Preview Does Carlton's finals hope hinge on the result of the round 1 clash with Richmond ???

[celtic_pride]

Silly thread really....

Round 1, round 6, round 20...they all matter to make the finals, unless you haven't lost any games by about rnd 15!

I have no idea why you would want to focus on rnd 1 in regards to making the finals, other than it is the first and foremost game in your mind.

Pretty simple equation: to play finals, 12 wins+ req'd...no extra points for wins rnd 1, 6, 10 etc etc

It's simple really, we lose to Richmond, we don't deserve to make the finals, simple as that, and yes it's extreme to just single out one game, but consideirng the rough draw head (and conciveably we could be 1-7 or 2-6 after the first 8 rounds) I think it's a legitimate question.

BTW I never said Carlton would lose to Richmond, I only asked a hypothetical question as to what would happen if we lost ...

I wish people would actually answer my OP in an mature and sensible manner, to the way it was presented instead of resorting to 'Helen Lovejoy' typical hysterics ...

 

[CrippsonBlue]

So you are using the logic that because Richmond are a worse team than us, we might take them lightly, and their 'nothing to lose' mentality may cause an upset.

Why can't you use that logic for when we play the Saints, Cats, Crows etc.?

I think one thing we can guarantee this season is that we will lose a match we were expecting to win, however we will also win a match we were expecting to lose.

Individual matches in isolation mean nothing - you are right, there are two teams, someone has to win, sometimes it will be the underdog...

 

[celtic_pride]

So you are using the logic that because Richmond are a worse team than us, we might take them lightly, and their 'nothing to lose' mentality may cause an upset.

Why can't you use that logic for when we play the Saints, Cats, Crows etc.?

I think one thing we can guarantee this season is that we will lose a match we were expecting to win, however we will also win a match we were expecting to lose.

Individual matches in isolation mean nothing - you are right, there are two teams, someone has to win, sometimes it will be the underdog...

Yes that is true, but I am also pointing out the fact the Vultures in the media are going to swoop on Carlton's Carcuss if we lose to the Tigers ...

I don't think a lot of fans realise just how deflating losing to Richmond will be ???

Personally I think they are a team full of inbred, unskilled hacks that should lose by 12 plus goals each week and win the spoon, however in the very unlikely scenerio we lose to them, how the media and a lot of fans will react to the loss will be extreme.

Personally I think right now Carlton talent wise are about par as the likes of North Melbourne, Essendon and Sydney ...

 

[CrippsonBlue]

Yes that is true, but I am also pointing out the fact the Vultures in the media are going to swoop on Carlton's Carcuss if we lose to the Tigers ...

I don't think a lot of fans realise just how deflating losing to Richmond will be ???

I think our tough start to the year will obviously cause a lot of negativity from the football community (and supporters) if we were to lose the one match we are expected to win.

It will be a very long week if we do lose, but so long as the players keep the faith, then I won't be worrying too much.

Our best response would be an upset win over the Lions, and if that happened, I think the Tigers loss would be forgotten instantly - we will be a hard team to read in the first half of the season, I think we just have to expect up and down results.

Losing to Richmond won't mean we don't deserve finals - we will prove our worth over the season, and whatever the result, it will be long forgotten come round 22. (Hmm, well so to speak)

 

[brazilblue]

Have to agree with Celtic here ... yes the season is 22 rounds and teams have come back from an embarassing loss etc ... BUT ...

This is a young team that plays on momentum. If Bitchmond would have smashed us the first game of last year instead of the other way round and kept Richardson on the park do you think they would have had such a cr@p season? They're season died first game last year so why can it not happen to us?

Its hard to say but if we cannot beat the Tuggers (and by a reasonable margin) in RD 1
then I think it is safe to say we will struggle to beat anyone until the problems that made us lose in RD 1 are rectified (which will take time as the reason would probably be that we need some spark in the forward line).

If we can pump the Tuggers, it may well give us the momentum to do well the next few rds and give us an acceptable win/loss record after 9 rds.

People can say what they like but confidence is an amazing thing exspecially for a young side. We lose and our young squad will be demoralised, we win by a healthy margin and they will be like ... lets go to Brisbane and tear Brendon a new one (which we will).

Agree with me or disagree, its all good ... just hope the boys are as switched on in RD 1 this year as they were last year.

Putting my hard earned on Carlton being on top of the ladder after RD 1 personally.

We will make The Tuggers our biatch!

 

[Blues_FC]

The OP is right in a way... it certainly is going to be an uphill climb if we start the year off losing the matches we should win. Given how hard out first couple of months are going to be (opposition wise), we really can't afford to lose to any of the shitty teams.

I think a 10 goal drubbing of Richmond would be just the confidence booster that we need to kick-start 2010. I don't think we should get complacent though.

 

[Mister Carlton]

Red Card.. lawl.

 

[ctacp]

You might remember what happened in 1995 CP (oh wait, you were following Geelong then weren't you?). Actually you'd be pretty familiar with how Carlton went that year, we beat you if i recall correctly...

Anyway, that year Carlton won 23 games and dropped only 2... they were in consecutive weeks and we lost to 2 rabble teams in Sydney & St Kilda by over 10 goals a piece. You'd have thought by your logic that we'd have not made the finals because we lost against 2 shit teams at the time right? Right?

Well.. wrong...

- we dont have a kernahan up forward or even a brad pearce or earl spalding for that matter & we dont have a SOS, Christou or dean down back. no diesel, bradley, brown or a fit kouta running thru the middle. oh & we dont yet have a ruckman who consistantly wins taps to his midfielders like we had in harry.
comparing our current list to one of the best all over teams ever is crazy. yes we have some highly rated players but really we are a bit off being finals certainties year in year out like a geelong.

Should still beat the young tiges team though.

ctacp
curlier than a catoggio pube

 

[parrot]

We don't have "finals hopes", we have "premiership objectives". Making the finals for the sake of it, and bailing is failure and a weak objective. The goal of the H&A is to get a good finals position, with a fit in form list to have a tilt at the flag.

 

[Big Red is back]

I know this is perhaps a ridiculous call before the season has kicked off in anger, however this clash against the Tigers is a massive, massive clash for the Blues, if we lose this game (and lets face it, it is a possiblilty, a small and very unpleasent one, but a possibility nevertheless) would it be an reasonable to assume we're in for a long season and finals would be out of the equation if we can't beat the rabble that is Richmond ???

For the record I am not tipping Carlton to lose, think we should be good enough to win with 4 or 5 goals to spare (I don't think we'll see a repeat of the rnd 1 massacre last year though) but there is this horrible feeling in the back of my mind, that a loss to Richmond, and it might as well be curtains for the Blues (in terms of serious finals contenders) for 2010, especially if you look at the difficult draw coming up in the next 6 or so matches after the Tigers ... I know this might be an inconvinient and somewhat absurd question, but if we did somehow lose to the Tigers, does anyone honestly believe we can still make the finals ???

The race for the 8 is going to be very tight this year, and I think you'd need at least 12, if not 13 wins to make the finals in 2010, so we cannot afford to lose any games to crap sides like Richmond.

If we lose to Richmond I can guarantee you we will 100% not mak the 8.

In fact if we lose to Richmond it will be a sure sign we are in for a shocker of a year. They are a side who has gone into a complete rebuild, who has not even been competitive in the preaseason with a new game plan.

In fact Ratten will not last to June if we lost this as we would be at best 1/2 wins by the middle of June.

For the record given we won 13 games last year and should improve with the inclusion of Warnock, Jamo, Mclean combining with the development of our youth.

BLUES BY 37 POINTS.

 

[BlueTouchPaper]

This is certainly one of my 'hypotheticals'.

'If we don't beat Richmond, we won't make it'

'If we can win three games against Collingwood and Essendon, we'll make the 8.'

Also, it's pretty hard having a 8 day break following what would be a humiliating loss.
Young groups thrive on confidence, and another belting would be just the tonic for this off-season mess.

 

[CrippsonBlue]

If we lose to Richmond I can guarantee you we will 100% not mak the 8

Of course you can

 

[Go_Blues!]

- we dont have a kernahan up forward or even a brad pearce or earl spalding for that matter & we dont have a SOS, Christou or dean down back. no diesel, bradley, brown or a fit kouta running thru the middle. oh & we dont yet have a ruckman who consistantly wins taps to his midfielders like we had in harry.
comparing our current list to one of the best all over teams ever is crazy. yes we have some highly rated players but really we are a bit off being finals certainties year in year out like a geelong.

Should still beat the young tiges team though.

ctacp
curlier than a catoggio pube

WTF. Please read the post you were quoting (which was not mine). The guy was directly answering the question from the OP.....that in all football seasons there are surprises. StK and Syd beat us in '95 when we were clearly a great team and they were shite. So yes, Richmond have some statistical chance of beating us. But most of us won't jump out of windows if they do (or at least not very hight ones). But in anycase....well, if I was a troll, I might spend some time trying to prepare a team for the embarasment of what might happen if you lose.....I respect that. CP is certainly a troll. but what I had not considered is that he may be a good troll by thinking about what might hurt the most

 

[Go_Blues!]

If we lose to Richmond I can guarantee you we will 100% not mak the 8.

In fact if we lose to Richmond it will be a sure sign we are in for a shocker of a year. They are a side who has gone into a complete rebuild, who has not even been competitive in the preaseason with a new game plan.

In fact Ratten will not last to June if we lost this as we would be at best 1/2 wins by the middle of June.

For the record given we won 13 games last year and should improve with the inclusion of Warnock, Jamo, Mclean combining with the development of our youth.

BLUES BY 37 POINTS.

Look, I dont spend much time on this board, so I don't know what you have said in the past....but man, that is one crazy thing to say. Our list is what we have, we go into this season with hope and you are saying that if we lose the first game you "guarentee" we will not make the eight.....ummmm.......when was the last time a finalist lost the first game of the year to the team that came last??? In any case, I think you are probably more nice than smart....and you aint that nice

 

[dumb]

i wouldn't say it hinges on it, though it would definitely knock the confidence... but we have the sort of middle-of-the-road team that makes me think sometime this year reality will be handed to us by someone underneath us on the ladder. be it richmond first round or someone later.

 

[Big Red is back]

Look, I dont spend much time on this board, so I don't know what you have said in the past....but man, that is one crazy thing to say. Our list is what we have, we go into this season with hope and you are saying that if we lose the first game you "guarentee" we will not make the eight.....ummmm.......when was the last time a finalist lost the first game of the year to the team that came last??? In any case, I think you are probably more nice than smart....and you aint that nice

Look in the end we will win, but should we lose I will happily have a $1,000 bet with anyone that we will miss the 8.

Richmond are an absolute basket case and i expect them to win 1 to 3 games, most likely 1 against Melbourne and potentially another against an interstate side mid season in melb.

I am expecting the quality sides to stroll past them at 50% effort, they have one of the worst lists in living memory.

 

[buddys"girl]

we will pump those w***ers at punt rd and march into the finals

 

[CrippsonBlue]

Look in the end we will win, but should we lose I will happily have a $1,000 bet with anyone that we will miss the 8

What supporter would "happily" bet against us making the finals after round 1?

 

[Dramoth]

What supporter would "happily" bet against us making the finals after round 1?

Someone who isnt a true supporter maybe

 

[Bluebear]

BTW I didn't say we'd lose to Richmond, I am tipping us to win by around 4-5 goals, but I am simply asking the question of how you'd think we'd go for the rest of the year if Carlton lost to Richmond ...
I think a lot of fans would be upset and become cynical about our chances for the rest of the season if we lost to the Tigers, wouldn't you agree ???

Yes..........some are cynical now.......some pessimistic (if that's what you actually mean by cynical).......others will remain optimistic even if we are 0 and 10 with the hope of winning our last 12 and storming home.

What's your point?

Are you asking in the OP if we, as the Tiges did last year, lose the first game that we would go to water and write off the season?

especially if you look at the difficult draw coming up in the next 6 or so matches after the Tigers ... I know this might be an inconvinient and somewhat absurd question, but if we did somehow lose to the Tigers, does anyone honestly believe we can still make the finals ???

I have posted elsewhere that I think we need to win 2 of the first 3 to make the finals, and that inclucdes the Tigers. That doesn't automatically read that if we lose to them that we cannot make the finals.

Take last year for example. How many of us pencilled in wins vs The Cats at the G? None, yet we picked that up. Teams vary, form varies, and injuries can be a bitch. If the Saints lost Riewoldt they would have some serious problems scoring. I could go on. So the answer is......who knows. We shouldn't have beaten the Dons in the 99 prelim based on previous form........the Dees shouldn't hae beaten us in the 2000 QF based on form...............it goes on.

The more you post this crap the more you expose yourself as one of two things........either a troll or an idiot. I think the former, and judging by the card you got, the mods probably think so to.

The race for the 8 is going to be very tight this year, and I think you'd need at least 12, if not 13 wins to make the finals in 2010, so we cannot afford to lose any games to crap sides like Richmond.

Funnily enough the years where the "race" has been tight are usually the ones where fewer wins gets you in..........11 and % might pinch 8 this year with the Saints, Cats and Dogs winning a lot of games.

 

[Big Red is back]

What supporter would "happily" bet against us making the finals after round 1?

Will ease the pain of us missing.

Not a true supporter give me a break I have been going to 90% of the games for 20 years and spend $600+ a year on various memberships.

 

[Blues_FC]

I think it's a bit harsh to red card CP over this.

I know he's rubbed a lot of people up the wrong way, and can concentrate on the negative side too often, but...

I don't think it hurts to have a devil's advocate on the board, to provoke discussion and to ask some hard questions that more "patriotic" Carlton supporters don't want to talk about.

 

[Sin City]

Check C_P's posting history, especially his most recent ones, you might get a better idea of why it was carded.

 

[Bee]

I think it's a bit harsh to red card CP over this.

I know he's rubbed a lot of people up the wrong way, and can concentrate on the negative side too often, but...

I don't think it hurts to have a devil's advocate on the board, to provoke discussion and to ask some hard questions that more "patriotic" Carlton supporters don't want to talk about.

He wasn't carded over this thread. The card was for a different reason.

 

[The Coach]

Check C_P's posting history, especially his most recent ones, you might get a better idea of why it was carded.

Yep, wandered into that place they call Bay 13 yesterday and saw his crime sheet and fully understood the Red. Was tempted to stop sticking up for his rights on here even but then decided what he does in the Bay is his business

PS If you have proof that he does not support Carlton nowadays then pm me and save me from supporting a troll