Do we need a Ruckman?

[specky mann]

Cain Ackland's a dud
Setanta O'Hailpin improving

So who's our ruckman

 

[Smell The Glove]

Aisake O'hAilpin, Shaun Hampson, Cameron Cloke......

 

[Salaryman]

Hammo to have a big pre-season...

Hammo, Cloke, Aisake, Carlos (pinch hitting).

 

[Pie_squasher]

F**kin oath we do!!!

 

[parrot]

Cain Ackland's a dud
Setanta O'Hailpin improving

So who's our ruckman

We'll be drafting Kruezer. We definitely don't need anymore rucks on our list. Ackland and Cloke are viewed as the stop-gap rucks, used while Hampson, Aisake and Kruezer are developing. I'm finding it hard to see Jacobs as having a future, with these 3 ahead of him. Ackland has received massive criticism from almost everyone. But to his credit, his performances actually improved under Ratten. The guy's problem is his attitude - can be very lazy, and loses focus, and gives away stupid free kicks. He actually does have some football ability though. Will be interesting to see how he goes under Ratten in 2008. He has a massive opportunity, being the #1 ruck for the most promising young side in the AFL, with Stevens and Judd in the middle, plus a heap of others. If that doesn't inspire him, nothing will. Cloke is interesting. His efforts early last year were surprising. he's not a tall ruck at 196cm, but his ruck technique is outstanding. Hard to see Cloke and Ackland surviving long with the emergence of our talented young 200cm rucks. These guys will really have to step up, and perhaps reinvent themselves in other role in order to be part of the list in the future.

 

[Pamam]

for some reason i have a feeling Cloke may pinch hit as CHF for most of the games and then go in ruck if we really need him!!

considering he is a decent mark and strong, he may play that role next season!

 

[thylacine60]

for some reason i have a feeling Cloke may pinch hit as CHF for most of the games and then go in ruck if we really need him!!

considering he is a decent mark and strong, he may play that role next season!

. I'll say it again, CC is the loose cannon who will surprise everyone next season. His efforts to play on when concussed confirmed his courage and determination to give it all for the guernsey. Has a booming, accurate kick and is a canny ruckman. Lets not forget his spoon feeding of Stevo early last year. Mark my words if he stays on the park he will be an important addition to the setup of the team.

 

[Aussie Joe]

for some reason i have a feeling Cloke may pinch hit as CHF for most of the games and then go in ruck if we really need him!!

considering he is a decent mark and strong, he may play that role next season!

I feel that Kruezer will be playing that role.

 

[Salaryman]

We'll be drafting Kruezer. We definitely don't need anymore rucks on our list. Ackland and Cloke are viewed as the stop-gap rucks, used while Hampson, Aisake and Kruezer are developing. I'm finding it hard to see Jacobs as having a future, with these 3 ahead of him. Ackland has received massive criticism from almost everyone. But to his credit, his performances actually improved under Ratten. The guy's problem is his attitude - can be very lazy, and loses focus, and gives away stupid free kicks. He actually does have some football ability though. Will be interesting to see how he goes under Ratten in 2008. He has a massive opportunity, being the #1 ruck for the most promising young side in the AFL, with Stevens and Judd in the middle, plus a heap of others. If that doesn't inspire him, nothing will. Cloke is interesting. His efforts early last year were surprising. he's not a tall ruck at 196cm, but his ruck technique is outstanding. Hard to see Cloke and Ackland surviving long with the emergence of our talented young 200cm rucks. These guys will really have to step up, and perhaps reinvent themselves in other role in order to be part of the list in the future.

That's a reasonable guess Parrot , but if you'd seen the kids play you'd realise that it isn't as clear cut as that and Cotchin is highly rated, make no mistake about that

 

[sunwin]

Cain Ackland's a dud
Setanta O'Hailpin improving

So who's our ruckman

Setanta O'Hailpin should not be in the Ruck !!!! he needs to settle in the backline

 

[johno_1989]

Sam jacobs should get a run

 

[Pamam]

I feel that Kruezer will be playing that role.

maybe after a season, but dont expect the kid to light up season 08 and play every game... he will be eased into it like all ruckman should!!

 

[parrot]

maybe after a season, but dont expect the kid to light up season 08 and play every game... he will be eased into it like all ruckman should!!

I wouldn't be suprised if he starts Round 1 - most #1 picks do. Will probably be rotated between the forwardline, and helping out the 2nd ruck.

 

[Jeremias]

I'll go by the assumption that we will be drafting Kreuzer, which is a pretty safe assumption to make IMO.

Next year, that means we'll have:

1st ruck: Cam Cloke
2nd ruck: Hammo
3rd: Ackland
4th: Aisake
5th: Kreuzer
6th: Jacobs (rookie list)

That is more than enough. Ackland will be gone in the next few years, and Cloke still has major question marks on him, even though he was very good for us prior to injury last year.

Cloke can play CHF at times too, and I expect to see him there a bit in season 2008.

I think Kreuzer's development will mirror that of Leuenberger this year-won't start in the seniors, but should be playing just after the mid season break. Want to see him perform well in the Bullants before we see him in the senior team.

Aisake could well be the wild card. I don't think that it will happen, but it wouldn't surprise me to see him start the season in the seniors. Would have played the 2nd half of season 2007 if not for injuries, so he certainly isn't far off.

Ackland should be banished to the Bullants for the entire year, only coming in if we are struck down by injuries. Jacobs to spend the year in the Bullants, and try and work his way onto the senior list for season 2009.

If we take Kreuzer, we won't need to worry about our rucks for a while. I'm confident that Hammo will be something pretty special, and Aisake could be a surprise packet. Add Kreuzer to that, and we have 3 ruckmen for the next 10 years.

 

[Mayesy_23]

Ruck pecking order next season:
Cloke
Hampson
Aisake
Kreuzer
Ackland

Ruck pecking order 2010
Kreuzer
Hampson
Aisake
Cloke (if he's still here)
Ackland (gawn)

 

[Salaryman]

Do We need another developing Ruckman on our list - Yes

Do we desperately need to take one this draft at the expense of Cotchin - Not IMO.

 

[HBF]

Ruck pecking order next season:
Cloke
Hampson
Aisake
Kreuzer
Ackland

Ruck pecking order 2010
Kreuzer
Hampson
Aisake
Cloke (if he's still here)
Ackland (gawn)

Should we be able to develop either Austin or Jamison into a FB, then this could free up Carlos to pinch hit in the ruck as well.

Given the midfield we are going to have next year, whilst a gun young ruckman would be great, another young midfielder (Cotchin) would complete our midfield puzzle, and leave us with a future A-Grade midfield that would be the envy of every other team in the AFL for the next 10+ years.

 

[Captain_Knowall]

Good thread, i was thinkin the same thing myself... Ratts has a good opinion of Hampson and although Ackland is ordinary can play in the ruck while Hampson developes....

You can never have too many midfielders and i don't think you should use number 1 picks on ruckmen... Josh Fraser was the last one and he's handy but no superstar...

On Cam Cloke, does anyone think he could play CHB? I'd like to see him play there (or given a chance there anyway), Setanta at FB... allows Thornton to play a floating role and Waite can play forward....

 

[Artie Bucco]

Good thread, i was thinkin the same thing myself... Ratts has a good opinion of Hampson and although Ackland is ordinary can play in the ruck while Hampson developes....

You can never have too many midfielders and i don't think you should use number 1 picks on ruckmen... Josh Fraser was the last one and he's handy but no superstar...

On Cam Cloke, does anyone think he could play CHB? I'd like to see him play there (or given a chance there anyway), Setanta at FB... allows Thornton to play a floating role and Waite can play forward....

I'd rather shuffle the backline so we can get game time into Austin or Jamison.

For me Jamison looked awesome for his first few games, wore his opponent like a glove. Stopped Lloyd from kicking 10 even though he kicked around 6, Lloyd was gifted a couple of easy goals.

As I've said before I think we should be going for the Cloke & Aisake combo for now, I don't think Hampson is ready, unless he has a monster pre-season.

Still the stats will show you most will not be ready at his age

 

[bluekidjoe]

Next year:
Cloke
Hampson
Ackland
Aisake
Kreuzer

2009:
Hampson
Kreuzer
Aisake
Cloke
Ackland

2010 (premiership year) :
Kreuzer
Hampson
Aisake
Cloke (bullants/delisted)
Ackland (gone)

 

[blues4flag]

Yes we do.

ATM the moment we've got:
Ackland: Huge mistake signing him for 2/3 years. Won't be here in two years.
Cloke: Undersized for a ruckman - really just a stopgap, not a ruckman you'd want in a contenders side. Not to mention the shoulders. Expect he'll be our number one ruckman this year, but beyond that, I can't see him being in the firsts past 2009.
Setanta: Decent enough in the ruck - but hopefully we keep him as a key defender.
Jacobs: Lacks mobility - playing in the wrong era, IMO. Has it against him.
Aisake: Huge potential as a ruckman, but is still untried. Hopefully he'll get a chance at AFL level next year.
Hampson: Another with huge potential and showed it when given a chance at AFL level. Like Aisake, still has a long way to go and is a bit of an unknown.

So, by my reckoning, that leaves 2 ruckmen on our list who have what it takes to be career ruckmen at AFL level - and both are very much speculative. Getting Kreuzer gives us a very solid prospect in the position and sures up our ruck stocks. Those three as our ruckmen is a very enticing prospect going into the future, IMO.

As for Cotchin - he's a midfielder. Gun midfielders are very common, much more so than ruckmen. We will have a shot at a quality midfielder next year - looking back at the drafts, some of the mids that were picked up in the top 20:
2000: Shaun Burgoyne (12), Daniel Harris (14), Scott Thompson (16), Daniel Kerr (18), Kane Cornes (20)
2001: Jimmy Bartel (8), Brent Reilly (12), Nick Dal Santo (13), James Kelly (17)
2002: Steven Salopek (6), Jason Winderlich (11), Troy Selwood (19)
2003: Brock Mclean (5), Brent Stanton (13), Sam Butler (20)
2004: Jordan Lewis (7), Angus Monfries (14)
2005: Scott Pendelbury (5), Shaun Higgins (11), Nathan Jones (12), Shannon Hurn (13)
2006: Travis Boak (5), Joel Selwood (7) - a number of others, still untried
As can be seen, every year there'll be a least a couple of gun mids in the second half of the first round/early second round. If the club believes we need another star midfielder, why not go after one next year?

 

[Bluebear]

. I'll say it again, CC is the loose cannon who will surprise everyone next season. His efforts to play on when concussed confirmed his courage and determination to give it all for the guernsey. Has a booming, accurate kick and is a canny ruckman. Lets not forget his spoon feeding of Stevo early last year. Mark my words if he stays on the park he will be an important addition to the setup of the team.

Accurate?
That's a stretch.

 

[Faz 2000]

What blues4flag said.

 

[Salaryman]

Yes we do.

ATM the moment we've got:
Ackland: Huge mistake signing him for 2/3 years. Won't be here in two years.
Cloke: Undersized for a ruckman - really just a stopgap, not a ruckman you'd want in a contenders side. Not to mention the shoulders. Expect he'll be our number one ruckman this year, but beyond that, I can't see him being in the firsts past 2009.
Setanta: Decent enough in the ruck - but hopefully we keep him as a key defender.
Jacobs: Lacks mobility - playing in the wrong era, IMO. Has it against him.
Aisake: Huge potential as a ruckman, but is still untried. Hopefully he'll get a chance at AFL level next year.
Hampson: Another with huge potential and showed it when given a chance at AFL level. Like Aisake, still has a long way to go and is a bit of an unknown.

So, by my reckoning, that leaves 2 ruckmen on our list who have what it takes to be career ruckmen at AFL level - and both are very much speculative. Getting Kreuzer gives us a very solid prospect in the position and sures up our ruck stocks. Those three as our ruckmen is a very enticing prospect going into the future, IMO.

As for Cotchin - he's a midfielder. Gun midfielders are very common, much more so than ruckmen. We will have a shot at a quality midfielder next year - looking back at the drafts, some of the mids that were picked up in the top 20:
2000: Shaun Burgoyne (12), Daniel Harris (14), Scott Thompson (16), Daniel Kerr (18), Kane Cornes (20)
2001: Jimmy Bartel (8), Brent Reilly (12), Nick Dal Santo (13), James Kelly (17)
2002: Steven Salopek (6), Jason Winderlich (11), Troy Selwood (19)
2003: Brock Mclean (5), Brent Stanton (13), Sam Butler (20)
2004: Jordan Lewis (7), Angus Monfries (14)
2005: Scott Pendelbury (5), Shaun Higgins (11), Nathan Jones (12), Shannon Hurn (13)
2006: Travis Boak (5), Joel Selwood (7) - a number of others, still untried
As can be seen, every year there'll be a least a couple of gun mids in the second half of the first round/early second round. If the club believes we need another star midfielder, why not go after one next year?

I never trust stats plucked out like this.....it only tells one side of the story.

We have pick #36 after #1.........I could pluck out some guns that were taken at #36.....Chapman was #35....i could also pluck out 15 names that were duds at #35/36


Edit: If we had of kept pick #20 I would be much more comfortable taking Kreuzer at #1 as I was confident of picking up a good mid at #20.....#36 in this draft I would put a blindfld on and throw datrs at a list of names

 

[specky mann]

We might not get kruzer because he might not come 1st in the draft, but we shaw could use him