Universal Love David Teague

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Blue1980

Brownlow Medallist
Jun 9, 2011
14,048
16,145
Melbourne
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Carlton
Disagree completely. Look at the doggies. Their captain left and they won a flag! No one player (apart from Mckay) is unreplaceable.

I'll get howled down for this, but I don't think he is captain material. He chokes and overthinks when he needs to stand up. It's just not him.
Walsh should be made captain next year. He thrives with leadership.
I agree, Cripps gets negative when we are losing or he makes a mistake and drags the side down with him.
 

gbatman

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Mar 26, 2008
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I don't think we are going to make the 8. The teams in the 8 this week are probably going to be the teams in the 8 at the end of the season.

I think if we go through the season playing the old boys and not using young players who are picked in our best 22 Teague will be moved on. I think we will look for a coach who has a plan to play the young players and bring them into the game and look to focus on player development rather than winning from week to week with no genuine future plans. Ironically we would have been better to start with Teague and finish with Bolton in regards to their philosophies.

Bolton was heavily focused on defence and structure and making young players the focal point which was not what we needed then but it's what we need now. Teague seems to want to play a game that's even with defence and attack and isn't either one or the other and make the young guys do it the hard/long way and that's ok for some but not for all and not what we need right now.
 

gbatman

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Disagree completely. Look at the doggies. Their captain left and they won a flag! No one player (apart from Mckay) is unreplaceable.

I'll get howled down for this, but I don't think he is captain material. He chokes and overthinks when he needs to stand up. It's just not him.
Walsh should be made captain next year. He thrives with leadership.
I'm not impressed with Cripps as captain at all at this stage. I think he's too much about himself which is ok if you are a dominant player but at a 26 possession half a goal player he isn't. I don't see how he contributes to player development and how he brings others into the game which as captain of a developing team he should be. He's a captain of a club and he's unsigned which means he's potentially leaving and we don't need that, it's poor leadership once again. We are a team of individuals who just appear to leave some players out of their plans and this has part to do with leadership. It's just another thing to look at.

TBH if Cripps leaves I won't lose any sleep. I just get the feeling he's part of the reason players don't develop at Carlton and it's not just his fault, everything we do midfield wise seems to have to involve him, we don't go through enough other players and it would force us to, we didn't look too bad last season when he missed games, we played more a team game and were less predictable.

This is another aspect of our team which isn't strong IMO.
 

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sparkyblue

Team Captain
Sep 10, 2010
586
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I'm not impressed with Cripps as captain at all at this stage. I think he's too much about himself which is ok if you are a dominant player but at a 26 possession half a goal player he isn't. I don't see how he contributes to player development and how he brings others into the game which as captain of a developing team he should be. He's a captain of a club and he's unsigned which means he's potentially leaving and we don't need that, it's poor leadership once again. We are a team of individuals who just appear to leave some players out of their plans and this has part to do with leadership. It's just another thing to look at.

TBH if Cripps leaves I won't lose any sleep. I just get the feeling he's part of the reason players don't develop at Carlton and it's not just his fault, everything we do midfield wise seems to have to involve him, we don't go through enough other players and it would force us to, we didn't look too bad last season when he missed games, we played more a team game and were less predictable.

This is another aspect of our team which isn't strong IMO.
Spot on. Entitled, is the word that springs to mind with Cripps. I don't think he's got the right mentor in his ear right now. It's not about what he wants to hear, it's about what he needs to hear. His "legacy" at it stands is one of missed opportunity rather than being a great of the game.
 

jj1978

Norm Smith Medallist
May 11, 2006
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Either Cripps is waiting for a rich vein of form to up his negotiation price, or he's gone.

That's my 2 cents worth. (I would not buy that for a dollar)
 

gbatman

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Either Cripps is waiting for a rich vein of form to up his negotiation price, or he's gone.

That's my 2 cents worth. (I would not buy that for a dollar)
I agree, probably 3 reasons he hasn't signed.

1. He's gone or thinking about going.

2. He's not playing well, he's trying to up his game so he can go into contract negotiations on the back of some good footy and get a better contract.

3. He's being a team player and waiting for the club to try and sign a big name player before he negotiates.

I can tell you one thing, if he walks out the door then he walks out a failed captain and certainly on current form not a top player. If he leaves and we cash in we aren't really losing we're getting rid of part of the problem. Players need to buy in to the club, especially the captain.

If he goes then he is a RFA of a club with cap space I believe. That means we do what GWS did with Cameron and we force them to trade and we come out big winners. It also opens up a spot for young players to develop and develop better in a side that is hopefully less focused on individuals. Whether he stays or goes it doesn't bother me, as long as Carlton wins out.
 

jpfalvo

Team Captain
Aug 2, 2009
338
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I agree, probably 3 reasons he hasn't signed.

1. He's gone or thinking about going.

2. He's not playing well, he's trying to up his game so he can go into contract negotiations on the back of some good footy and get a better contract.

3. He's being a team player and waiting for the club to try and sign a big name player before he negotiates.

I can tell you one thing, if he walks out the door then he walks out a failed captain and certainly on current form not a top player. If he leaves and we cash in we aren't really losing we're getting rid of part of the problem. Players need to buy in to the club, especially the captain.

If he goes then he is a RFA of a club with cap space I believe. That means we do what GWS did with Cameron and we force them to trade and we come out big winners. It also opens up a spot for young players to develop and develop better in a side that is hopefully less focused on individuals. Whether he stays or goes it doesn't bother me, as long as Carlton wins out.
If he has intentions of staying, as a leader of this football club its incumbent on him to committ.

He will be fairly compensated commensurate to his value and output. 750-850k i think is about right. In my view he is not $1mil player.

Now would be the time for him to lead by example and show his belief in the club, direction, team mates and coach.

It would be a massive vote of confidence for him to sign on right now. Sadly, his hesitation is not a great look for a captain.

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Elmer_Judd

#Teague2020
Jul 25, 2019
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Sacking Teague during or end of the season would be tantamount to the club admitting (imo) that out latest rebuild has failed, and another major one is required.

It's all well and good to say Teague should play more kids and I agree, but we are less likely to win games/be competitive if he does that.

Stick backing Teague to coach us next year, even if we finish bottom 6.

Next season might even be tougher than this one, with the expected retirements and possible departure of Cripps.

Really no poInt replacing Teague if 2022 is going to be another development year.
 

Coona Blues

Director of Coaching
Nov 3, 2011
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Sacking Teague during or end of the season would be tantamount to the club admitting (imo) that out latest rebuild has failed, and another major one is required.

It's all well and good to say Teague should play more kids and I agree, but we are less likely to win games/be competitive if he does that.

Stick backing Teague to coach us next year, even if we finish bottom 6.

Next season might even be tougher than this one, with the expected retirements and possible departure of Cripps.

Really no poInt replacing Teague if 2022 is going to be another development year.
This is not a logical extrapolation. We categorically do not need another rebuild. We have the majority of the pieces in place. A bit of tweaking required with or without Teaguey.

Coaching and/or management failings and list quality are not unconditionally linked. Our current “loyalty” to what should be sunset players needing to be phased out (or should have been already) is detrimental to our future and thus the perceived efficiency of the rebuild. The reluctance to “play the kids” is a huge issue. What needs to become apparent is the level of readiness of the kids. We missed a significant portion of a development year in 2020 with too many players. Hub and playing restrictions along with a shocking run of injuries. Combined with our ordinary development system and/or personnel we had stalled.

The second tier competition restructure along with our upgraded focus on development has me more optimistic than ever that our kids can and will reach their potential. I remain confident that overwhelmingly we have drafted well through the SOS era and have no complaints with Austin’s first haul, bar the lack of focus on talls. I readily grant that the coaching group is somewhat stymied by poor development in recent years.

What remains unclear is the ability of our senior coaching group to get the best out of our group. If there is a divide between young and old, for instance, we need to mould the group in to a cohesive unit playing for each other and the club. Teague’s role in all of this is the cornerstone. He must perform or perish. Here’s hoping Worsfold and others can identify the weak links or negative practices that stand in the way of success.

If we lose Cripps we will be suitably compensated and it may be a blessing demanding a team over messiah approach. Not thinking Harry will jump ship unless we somehow cave at the back end of the season and some club makes him an instant millionaire.
 

sparkyblue

Team Captain
Sep 10, 2010
586
1,330
AFL Club
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Here’s hoping Worsfold and others can identify the weak links or negative practices that stand in the way of success.
This. The club doesn’t really have figures within that have actual experience, or understand of what actual success looks like. Without it, you can only speculate as to what is required. The coaching team look like they’re out of ideas at this point as the same issues keep occurring. I can only hope Woosha is able to give them a direction, and that our coaching and playing groups are receptive to change.
 

BigBreakfast

Norm Smith Medallist
Sep 19, 2019
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Simpson comes out and says their effort was embarrassing publicly and is largely lauded for his honesty.
We get the same old rhetoric from Teague. He doesn’t see himself as a head coach yet and there is a tenor of apologist about him. The odd bake doesn’t fix that. Uncompromising standards and honesty please. If he can’t do it, move on.
As for our game plan:
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Accidental genius

Norm Smith Medallist
Apr 4, 2018
7,706
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I like the way dees went about their coaching recruitment. First they had roos as the experienced head for 3 years to sort out any underlying issues and slowly phased in Goodwin.

We’ve sort of allowed things to proceed too far before an experienced person had a chance to correct things at an earlier stage. I’m keen to see woosha sort out a few things
 

jpfalvo

Team Captain
Aug 2, 2009
338
618
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Carlton
Our board collectively knows they can't survive another sacked coach. So look forward to a token couple of token appointments (Woosha from Perth is one) but ultimately I think Teague stays whilst this board is there. They'll point to the Richmond example bla bla. But we are so far from Richmond 2016 right now, not even close

Already hearing that most of the rhetoric at board level is that this is a Steve Silvagni problem. I'd say that's being driven by whoever wants to unsurp MLG as President, given his ties.

MLG doesn't know what he's doing. Neither does Judd. Where are these two figures? Staying well away from the media as usual. It's really not good enough.

Enough pointing to the financials and debt position. They have been failing at the core business of football for many years now and it can no longer be ignored.

Club is a genuine sh*t show. Things are going to have to get a hell of a lot worse before they get better. Time for the members to start exercising their rights under the constitution and agitate for change. 100 signatures gets us a meeting
cookie monster

Plenty going on. Maybe accountability.
MLG and Judd stepping down.

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17SetMeFree

Senior List
Nov 2, 2020
246
474
AFL Club
Carlton
I just think people need to put things into perspective, we aren't in as bad a place as what some people like to make out that we are. We all want better but we're hardly at rock bottom, we'll be on the way up soon enough. All this doom and gloom is plain ridiculous.
Who cares what the media or anyone else outside of the club says? Let them talk, that's their job, our clubs isn't to respond to them, it's to move ahead and see what needs to be done to further improve ourselves.

Making Finals was never a certainty this year 7th-10th is about where we sit I believe, nothing's happened to change my view on that yet.
Making finals certainly was an expectation. The number of injuries wasn't. The trend atm is downward, with one captain fumbling and unsure of himself, whilst the other is playing undisciplined frustrated football. There are passengers that don't chase and stick tackles and there's a reluctance to work to meritocracy at the selection table.
It seems to me, the coach is waiting for an emotional moment, something pivotal to change the mindset. MLG and JUDD wouldn't be leaving if we were 4/2
They know its a shtshow coming
 

gab213

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Aug 29, 2013
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Making finals certainly was an expectation. The number of injuries wasn't. The trend atm is downward, with one captain fumbling and unsure of himself, whilst the other is playing undisciplined frustrated football. There are passengers that don't chase and stick tackles and there's a reluctance to work to meritocracy at the selection table.
It seems to me, the coach is waiting for an emotional moment, something pivotal to change the mindset. MLG and JUDD wouldn't be leaving if we were 4/2
They know its a shtshow coming

MLG is not leaving because of our ladder position, he's leaving the presidency as he's served the maximum amount of years he can. The fact he was finishing this year was already known before this season started, the announcement the other day was about who would succeed him. His timing for leaving was set long before this season.

I didn't speak about expectations as far as finals go, I said we were no certainty this year and we never were. Expectations and reality are often two different things. Having said that we are still a chance to make finals. We aren't on a backward trend at all, you can't say that after 6 weeks.

There is no shitshow, you're doing exactly what I said people were doing, not putting things into perspective.
 

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