Opinion Did Taranto and Hopper make a mistake leaving the Giants for Richmond?

[nut]

Cameron helped geelong win a premiership. Taranto and hopper will be playing in a bottom four team costing them draft picks to rebuild with.

K

 

[BF Tiger]

We are a much improved team compared to last year though. IMO we would have been extremely lucky to make a GF last year. This year I think we're a legitimate flag chance.

In 2021 we were hit with one too many injuries and carrying a very sore group of core players and ultimately couldn't find the form necessary and fluked top 4.

I think the stats and form itself paints a very different picture for Brisbane in 2023 and have seen our coaching team are willing to make hard calls around senior players. We'll have to perform well in finals, but am confident we're building to do just that and think we're absolutely a contender for the flag this year if we do.

Are you much improved? You were 11-4 with a % of 127 last year, which is identical to this year. All four losses have been on the road. Surely you can see why opposition fans aren’t convinced yet.

 

[Orange Agent]

I think the decision was partly made for them. Taranto was not gonna get anything like the contract Richmond have given him and he is earning it, he would be leading their B&F by a mile. Hopper would have left as a FA after this year, so he was replaced by a draftee and freed up some cap. Even before he was drafted there was hints that he enjoyed the idea of being part of the Melb footy bubble and never wanted to sign a longer deal. Not sure what other options were available to them but staying wasn't really one of them.

 

[dean33]

Geez some terrible takes on here. Taranto has had a sensational season, up in the coaches votes, top 5 for the Brownlow and leading our bnf by a fair margin. Hopper has missed majority of the year so hard to judge. People on here speaking like these guys are 30 and have 2-3 years left. They are just entering their prime and here for another 7 years. Without these 2 our midfield would be Cotch, Prestia, Bolton and Dusty. We needed some mids in the mid 20’s age bracket as we had a glaring gap in our list. To say they were recruited for one last crack is fantasy stuff.
One bad loss and it’s all doom and gloom, big footy at its finest.

 

[BF Tiger]

Geez some terrible takes on here. Taranto has had a sensational season, up in the coaches votes, top 5 for the Brownlow and leading our bnf by a fair margin. Hopper has missed majority of the year so hard to judge. People on here speaking like these guys are 30 and have 2-3 years left. They are just entering their prime and here for another 7 years. Without these 2 our midfield would be Cotch, Prestia, Bolton and Dusty. We needed some mids in the mid 20’s age bracket as we had a glaring gap in our list. To say they were recruited for one last crack is fantasy stuff.
One bad loss and it’s all doom and gloom, big footy at its finest.

You forgot that we’re not going to be able to draft anyone before Tassie come in because we gave up a few picks five years before that happens.

 

[Nunez]

Are you much improved? You were 11-4 with a % of 127 last year, which is identical to this year. All four losses have been on the road. Surely you can see why opposition fans aren’t convinced yet.

We've also beaten Collingwood and Melbourne this year and are not conceding as much defensively. Last year we also fell off a cliff towards the end of the year due to some key senior players not pulling their weight and our coaches protecting them. This year we've been proactive as evidenced by dropping Rich & Gunston. We have also shown a willingness to adapt and play two talls instead of three. We also have Zorko ready to make an impact when needed and are ensuring he is 100% for for finals.

I get why you'd say that though purely looking at the W-L and %, but we've very clearly improved in areas that looked destined to cost us against good teams (and did) and are no longer afraid to make necessary changes to ensure we can compete for a flag come September.

 

[BF Tiger]

We've also beaten Collingwood and Melbourne this year and are not conceding as much defensively. Last year we also fell off a cliff towards the end of the year due to some key senior players not pulling their weight and our coaches protecting them. This year we've been proactive as evidenced by dropping Rich & Gunston. We have also shown a willingness to adapt and play two talls instead of three. We also have Zorko ready to make an impact when needed and are ensuring he is 100% for for finals.

I get why you'd say that though purely looking at the W-L and %, but we've very clearly improved in areas that looked destined to cost us against good teams (and did) and are no longer afraid to make necessary changes to ensure we can compete for a flag come September.

I hope for your sake you’re right, but one area where you have not improved is wins away from home. Both the Collingwood and Melbourne wins were at the Gabba.

Credit to Brisbane though in being braver with team selection.

 

[Nunez]

I hope for your sake you’re right, but one area where you have not improved is wins away from home. Both the Collingwood and Melbourne wins were at the Gabba.

Credit to Brisbane though in being braver with team selection.

To be fair Collingwood have only won against Adelaide (where Adelaide had a strong lead and ran out of puff) and the Eagles outside of Victoria.

Port have looked good in the H&A but they have a similar issue to Brisbane in September.

Melbourne have looked all over the shop but would back them to come good by finals.

Point being, winning away is hard and not exclusive to Brisbane, it just looks worse for interstate teams because we don't play the bulk of our games in Victoria.

 

[Warhorse]

No. They are making bank

 

[My Tilly]

Port have looked good in the H&A but they have a similar issue to Brisbane in September.

They are 5-5 in finals.
Brisbane are something like 3-6 since 2019.

 

[Nunez]

They are 5-5 in finals.
Brisbane are something like 3-6 since 2019.

We lost two by a point and neither team have gone on to make a GF. Let's put semantics aside.

 

[Giant Pete]

To be fair Collingwood have only won against Adelaide (where Adelaide had a strong lead and ran out of puff) and the Eagles outside of Victoria.

Port have looked good in the H&A but they have a similar issue to Brisbane in September.

Melbourne have looked all over the shop but would back them to come good by finals.

Point being, winning away is hard and not exclusive to Brisbane, it just looks worse for interstate teams because we don't play the bulk of our games in Victoria.

Is this a Brisbane thread?

 

[MisterMarcus]

So getting Cameron was a failed recruit in 2021?

If we hadn’t won the flag, I imagine a lot of people would be pushing that exact line.

You’re not the first team to try to squeeze every last drop from the orange, and you won’t be the last. Sometimes you get lucky and it works, sometimes it doesn’t.

 

[dean33]

If we hadn’t won the flag, I imagine a lot of people would be pushing that exact line.

You’re not the first team to try to squeeze every last drop from the orange, and you won’t be the last. Sometimes you get lucky and it works, sometimes it doesn’t.

So if these 2 win a flag with us in 5 years, it was a failure? Or 6 months into their 7 year contract they are failed recruits? Do you think taranto has had a good year?
I’ve been following this team since the early 80’s and he’s had the best start to a season for anyone we’ve recruited in that time. But a fail?

 

[nut]

If we hadn’t won the flag, I imagine a lot of people would be pushing that exact line.

You’re not the first team to try to squeeze every last drop from the orange, and you won’t be the last. Sometimes you get lucky and it works, sometimes it doesn’t.

Most times it doesn’t work … but both are fairly young so they’ll be there when our next young wave come through..
our 2021 draft looks like a ripper. Just need to keep the kids on the park.

 

[tiger_tough]

Richmond as a club are the ones that will loose out most from this. They were clearly on the decline and their premiership days were done for now and in need of a rebuild.

Now they’ve traded out 3 high draft picks which could have been the start of their rebuild.

Yes Taranto and Hopper are good players but I doubt they are around by time Richmond rebuild their list and are back in contention. They went all in for one last attempt when in reality, it had already passed them. Think these trades will only hurt Richmond long term similar (but not to the same extent) as the Kelly to WC trade.

Didnt West coast give up 3 first rounders for Kelly? We gave up 2 for both of them. Plus we clearly have alot more young-middle aged blokes than the eagles do/did. Terrible comparison.

Everyone saying TT and Hopper won't be around after the rebuild mustn't realise that we won't be doing a full bottom out rebuild. If Dimma had have pulled the pin after last season wed likely ve sitting in the 8 right now.

We have been taking multiple kids all the way through the dynasty years and have quite a few promising prospects and will have plenty of cash too splash in the next few years when the Lynch and Dusty deals are up plus cotchin, riewoldt, Grimes, prestia etc etc are retired. We will continue to be a destination club.

I dont see us bottoming out any time soon.

 

[tiger_tough]

Not a good time to be heading towards a rebuild with Tassie poised to compromise drafts soon. If you're gonna rebuild you better go hard starting with this year's trade period

Like when we built a dynasty list smack bang in the middle of the most compromised draft years in history when GC AND GWS were being introduced?

 

[tiger_tough]

It was a stroke of genius to turn Hopper and Taranto into picks that could get them players with any resemblance of good ball use.

Hoppers disposal is fine....

What's with you blokes? Get an opportunity to stick the boots into Richmond and you turn into morons.

 

[Nunez]

Hoppers disposal is fine....

What's with you blokes? Get an opportunity to stick the boots into Richmond and you turn into morons.

I've literally felt this way about Taranto since he was a Giant. I like Hopper but he is much too inconsistent both on the field and fitness wise for me to trust him as a player. I think the trade will ultimately benefit GWS more than the Tigers.

Sorry if my opinion which I've held before they played for Richmond hurt your sensitive feelings

 

[tiger_tough]

I've literally felt this way about Taranto since he was a Giant. I like Hopper but he is much too inconsistent both on the field and fitness wise for me to trust him as a player. I think the trade will ultimately benefit GWS more than the Tigers.

Sorry if my opinion which I've held before they played for Richmond hurt your sensitive feelings

Those concerns are fine. My point was Hoppers disposal is fine, good even for an inside mid. He was the only mid that played ok the other night and he was our leading goal scorer.

Taranto has never been a good user but the rest of his game is great and clearly a level above since he left gws.

Those saying they are too similar to each other aren't looking properly. Hopper has much more composure in congestion and has an excellent side step. Add Bolton's speed and agility and it SHOULD be a great mix but unfortunately our stoppage work has sucked for years under Hardwick and McQualter has been midfield coach so that is my biggest concern if Mini gets the job.

Time will tell who will benefit most long term but I'm stoked to have them on board amd have the midfield sorted for the next 7 years. I'd hate to think how bad we'd be without Taranto this year.

 

[windyhill]

Like when we built a dynasty list smack bang in the middle of the most compromised draft years in history when GC AND GWS were being introduced?

Hawthorn were the absolute winners out of those new teams being introduced.

 

[powerrrrrrrrrrrr]

Didnt West coast give up 3 first rounders for Kelly? We gave up 2 for both of them. Plus we clearly have alot more young-middle aged blokes than the eagles do/did. Terrible comparison.

Everyone saying TT and Hopper won't be around after the rebuild mustn't realise that we won't be doing a full bottom out rebuild. If Dimma had have pulled the pin after last season wed likely ve sitting in the 8 right now.

We have been taking multiple kids all the way through the dynasty years and have quite a few promising prospects and will have plenty of cash too splash in the next few years when the Lynch and Dusty deals are up plus cotchin, riewoldt, Grimes, prestia etc etc are retired. We will continue to be a destination club.

I dont see us bottoming out any time soon.

You obviously have a different view of your youth then Compared to how I see them. Outside of Bolton and Balta, I don’t see much else coming through for Richmond that they can build a team around. Have some C maybe B graders coming through but not enough that’s shown much yet that they can prevent a full list rebuild.

I just don’t see Taranto and Hopper being around once the list is challenging again. 2 firsts or 3 firsts is just splitting hairs. Taranto was for pick 12 and 19 while Hopper a future first which could be anything from 5-10. You paid a lot for those two when you have holes developing all over the list with all the upcoming retirements over the next couple years.

You’ve invested in those two now when you’re about to lose Riewoldt, Dusty, Grimes, Cotchin, lynch, Prestia, Tarrant, broad etc all within the next couple years. That’s a lot of holes to fill without the same quality coming through and now trading away top picks.

Richmond have been a champion team but from my view, they’ve tried to go hard one last time and it will bite them. I don’t think you can just base your rebuild on the fact you’ll have cash when these players go. That’s wishful thinking and it’s no guarantee you will get the players you need just because you have cash.

I also made the reference to being similar to WC only on the basis that they gave up multiple high picks to grab a player thinking they were still challenging. Not making the comparison saying Richmond are about to bottom out to their extent.

 

[Trav 20]

I just don’t see Taranto and Hopper being around once the list is challenging again.

Taranto is only 25.

How long before you think Richmond ''challenge again'' ?

 

[BF Tiger]

I've literally felt this way about Taranto since he was a Giant. I like Hopper but he is much too inconsistent both on the field and fitness wise for me to trust him as a player. I think the trade will ultimately benefit GWS more than the Tigers.

Sorry if my opinion which I've held before they played for Richmond hurt your sensitive feelings

Why would you think Hopper’s fitness is an ongoing issue? Through 2018 to 2021 he played 21, 23, 17 (Covid) and 23 games. Before season 2022 he suffered a knee injury, played round 1, reported soreness and further investigation saw him need surgery. He returned later in the year and played the last six games of the season.

He rolled an ankle in round 2 this year, which saw him miss round 3. He’s just now had a calf injury.

His stats also indicate a rather consistent output across his GWS years.

You clearly have NFI regarding his fitness and consistency, and were just attempting to throw shade on the Richmond trade by attempting to imply that he had concerns “fitness wise”. If you want throw shade stick to contract length, salary or draft picks given.

 

[powerrrrrrrrrrrr]

Taranto is only 25.

How long before you think Richmond ''challenge again'' ?

Same as most teams that need to go through a rebuild. 8-10 years.

Draft quality 18 year olds now, hit their prime at 25/26 and they will be contending again. By then, Taranto and Hopper are 33/34+ and either not going to be offering a huge amount or, on their way out.

Not many clubs have successfully managed the on the run rebuild or 2 year rebuild and been successful on the other end. History shows usually, it takes a solid chunk of time to get there again.