Society/Culture Feminism part 1 - continued in part 2

[romeohwho]

Why are we talking about DemonTim's private life.

Cheifs statement that I should listen to the women in my life was just the stanard hatefilled trash that means nothing which he spreads in this thread. It cannot be supported by any logical reason whatsoever.

Just because Chief can't understand why he is wrong, or that others, including women, have different viewpoints than him isn't a reason to interrogate DT on his private life.

DemonTim introduced his private life in order to support a point-as imo, he hadn't made that point quite clear, I sought clarity. ( e.g. re the nature of offensive comments in the workplace and differing responses to them). All good now thanks Flowers!

 

[Chief]

Cheifs statement that I should listen to the women in my life was just the stanard hatefilled trash

So suggesting you find out more about what women go through day to day is "hate-filled trash"?

I suggest your ideas on what constitutes "hate" are malformed.

 

[Chief]

It annoys me, I don't expect action from her behalf on it, she treats them as she would anyone else at the club. It's all about trust mate. Their behavior annoys me, but I don't expect any change, since i know it's going nowhere. Irrational momentary jealousy if you will

I don't mean to pry beyond anything you don't want to reveal. I hope you understand that. I'm just trying to understand your argument, your life and where you're coming from.

Does your girlfriend think her workplace would be better or worse if these unwelcome advances didn't take place?

 

[DemonTim]

I don't mean to pry beyond anything you don't want to reveal. I hope you understand that. I'm just trying to understand your argument, your life and where you're coming from.

Does your girlfriend think her workplace would be better or worse if these unwelcome advances didn't take place?

It's part of her rapport with players. She jokes with players (and gets jokes made at her), and feels more like she's part of the group than an outsider. Without explicitly stating it, I'd say she thinks it'd be worse based on that.

 

[Chief]

It's part of her rapport with players. She jokes with players (and gets jokes made at her), and feels more like she's part of the group than an outsider. Without explicitly stating it, I'd say she thinks it'd be worse based on that.

That's interesting.

 

[DemonTim]

That's interesting.

It seems to be most of the girls who work with the footy players feel that way from what she says. The netballers are already a big part of the club, so they're close to most. But club employees seem to think they're outsiders to begin with, because they don't take the field. Jokes are made by the players, but they're not malicious, there's a definite care from the players
When they found out me and her were dating it was made well aware what would happen to me if I did something to hurt her.
Maybe it's different because the club is a bit of a family and she sees them all the time. Whereas mel and Gayle were near enough to strangers. But she's said from day 1 she was treated like everyone else and that put her at ease

 

[ShanDog]

My wife is a pastry chef and is by nature a reserved person who doesn't appreciate lewdness in any form. Her workmates are all very good guys but very prone to very dirty and/or lewd talk in the kitchen. From what she has told me, they go above and beyond the sort of stuff I hear in Army.

Because she is genuinely friends with the guys though, she has actually changed her standards and behaviour to be more accepting of it and actually fires it back a bit too.

I'm not really arguing any particular point but just bringing this up as a bit of an anecdote. Sometimes I think about not really appreciating the culture they have there, but its probably just me feeling protective of my wife who is more than capable of looking out for herself and making her own decisions. Other times I think it's good that they are bringing out a bit of a rough edge in her lol.

 

[Lebbo73]

Goodes booing wasn't racist either.

In the majority of cases it wasn't. The other hilarious part to it was that he retired due to the booing. Of course it had nothing to do with the fact that he was over the hill and played on a season or two too long!

 

[skipper kelly]

In the majority of cases it wasn't. The other hilarious part to it was that he retired due to the booing. Of course it had nothing to do with the fact that he was over the hill and played on a season or two too long!

He played OK last season. Will be sorely missed this year.

 

[Lester Burnham]

So called feminists seem to devote much of their attention and outrage to relatively trivial issues such as a cricketer inviting a TV interviewer for a drink.

Meanwhile in several cities in Germany this week there was an extremely worrying development where gangs of up to 1000 young men carried out organised sexual attacks on women in the streets.

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-35237173

 

[Lebbo73]

So called feminists seem to devote much of their attention and outrage to relatively trivial issues such as a cricketer inviting a TV interviewer for a drink.

Meanwhile in several cities in Germany this week there was an extremely worrying development where gangs of up to 1000 young men carried out organised sexual attacks on women in the streets.

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-35237173

Did I hear that having open borders led to these attacks? Oh my goodness. Who would of thought!

 

[DemonTim]

So called feminists seem to devote much of their attention and outrage to relatively trivial issues such as a cricketer inviting a TV interviewer for a drink.

Meanwhile in several cities in Germany this week there was an extremely worrying development where gangs of up to 1000 young men carried out organised sexual attacks on women in the streets.

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-35237173

The response will be "we can concentrate on many issues at once"
Yet, they'll sit around posting on Facebook about Chris Gayle and abusing people. While doing nothing further to promote equality (note this is not a reference to all feminists before I'm attacked, it's a reference to the radical Facebook 'feminists')

 

[Lester Burnham]

Did I hear that having open borders led to these attacks? Oh my goodness. Who would of thought!

Angela Merkel expressed her outrage "over these disgusting attacks and sexual assaults".

Hundreds of thousands of young men arriving without ID and character checks from countries with cultures where women are second class citizens. What could possibly go wrong?

 

[Juddy88]

So called feminists seem to devote much of their attention and outrage to relatively trivial issues such as a cricketer inviting a TV interviewer for a drink.

Meanwhile in several cities in Germany this week there was an extremely worrying development where gangs of up to 1000 young men carried out organised sexual attacks on women in the streets.

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-35237173

You do realise that but your logic, no one can ever really be "outraged" by anything? Why worry about the one punch death of the kid ther other day when a father murdered his two children and committed suicide? Why worry about that when there are many gun deaths in the US everyday? Why worry about that when there is mass rape and murder in African countries? The list goes on for infinity.

Or, you know, people could be concerned with multiple things, and be concerned with what they are concerned with without people questioning their morals.

The only reason you are seeing more of the Chris Gayle incident is because it is much more localised and easier to relate to. It's well known that the media have always focused on events that hit closer to home and have more emotional pull. Whether that's right or not is another question, but it's got nothing to do with whether anyone cares about one incident more than another, and to suggest so is extremely ignorant.

Also , I'm not sure what you are reading, but there is plenty of empathy, distress, and concern about what is happening in Germany from what I've seen.

 

[Chief]

So called feminists seem to devote much of their attention and outrage to relatively trivial issues such as a cricketer inviting a TV interviewer for a drink.

Meanwhile in several cities in Germany this week there was an extremely worrying development where gangs of up to 1000 young men carried out organised sexual attacks on women in the streets.

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-35237173

Your appeal to worse problems is noted. And dismissed.

 

[Chief]

Did I hear that having open borders led to these attacks? Oh my goodness. Who would of thought!

You are dismissed.

 

[Chief]

It seems to be most of the girls who work with the footy players feel that way from what she says. The netballers are already a big part of the club, so they're close to most. But club employees seem to think they're outsiders to begin with, because they don't take the field. Jokes are made by the players, but they're not malicious, there's a definite care from the players
When they found out me and her were dating it was made well aware what would happen to me if I did something to hurt her.
Maybe it's different because the club is a bit of a family and she sees them all the time. Whereas mel and Gayle were near enough to strangers. But she's said from day 1 she was treated like everyone else and that put her at ease

I'd have to say that trying to break up your relationship with her doesn't show much respect. But if she sees that as a part of being one of the gang then I suppose you can't really argue.

 

[Chief]

You do realise that but your logic, no one can ever really be "outraged" by anything?

It's a logically fallacious debating technique. Fallacy of relative privation etc

http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Not_as_bad_as

 

[FlowersByIrene]

It's a logically fallacious debating technique. Fallacy of relative privation etc

http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Not_as_bad_as

I agree that technique is pretty useless in debating, I always avoid it.

Doesn't mean the Gayle issue isn't utterly trivial and a non issue.

 

[Barry_Badrinath]

You do realise that but your logic, no one can ever really be "outraged" by anything? Why worry about the one punch death of the kid ther other day when a father murdered his two children and committed suicide? Why worry about that when there are many gun deaths in the US everyday? Why worry about that when there is mass rape and murder in African countries? The list goes on for infinity.

Or, you know, people could be concerned with multiple things, and be concerned with what they are concerned with without people questioning their morals.

The only reason you are seeing more of the Chris Gayle incident is because it is much more localised and easier to relate to. It's well known that the media have always focused on events that hit closer to home and have more emotional pull. Whether that's right or not is another question, but it's got nothing to do with whether anyone cares about one incident more than another, and to suggest so is extremely ignorant.

Also , I'm not sure what you are reading, but there is plenty of empathy, distress, and concern about what is happening in Germany from what I've seen.

Agree with your overall point, but they have been pretty quiet about it. They've still managed to devote a lot of time to Obama crying about guns, an issue that has nothing to do with us. A group of 1,000 men sexually assaulting nearly 100 women is big news I would've thought.

 

[romeohwho]

I agree that technique is pretty useless in debating, I always avoid it.

Doesn't mean the Gayle issue isn't utterly trivial and a non issue.

Whereas I think its terrific that it is being discussed, and the recognition of it as inappropriate behaviour speaks of a culture that is now supporting female journos in their work. And that is a good thing.

 

[Juddy88]

Agree with your overall point, but they have been pretty quiet about it. They've still managed to devote a lot of time to Obama crying about guns, an issue that has nothing to do with us. A group of 1,000 men sexually assaulting nearly 100 women is big news I would've thought.

I do agree other issues deserve more coverage. That's a different issue all together though really

People can be concerned about multiple issues, just because they appear to discuss one more than another doesn't indicate the level of concern.

 

[FlowersByIrene]

Whereas I think its terrific that it is being discussed, and the recognition of it as inappropriate behaviour speaks of a culture that is now supporting female journos in their work. And that is a good thing.

Personally i see it as the promotion of Maude Flandersism - "won't somebody think of the children" and victimisation culture, a degregation of Australian larrikinism and further strides into the systematic attack on men.

But different strokes for different folks.

 

[DemonTim]

I'd have to say that trying to break up your relationship with her doesn't show much respect. But if she sees that as a part of being one of the gang then I suppose you can't really argue.

Fortunately neither of us lump the behaviour of one or two individuals as the actions of the whole

 

[cartwright]

Personally i see it as the promotion of Maude Flandersism - "won't somebody think of the children" and victimisation culture, a degregation of Australian larrikinism and further strides into the systematic attack on men.

But different strokes for different folks.

Won't someone think of the poor Aussie larrikin

Spare me.