side, and doesn't have chronic foot issues that take away one of his biggest weapons.

I guess all I'm saying is we're at a stage where it is not tenable to cruise on potential anymore

Ah Chee had a nice run of really good footy *this year* so I'm not about to put a knife into his back but the rest are skating on thin ice

 

[Young_Guns]

Just to play devils advocate here, not agreeing that Clayton has been great or anything, but in his first 2 years Touk was a walk up start and one of the best pickups in his draft. Kade in his first few years was very good. AhChee has shown on occasions his skill, granted injury and inconsistency have not helped his cause. Grant and Lemmens.... I got nothing.

But my point is that Touk and Kk in particular were tracking towards being very good players. But after a few years in our system with our current staff, they have not continued to progress at that rate and even gone backwards. And there are plenty more examples on the list who just have looked good but then stagnated or not kicked on. Thats not entirely on Clayton. I think it shows that the (possible) overhaul of the entire coaching team is necessary, to bring in people who will help nurture and develop the kids we bring in better then we are seeing now.

In saying that though, yeah I wouldn't have any complaints if Clayton was moved on.

 

[SandyToes]

At his best Kade walks up to a lot of sides IMO.

not now

 

[BrisbaneCFC]

Paul Roos
Doubt he would want to coach again, would need a massive offer and AFL help

Why would anyone want to watch the dire, defensive, boring, non goal scoring football that this guy plays?

 

[Skav]

You can't really say a recruiter failed because they recruited (insert player who hasn't become elite here) over this person who is now a gun. What you can do is analyze his % of first round picks that became quality top 22 Afl Players (Either at our club or another, because that's not claytons fault)

Hits: Swallow, Bennell, Prestia, O'meara, Martin, KK, Wright, (7 / 13 - 54%
Average: Caddy, Day, Lonergan ( 3/13 23%)
Misses: Gorringe, Tape, Garlett (3/13 23%)
To Early to Tell: Ah Chee, Fiorini, 4 2017 Draftees.

That's not to bad in my eyes and I know everyone will judge differently but, 54% of the time his hitting good players, 23% are just best 22, and 23% don't cut it. The 6 upcoming also look they will only increase this rate.

He also finds some gems in the rough as evidenced by Saady, Hall etc. His going to get the punt and it's probably time but he leaves the list in better shape than a lot of clubs

 

[BrisbaneCFC]

Brad Scott has come in from $41 to $6 to coach Suns in the last 6 hours , that's a lot of money , a leak perhaps?


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That would be the wrong Scott brother to be chasing for sure. Chris, the better of them as players and as coaches.

 

[OB11]

Just to play devils advocate here, not agreeing that Clayton has been great or anything, but in his first 2 years Touk was a walk up start and one of the best pickups in his draft. Kade in his first few years was very good. AhChee has shown on occasions his skill, granted injury and inconsistency have not helped his cause. Grant and Lemmens.... I got nothing.

But my point is that Touk and Kk in particular were tracking towards being very good players. But after a few years in our system with our current staff, they have not continued to progress at that rate and even gone backwards. And there are plenty more examples on the list who just have looked good but then stagnated or not kicked on. Thats not entirely on Clayton. I think it shows that the (possible) overhaul of the entire coaching team is necessary, to bring in people who will help nurture and develop the kids we bring in better then we are seeing now.

In saying that though, yeah I wouldn't have any complaints if Clayton was moved on.

Spot on - I just think there is more blame to be leveled at the development of players at the club by the coaching staff than the players we are picking up.

Having said that Matador made a good point about the list composition - I don't mind the players we have drafted in a vacuum of 'best available' but at some stage he needed to address not having the inside bulls we needed.

Having said all that Prestia and JOM have only been gone a year and certainly would have helped in this area...

 

[JRyan23]

Why would anyone want to watch the dire, defensive, boring, non goal scoring football that this guy plays?

Yeah well it's better than watching the team concede goals in the goal square for 5+ times a game and watching the other team kick over 100 points every week.


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[kreglze]

Just to add, don't take this as me not advocating for change, we need a massive clean out of development and recruiting and I am excited to see some positive change. But in the case of Kade and Ah Chee, I just don't think you can stamp them as a bust so early on.

 

[BrisbaneCFC]

Yeah well it's better than watching the team concede goals in the goal square for 5+ times a game and watching the other team kick over 100 points every week.


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Cmom mate do you really want to watch 3 years of what he did at Melbourne? You wont be picking up new supporters playing that rubbish.

 

[The Matador]

He also finds some gems in the rough as evidenced by Saady, Hall etc. His going to get the punt and it's probably time but he leaves the list in better shape than a lot of clubs

I have to disagree with you there Skav. Ourselves, North Melbourne and Collingwood easily have the worst lists going round. We need to look to what Brisbane have done this year and follow suit. We will need the right people in place, but I have faith that we will make the right appointments.

 

[Cochblocked]

What ever you think of Clayton he can't go now. We can't go into the Draft/trade period without a list manger in what is probably the most important offseason for the club. Evans saying "he's one of the best in the business" also plays in his favour. I'm a fan but if he was to leave it would have to be at the start of next season.

 

[Experimental]

What ever you think of Ashcroft he can't go now. We can't go into the Draft/trade period without a list manger in what is probably the most important offseason for the club. Evans saying "he's one of the best in the business" also plays in his favour. I'm a fan but if he was to leave it would have to be at the start of next season.

I assume you're talking about Clayton, not Ashcroft??

 

[thurls64]

the boys tore it up in training apparently after the news, "trained the house down" - look for some new cattle in the team and new players in different positions I am told - quotes such as "a veil has been lifted", "a fraud" and "laziest bloke to ever hold a head coach position" - some say he did more damage than bluey FWIW

Can tell you he lost the playing group a long time ago hence our lack of development and passion on field

Proof will be in the pudding this weekend

Solly must have been offered a good deal as he said no to GWS as senior assistant, he has not been given the nod though

Assistants don't know anymore whether they are staying or going

 

[Experimental]

I am told - quotes such as "a veil has been lifted", "a fraud" and "laziest bloke to ever hold a head coach position" - some say he did more damage than bluey FWIW

I'm not doubting you mate, but this is confusing as all **** given the praise Rocket continued to get in the media from players up until just a couple of weeks ago.