Daniel Harris

[smiddaz123]

His style of gaming dopesn't rely on pace or athletisism whatsoever. He'll be able to play into his 30's. We should be able tog et 5 or 6 years out of him if we pick him up. I'd be happy to trade for him. He's an elite clearance winner, why would we turn that down?

 

[tw0kbydesign]

Collingwood is the team for mine that suits. He is exactly what you need and will compliment your up and coming midfielder's very well. Has a problem when he purely tries to bust through packs but is a magnificent extractor of the pill. MM would love him.

Realistically you will throw up second rounders for him, but he will gun it in your midfield and you will be laughing at our mob.

I rate him at a pick between 15 - 20 for what it's worth.

 

[FIGJAM]

Collingwood is the team for mine that suits. He is exactly what you need and will compliment your up and coming midfielder's very well. Has a problem when he purely tries to bust through packs but is a magnificent extractor of the pill. MM would love him.

Realistically you will throw up second rounders for him, but he will gun it in your midfield and you will be laughing at our mob.

I rate him at a pick between 15 - 20 for what it's worth.

I agree. I doubt we will be able to get a pick 15 to 20 though.

Hopefully we can nut out something with Laids. Despite concensus, we are a pretty easy team to deal with and usually get win - win trades (or lose - lose in the case of Williams / Adkins).

 

[OniAu]

itd just make sense for the pies to chase harris, itd be ideal if we could grab him with maybe a second round and also get cousins in the pre season draft.

if laidley isnt happy with him , which is pretty well known now i guess. then im sure a second round would surely do the deal.

pick 11 or watever we have , would seem to much. espeically considering the year after draft concessions come in from the gold coast

maybe as others said , mid to early second round might do it

 

[Didak2Dawes]

Lets keep our picks and draft more kids.

There must be a young, untried extractor in the draft somewhere.

 

[rose jam]

straight swap with Rusling, they need forwards badly

 

[Thewlis Dish]

straight swap with Rusling, they need forwards badly

Hale has FF covered, Edwards and Jones can play as marking targets, Campbell and Thomas crumb while Petrie and Hansen will both spend time there. Josh Smith and Robbie Tarrant are two untested kids too, Smith in particular has killed the VFL as a key forward (as has Wundke on the rookie list with 40+ goals). Rusling is the last thing we need.

Kerr is off the market now - I think we'll see who can come up with the best pick or picks for Harris.

 

[Yahoodle]

Kerr is off the market now - I think we'll see who can come up with the best pick or picks for Harris.

If we gave up a gun young forward for a slow 26 year old midfielder I'd vomit

 

[HFF]

If we gave up a gun young forward for a slow 26 year old midfielder I'd vomit

Ditto.

Apart from Dale Thomas being our most important player who needs to do an 'Adam Cooney', I think Sean Rusling looms as the biggest wildcard on our list and probably best 22.

If we can keep him on the park, he will blossom.

Reid is the other too.

Harris, despite being a clearance king is just an upgrade on O'Bree. Pass.

 

[Axl the great]

Harris is this and that is all ive read in these posts.
What he is, is a guy that is a pretty decent player, and would provide one important thing, depth in the midefield which is sorely lacking, while no superstar Harris can hold his own against good clearance players and has fantastic hands in close.
Looking at our team sheet week in week out the lack of REAL centremen is alarming forcing us to throw Didak and others through there.
For the right deal IMO a Shaw and 4th rounder we could do a lot worse than have him at the club with a fresh start and a bit of encouragement and trust instilled (which seemed lacking for Laidleys scapegoat) we could have a real handy player for a few years.

 

[BEEG]

If we dont pick up Harris i will be FURIOUS like he will be brilliant in our Mid field we struggle to get clearences and look what we did to Medhurst

Collingwood dont be idiots his a good age 26 go out and get him use our 2nd Rounder and something else

1st Rounder = Sidebottom,Blease,Swift
Harris
Cousins

Will make a massive difference to our team and imagine if we can get Didak off for Pick 4 using that to get a Vickery Hartlett or Rich

 

[Zvim]

Lets keep our picks and draft more kids.

There must be a young, untried extractor in the draft somewhere.

That theory is a sound one, however, the average life expectancy of a first round pick is around 3 years. Say you get another Egan, does that improve the list?

Investment in youth is a great thing, but you can't have 80% of your list made up of players you don't know if they are going to be players or not. It is cold comfort during the H&A season when you are losing games because you are missing players like him when you have invested in some young kid you wont know if he will be good or not for 2-3 years.

The question is are you happy to see the club slide out of the top 8 while you experiment on youth? Harris has been a big part of why we have been competitive over the years, we just lacked the outside midfield support.

We have a good replacement for Harris so I don't think it will hurt us if he goes, if Harris ends up on a side just outside the 8 then it is another side boosting their midfield significantly.

 

[HFF]

If we dont pick up Harris i will be FURIOUS like he will be brilliant in our Mid field we struggle to get clearences and look what we did to Medhurst

Collingwood dont be idiots his a good age 26 go out and get him use our 2nd Rounder and something else

1st Rounder = Sidebottom,Blease,Swift
Harris
Cousins

Will make a massive difference to our team and imagine if we can get Didak off for Pick 4 using that to get a Vickery Hartlett or Rich

You need to get over this obsession of trading Didak and wanting to get spuds like Harris.

Now don't ge me wrong he is a serviceable player who would slightly improve our midfield but we do not need more honest battlers. Would rather give Stanley the opportunity to do what Harris does and hopefully more.

Didak and Thomas into the midfield is the class, polish and X-factor that we lack but will have over the next few years and beyond. Particularly when Daisy becomes like Gazza or Cooney.

 

[Vampire013]

Ditto.

Apart from Dale Thomas being our most important player who needs to do an 'Adam Cooney', I think Sean Rusling looms as the biggest wildcard on our list and probably best 22.

If we can keep him on the park, he will blossom.

Reid is the other too.

Harris, despite being a clearance king is just an upgrade on O'Bree. Pass.

At least there is someone here with brains.
Too bad that others cannot see how good Rusling might be if he had a little luck with injury. When he came into the side at the end of last year he totally added something to the forward line. The guy could be anything.
Reid will also be a gun when he bulks up. Give him a chance. He is young.
I really don't know why some think that either will be up for trade.

 

[kevind]

At least there is someone here with brains.
Too bad that others cannot see how good Rusling might be if he had a little luck with injury. When he came into the side at the end of last year he totally added something to the forward line. The guy could be anything.
Reid will also be a gun when he bulks up. Give him a chance. He is young.
I really don't know why some think that either will be up for trade.

The most injury prone player in the AFL, only 17 goals in 19 games as a FF, a dreadful, almost kickless performance before he was injured in his only game this year, a one dimensional player who only gets kicks via uncontested marks....and you wonder why some of us fellow Pies supporters don't rate him?????

Reid may be up for trade(although I doubt it very much) as he is a dreadful kick(we seem to love recruiting players who can't kick).

 

[Dundalis]

That theory is a sound one, however, the average life expectancy of a first round pick is around 3 years. Say you get another Egan, does that improve the list?

Investment in youth is a great thing, but you can't have 80% of your list made up of players you don't know if they are going to be players or not. It is cold comfort during the H&A season when you are losing games because you are missing players like him when you have invested in some young kid you wont know if he will be good or not for 2-3 years.

The question is are you happy to see the club slide out of the top 8 while you experiment on youth? Harris has been a big part of why we have been competitive over the years, we just lacked the outside midfield support.

We have a good replacement for Harris so I don't think it will hurt us if he goes, if Harris ends up on a side just outside the 8 then it is another side boosting their midfield significantly.

Every great club is built through the draft. Those that gamble with trades to pick up experienced players from other clubs, unless it's a no brainer, usually end up getting burned (see Essendon and Carlton earlier this decade).

 

[Dundalis]

At least there is someone here with brains.
Too bad that others cannot see how good Rusling might be if he had a little luck with injury. When he came into the side at the end of last year he totally added something to the forward line. The guy could be anything.
Reid will also be a gun when he bulks up. Give him a chance. He is young.
I really don't know why some think that either will be up for trade.

You can't just say a player will be a gun because you feel like it. A player has to show not only the skills, but also the ability to rise to the occasion. Reid has shown none of that. All he's shown is that he's a good athlete. Poor skills, and for me shown a nervousness rivalled only by Alan Toovey at AFL level. As for Rusling, he could be an effective but one-dimensional leading forward. If that's what you mean by 'anything'. Other than that, not too much. And he is clearly injury prone.

I remember another player who looked just as talented, but had almost an almost identical set of circumstances happen to him injury-wise. His name was Tom Davidson. Once your shoulder goes a couple of times, it will only deteriorate. I hold no faith whatsoever that his shoulders will hold up, particularly given the position he plays where play above shoulder height is crucial. It's not like he's a midfielder ala Judd, where he can somewhat avoid direct contact.

This is more overrating of Collingwood's youth by our own.

 

[The Royal Sampler]

Reid may be up for trade(although I doubt it very much) as he is a dreadful kick(we seem to love recruiting players who can't kick).

I doubt Reid's up for trade simply because you don't rate his kicking, kevind.

 

[3rdMan]

He's a worse version of O'Bree, but he's just harder at the ball, a much better tackler, much better by hand, a better clearance player and gets just as much of the ball despite playing less minutes.

O'bree has him covered on the ability to snap the ball 30m out of the centre to no-one in particular, though.

Disagree on all counts, the stats certainly don't show it.
He's a worse version of O'Bree, partly due to being slightly shaded for pace and kicking ability, and his inability to run out games. Though the big difference is the mental side. There's a reason why O'Bree's held in such high esteem at Collingwood, his attitude and commitment to the game are supreme. Harris has been questioned in this area by Laidley.

Anyway, it's probably Collingwood bias that has me place O'Bree ahead of Harris. They are actually very similar. The stats for 2008 (both played 23 games) are extraordinarily tight:

Note: O'Bree has a slight advantage in clearances (certainly not much worse as you claimed), a big advantage in contested possessions, only 3 less tackles and 8 more one percenters (does not suggest Harris being much harder at it and a much better tackler).

 

[kevind]

I doubt Reid's up for trade simply because you don't rate his kicking, kevind.

Not what I was saying. He will be put on the trade table if the club does not rate his kicking in relation to the other skills he has shown. From what I hear, the club really rates him, so I doubt he will be offered for trade. IMHO, he will never be a great player as his kicking will always be a huge problem. I hope I am wrong, but the history of players improving kicking skills beyond his age is virtually non existent.

 

[3rdMan]

Not what I was saying. He will be put on the trade table if the club does not rate his kicking in relation to the other skills he has shown. From what I hear, the club really rates him, so I doubt he will be offered for trade. IMHO, he will never be a great player as his kicking will always be a huge problem. I hope I am wrong, but the history of players improving kicking skills beyond his age is virtually non existent.

How much of his kicking have you seen?
Is his general kicking poor, or only kicking for goal? I would say the latter; has good skills around the ground.

What's the history of players who are poor shots for goal becoming very good players? Buddy Franklin, Matthew Richardson, Travis Cloke...

Given he could possibly play back, or even on the wing, his possibly poor goal kicking may be a non factor. Also, his poor kicking for goal at the senior level, could largely be put down to nerves, no reason that could not be improved on.

Speaking of improvement - Did you know that Cloke improved from 39-39 last season, as well as 6-12 and 10-16 the two seasons before, to 40-25 this season? That seems to be a significant improvement.

 

[mdc]

Disagree on all counts, the stats certainly don't show it.
He's a worse version of O'Bree, partly due to being slightly shaded for pace and kicking ability, and his inability to run out games.

O'Bree shades no-one for pace. If it came down to it, I'd back half the posters on this board to beat him in a foot-race. He's probably a better kick on his wrong foot than Harris though, so I'll give you that.

Though the big difference is the mental side. There's a reason why O'Bree's held in such high esteem at Collingwood, his attitude and commitment to the game are supreme. Harris has been questioned in this area by Laidley.

It's possible. Hard to comment on Harris' mental side from the outside - personally Laidley seems like a bit of a **** to me, so I'm not going to immediately side with him.

Anyway, it's probably Collingwood bias that has me place O'Bree ahead of Harris. They are actually very similar. The stats for 2008 (both played 23 games) are extraordinarily tight:

You have to take into account that Harris spends much less time on the ground. Multiply Harris' numbers by 1.5 or so to get a fairer comparison.

Note: O'Bree has a slight advantage in clearances (certainly not much worse as you claimed), a big advantage in contested possessions, only 3 less tackles and 8 more one percenters (does not suggest Harris being much harder at it and a much better tackler).

Again, their stats are fairly similar if you don't adjust for minutes. When you do, Harris destroys him. Dale Thomas' numbers look like crap as well, but when you consider he only spends 70-80% of time on the ground, they look a lot better. Well, Harris spends 60-70% of time on the ground - his stats are terrific when you take that into account.

Also, re: tackling and hardness, it's almost impossible to quantify statistically. I don't think anyone would disagree that Maxwell and Medhurst are our two hardest players, and probably our two best tacklers, but good luck trying to prove it with numbers.

 

[3rdMan]

The reason he doesn't spend more time on the ground is lack of endurance. We can't assume he'll get that right over the pre-season, so I think the comparison's fair as is. You can only measure a player on what he's done, not what you'd hope he may do. Shorter amount of time on the ground can have advantages as well as disadvantages, possibly allowing a player to go harder for the shorter bursts they are on.

 

[odoyle_rules]

Reid is a very good field kick, which I am sure he can translate to his goal kicking.

For him, its purely nerves and pressure, once he can learn to dealing with the AFL stage, he WILL be a gun. IMO Reid is untouchable!

 

[Yahoodle]

Couldn't care less about Reid's goal kicking, he's our only shot at an attacking CHB