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Multiplat Destiny

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Blacky said:
I stand by my theory that they will bring in a lvl 33 VoG

The new raid is pretty crap, whereas the Vault is awesome

Really hope the new raid in HoW is good
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Agreed. From what I have seen so far VoG is so much more fun.
 
The first half of Crota is amazing and the final boss fight is great as well. The only weak section is the Wizard section.

The bridge section is probably the most impressive section that Bungie have put into the game.
 

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The Big Sauce said:
The first half of Crota is amazing and the final boss fight is great as well. The only weak section is the Wizard section.

The bridge section is probably the most impressive section that Bungie have put into the game.
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It's too short.

The shrieker run is weak.

The first part is amazing the first time, but pretty boring subsequently
 
Blacky said:
It's too short.

The shrieker run is weak.

The first part is amazing the first time, but pretty boring subsequently
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I agree on length and Shrieker run. But we're a lot better players than the first time we stepped into the vault, so it makes sense that we're able to be more efficient in mastering the second raid.

I don't find the first part boring at all even on repeat plays. I find Crota the right amount of challenging where he is beatable, but you don't really get glitch killed like was prevalent in the Atheon fight. It happens very occasionally, but they don't screw you too much there.
 
The Big Sauce said:
The first half of Crota is amazing and the final boss fight is great as well. The only weak section is the Wizard section.

The bridge section is probably the most impressive section that Bungie have put into the game.
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I think the boss fight is great in theory but they've failed in the execution. It's a sound idea - separating the dropping of the shield with actually doing damage to him, and forcing one person to do damage only - but in practice it's very much just a short, boring sequence of kill sword bearer, shoot Crota, watch sword bearer hit Crota (or if you're holding the sword, kill sword bearer, run to Crota, hit him a few times, run away). Rinse and repeat with some Ogres thrown in to inflate the difficulty and make it more of a tight squeeze before enrage.

I also think it's disappointing that the boss poses very little threat to you unless you're not paying attention. His projectiles are easy to dodge and he has no significant ranged attacks - unless you miss him moving to your area and get killed by his sword swipe, he's pretty much just a moving dartboard.

No arguments from me on the bridge section though. Superb.
 
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Dannnnnnnnnn said:
I think the boss fight is great in theory but they've failed in the execution. It's a sound idea - separating the dropping of the shield with actually doing damage to him, and forcing one person to do damage only - but in practice it's very much just a short, boring sequence of kill sword bearer, shoot Crota, watch sword bearer hit Crota (or if you're holding the sword, kill sword bearer, run to Crota, hit him a few times, run away). Rinse and repeat with some Ogres thrown in to inflate the difficulty and make it more of a tight squeeze before enrage.

No arguments from me on the bridge section though. Superb.
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If we're going down that path then Atheon is just shoot some oracles/supplicants, activate a portal and fire on a target that doesn't move around a lot whilst one person holds a shield up. Each are more nuanced than that considering the team work required but if we're over simplifying it then sure.

The sequence is about as long as an Atheon kill run and has the same amount of time before enrage as the Templar.

Atheon has been patched to throw in extra difficulty by randomising who gets teleported, which is cheaper than adding some ogres into the mix.

VoG is probably superior, but the final fight is definitely not.
 
The Big Sauce said:
If we're going down that path then Atheon is just shoot some oracles/supplicants, activate a portal and fire on a target that doesn't move around a lot whilst one person holds a shield up. Each are more nuanced than that considering the team work required but if we're over simplifying it then sure.

The sequence is about as long as an Atheon kill run and has the same amount of time before enrage as the Templar.

Atheon has been patched to throw in extra difficulty by randomising who gets teleported, which is cheaper than adding some ogres into the mix.

VoG is probably superior, but the final fight is definitely not.
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I'd argue that you're condensing the phases within the Atheon fight significantly more than I did with the Crota phases. Against Atheon you have to coordinate and successfully complete so much more than you do against Crota. Everybody has to be prepared to fill every single role and everybody needs to do them well multiple times. Inside the portal the rest of the team is at your mercy; fail to shoot the oracles quickly enough and everybody's dead. Die with the relic and everybody's dead. Don't wipe out the enemies in the middle quickly enough and everybody's dead. Fail to put up the shield quickly enough or in the right spot when you come back through the portal and everybody's dead. Outside the portal if you don't take out the Supplicants those coming through the portal are in enormous trouble - and if they die you may as well wipe. All the while ensuring you're at the right portal and you're keeping it open so those that were teleported can get back through. All of this is before even doing a point of damage to the boss - who shoots powerful projectiles (+ splash) at everybody once people are back through the portal. Then you have to repeat this all again and be prepared to fulfil any one of these roles.

Against Crota, the first thing that stands out is how powerless he is compared to Atheon. Every now and then he'll fire three small projectiles that do minimal splash and are pretty easy to dodge. As long as you stay away from him (pretty easy if you're actually watching the screen) he'll be lucky to touch you throughout the entire fight (unless you're the sword bearer). In terms of where we stand, Knights pose a huge threat and need to be taken out quickly or you risk the safety of the team. There are also smaller enemies - but not enough to pose any sort of significant risk unless you're being an idiot or, again, not watching (especially since, unless you're a sword bearer, you really have no reason to go downstairs and they can easily be taken out before they get up the stairs). Past that you shoot at a sword bearer until he dies, somebody picks up the sword, you shoot a bunch of rockets/sniper bullets into the boss (who doesn't move a whole lot), sword bearer hits him until he gets up. Repeat until he's dead. You're constrained by time and the Ogres are a threat, absolutely, but I don't think this is as impressive as the challenges posed by the Atheon fight. If somebody dies Oversoul breaks up your rhythm, but doesn't take a lot to take down if all five are focused on it - then you can revive the other person and get on with it.

I'm not saying the Crota fight is easy - it still requires a hell of a lot of coordination and understanding and it's at the right level of difficulty. I just think that the mechanics of it are lacklustre. Repeated sequences are fine if the sequences are interesting enough but I just don't find them that fantastic. Each to their own, but I'm not really a fan. Without the additional enemies the Crota fight would be a piece of cake and I don't think additional enemies should be the biggest challenge of a raid boss fight.
 
Dannnnnnnnnn said:
I'd argue that you're condensing the phases within the Atheon fight significantly more than I did with the Crota phases. Against Atheon you have to coordinate and successfully complete so much more than you do against Crota. Everybody has to be prepared to fill every single role and everybody needs to do them well multiple times. Inside the portal the rest of the team is at your mercy; fail to shoot the oracles quickly enough and everybody's dead. Die with the relic and everybody's dead. Don't wipe out the enemies in the middle quickly enough and everybody's dead. Fail to put up the shield quickly enough or in the right spot when you come back through the portal and everybody's dead. Outside the portal if you don't take out the Supplicants those coming through the portal are in enormous trouble - and if they die you may as well wipe. All the while ensuring you're at the right portal and you're keeping it open so those that were teleported can get back through. All of this is before even doing a point of damage to the boss - who shoots powerful projectiles (+ splash) at everybody once people are back through the portal. Then you have to repeat this all again and be prepared to fulfil any one of these roles.

Against Crota, the first thing that stands out is how powerless he is compared to Atheon. Every now and then he'll fire three small projectiles that do minimal splash and are pretty easy to dodge. As long as you stay away from him (pretty easy if you're actually watching the screen) he'll be lucky to touch you throughout the entire fight (unless you're the sword bearer). In terms of where we stand, Knights pose a huge threat and need to be taken out quickly or you risk the safety of the team. There are also smaller enemies - but not enough to pose any sort of significant risk unless you're being an idiot or, again, not watching (especially since, unless you're a sword bearer, you really have no reason to go downstairs and they can easily be taken out before they get up the stairs). Past that you shoot at a sword bearer until he dies, somebody picks up the sword, you shoot a bunch of rockets/sniper bullets into the boss (who doesn't move a whole lot), sword bearer hits him until he gets up. Repeat until he's dead. You're constrained by time and the Ogres are a threat, absolutely, but I don't think this is as impressive as the challenges posed by the Atheon fight. If somebody dies Oversoul breaks up your rhythm, but doesn't take a lot to take down if all five are focused on it - then you can revive the other person and get on with it.

I'm not saying the Crota fight is easy - it still requires a hell of a lot of coordination and understanding and it's at the right level of difficulty. I just think that the mechanics of it are lacklustre. Repeated sequences are fine if the sequences are interesting enough but I just don't find them that fantastic. Each to their own, but I'm not really a fan. Without the additional enemies the Crota fight would be a piece of cake and I don't think additional enemies should be the biggest challenge of a raid boss fight.
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TLDR.
 

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Raise your hand if you have defeated Crota.
Now keep your hand up if you have done it without cheesing.

Those emblems are pointless with the cheese :(
 

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tupperware said:
Man I miss playing so much I don't even care I don't get good drops.
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You can live vicariously through Seany and Scope tonight man
 
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