Universal Love David Teague

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bmaurizio

Premiership Player
Aug 11, 2004
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Nobody could be comfortable with our current situation, as the lack of young midfield talent means we are still miles off playing finals.
There’s amazing true midfield ability in the top 10 picks in the 2021 draft, especially top 5 has super talent some real gems. Surely Austin Agrestia can’t get this wrong?
 

fnm_just a man

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Aug 11, 2008
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Okay I will make it very gentle for you so you don't get offended

We will start with each of your claims

Saints first

I stated that our rebuild timeline was ahead of the Saints as of end of last year, which is fact. People still wanted to debate the situation, without facts, claiming they made finals in 2020, which was in their 7th year.

Now that they are playing poorly, people have changed tact

So simple question, show me where I have stated that I am content with our current situation due to how the Saints have performed over their rebuild

Just one post. Once you can find that, we will move on to your other claims
It's not though. It's not comparing apples with apples ... All it's doing is selecting a year when Saints started their rebuild and ignoring everything that comes after it ... like the fact that we hit the draft harder than they ever did in 2015, essentially 'overtaking' them in the rebuild.
 

The Flying Doormat

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Other than Voss or leppitsch ( who were failed coaches) or poaching Lyon at years end what other coach was available at the time that didn't have training wheels . He has another year left list still has holes to fill it will all work out .
I feel the rookie mistake he made (Brad Lloyd also) was not shaking up his coaches box the first year and moving some more pieces last year to get some different voices .. this may cost him in the end .. maybe he surrounded by yes men as Bolton also was pig headed and never changed his ways with the same group of assistants .. can't be surrounded by Yes men ..
I'll throw a few names out there off the top of my head.
Mattner, Montgomery, Burns (no pun) Bassett, Harvey.
All assistants, all could have been possible appointments if a serious offer was put to them.
 

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Arr0w

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It's not though. It's not comparing apples with apples ... All it's doing is selecting a year when Saints started their rebuild and ignoring everything that comes after it ... like the fact that we hit the draft harder than they ever did in 2015, essentially 'overtaking' them in the rebuild.
How clubs use capital during a rebuild is up to them, it doesn't change the starting time of that rebuild
 

Arr0w

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No, but it does remove any relevance for using the starting time as a tool to measure/compare performance.
Why does it?

Rebuild starts as of today, I am going to strip the list of any player with value that won't be part of the next window and retain cheap role players.

I have 3 options

Draft all kids

Trade for quality 21-23 year olds + cheap FA

Or a mixture of both

It's still a rebuild, only the strategy is different
 
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fnm_just a man

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Why does it?

Rebuild starts as of today, I am going to strip the list of any player with value that won't be part of the next window and retain cheap roll players.

I have 3 options

Draft all kids

Trade for quality 21-23 year olds + cheap FA

Or a mixture of both

It's still a rebuild, only the strategy is different
For the reason that different approaches are taken - it's not comparing apples with apples .. It doesn't help us to compare how our rebuild is tracking if we're comparing it to a team that used a different strategy. Ultimately, you may be able to argue the merits of the strategy taken, but there is nothing to be gained by using it as a tracking tool.
 

Arr0w

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For the reason that different approaches are taken - it's not comparing apples with apples .. It doesn't help us to compare how our rebuild is tracking if we're comparing it to a team that used a different strategy. Ultimately, you may be able to argue the merits of the strategy taken, but there is nothing to be gained by using it as a tracking tool.
No rebuild is the same, but a starting point, date and time, I see as the only common denominator

What measure would you use?
 

TwiggleyFanClub

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The culture needs a rebuild, so give him a year to start the turnaround. And give him some tactical help.
Hard to do if you're making wholesale changes to the game plan (yet again), but Assistants need to go now.

If the improvement can be seen, then great.
If he's still part of the problem, get him out. Get Luke Hodge under the wing of someone like Balme. Can't imagine there would be any sacred cows for those two.
 

fnm_just a man

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No rebuild is the same, but a starting point, date and time, I see as the only common denominator

What measure would you use?
It is difficult. From the outside (of the Club), ultimately it comes down to several factors and it will be influenced by one's personal view. There is no objective way to pinpoint it at any given time, especially with the information we have, imo, so it is a pointless exercise attempting to. From my point of view, the overriding factor is team and individual performance - more in-depth than simply wins/losses, obviously, although that is very relevant too. Other considerations include judging where the Club thinks the rebuild is at (based on what they say, decisions they make - eg, trading etc), comparing players to other players from same drafts (accounting for the other variables in play here too - eg, a draftee entering a strong team v a rebuilding team, positions etc), assessing the list make-up and quality, considering how far into the rebuild we are etc. The only objective measure would be to know what the 'decision-makers'' expectations are.

Frankly, I'd be shocked if the 'decision-makers' are happy with how things are tracking. The fact that they haven't come out and said they are happy with how we're going is enough evidence to assume they are not, imo.
 

Zlatan

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I’ve been trying to avoid similar thoughts because it’s scary to admit it but you’re unfortunately dead right. SOS completely f’ed up our recruitment. This list simply isn’t good enough. We’re closer to another rebuild than we are a premiership.
The biggest fu** up is the midfield.

Cripps, Curnow, Kennedy, Dow, Setterfield, Kemp, Stocker can only play on ball (regardless of where Teague throws them), Williams was told he’d get more midfield minutes and Walsh’s best position is on ball so you don’t want to waste him on the wings.

Way too much of an inside focus in this lot.
 

El Topo

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Jun 18, 2013
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The biggest fu** up is the midfield.

Cripps, Curnow, Kennedy, Dow, Setterfield, Kemp, Stocker can only play on ball (regardless of where Teague throws them), Williams was told he’d get more midfield minutes and Walsh’s best position is on ball so you don’t want to waste him on the wings.

Way too much of an inside focus in this lot.
Looking at GWS, I think the idea was that we'd develop a fleet of ball winning mids, and trade the surplus to keep the list ticking while we climbed the ladder and lost access to the top of the draft - of course, the strategy doesn't account for a coaching setup that wipes out the value of all but the most exceptional young midfielders
 

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Elmer_Judd

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If the club decides to get rid of Teague before or at the end of the season, I would take it as a sign that our current flag window is closed and time for yet another rebuild (Cripps leaving would certainly signify that)

We do not have a list capable of challenging for the flag. And the aging demographic is concerning me. SOS (in hindsight) took shortcuts in our rebuild and the list and now we are paying the price.

I am not yet ready to ready to write off Dow, but I think LOB was clearly a reach pick and one alas that will not work out for us (I wouldn't be surprised if he is traded at the end of the season)


Sacking Teague is not going to make us perform close to what so many perceived our best footy is, our list has more list in in than Swiss cheese.

Need a massive broom swept through it at the end of the season (no matter who is coaching in 2022)

Need to try get in as many 1st, 2nd and 3rd round picks into the club in the next few years as possible, build around Harry, Walsh and Weitering.
 

Jimmyonesix

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I'll throw a few names out there off the top of my head.
Mattner, Montgomery, Burns (no pun) Bassett, Harvey.
All assistants, all could have been possible appointments if a serious offer was put to them.
Yes but the above refers to not having a rookie coach -- Montgomery has big raps on him .. Was Harvey an assistant with us before ?
 

LemmingMaster

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Still not sure why we're are even close to considering sacking Teague.

I would be concerned by a number of other elements of the Blues. He needs more time and surround him with the appropriate mentors.
I would hope he has this year and at least a fair amount of next year before any real judgement is made. (Unless he is a complete disaster off field)
 

gab213

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Still not sure why we're are even close to considering sacking Teague.

I would be concerned by a number of other elements of the Blues. He needs more time and surround him with the appropriate mentors.
I would hope he has this year and at least a fair amount of next year before any real judgement is made. (Unless he is a complete disaster off field)

I'm pretty sure that the Club wouldn't be thinking in terms of sacking him, it's a BigFooty thing.
 

Jimmyonesix

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I'm pretty sure that the Club wouldn't be thinking in terms of sacking him, it's a BigFooty thing.
We have holes to fill in list and development getting the VFL side off the ground -- it would be negligent to sack coach now -- end 2022 mid 2023 we should see if he can coach or catch a bus
 

The Flying Doormat

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Yes but the above refers to not having a rookie coach -- Montgomery has big raps on him .. Was Harvey an assistant with us before ?
Assuming Judd's training wheels comment meant we were opting for a ready made coach (not necessarily an experienced senior coach), the names I put forward were, in my opinion, equal to or better credentialed than Teague. I suspect the 'feel good factor' and positive press on the back of a dead cat bounce post Bolton got Teague over the line.
 

smashbox gill

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fu** there is so much pressure on carlton to drop guys like murph cas and eddie. it will be interesting to see if teague and MC collapse under the pressure or continue doing what they've been doing.
I reckon he drops Casboult and then we go in without a 2nd ruck. That’s where Teague is at.

He won’t drop his mates Murph or Eddie imo
 

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