Society/Culture Feminism part 1 - continued in part 2

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fleabitten

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This is PART 1 of this thread. It is locked.

PART 2 is here: https://www.bigfooty.com/forum/threads/feminism-2017-thread-pt-ii.1159850/

==========

At the risk of getting myself banned again...

An article from Time by Christina Hoff Summers (also known as The Factual Feminist)

http://time.com/3222543/5-feminist-myths-that-will-not-die/

This is one of the major problems with modern western feminism. Some of the issues discussed are certainly serious problems that need to be addressed, but we need to be honest about the facts first.

As Summers says in her conclusion:
Why do these reckless claims have so much appeal and staying power? For one thing, there is a lot of statistical illiteracy among journalists, feminist academics and political leaders. There is also an admirable human tendency to be protective of women—stories of female exploitation are readily believed, and vocal skeptics risk appearing indifferent to women’s suffering. Finally, armies of advocates depend on “killer stats” to galvanize their cause. But killer stats obliterate distinctions between more and less serious problems and send scarce resources in the wrong directions. They also promote bigotry. The idea that American men are annually enslaving more than 100,000 girls, sending millions of women to emergency rooms, sustaining a rape culture and cheating women out of their rightful salary creates rancor in true believers and disdain in those who would otherwise be sympathetic allies
Other examples of this problem include the recent viral videos about catcalling and men taking advantage of drunk women. The former claimed that the woman in the video was sexually harassed over 100 times in 10 hours, but the video actually only shows about 20 men speak to her (count for yourself, the video is below) and the majority of those are just wishing her a good day. There are a handful of men who actually harass her. So while catcalling is something we should be trying to rid from our streets and clearly none of the attention was welcome, the BS way that the issue is presented immediately puts a lot of people offside.


With the drunk girl video, it turned out to be entirely fake. The men in the video were told that they were filming a comedy skit. Imagine their horror when their faces were spread around the world as though they were practically rapists. One guy lost his job because of it.

The acting is pretty terrible and I think most intelligent people could tell it was all staged but that didn't stop it being spread around and articles being written about what pigs men are. The crazy thing is, they probably could have got a hot drunk girl to stagger around and found some creeps that would try to get her into their car. Why not just stick to the truth and discuss the issues on their merit?

Anyway, if my name turns red again, it was nice knowing you all.
 
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Tas

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I am all for equality (equality of opportunity), however, I think the third wave feminist movement has evolved into a radical left wing movement who often turn any kind of resistance against them into a misogyny conspiracy because they have run out of real causes to fight for and they don't want to lose their political power.

I think the third-wave feminism ideals are morally on shaky grounds, they focus on narrow issues which really aren't anything to do with equality, it is just a political movement which has undergone some cult-like changes when it comes to being insular and dogmatic. Anyone who questions them or wants to debate the issues are labelled misogynists and attacked faster than wasps when poking a hive.

Anyone who vaguely says something remotely sexist is hounded, yet some left wing groupie can broadcast that they believe anyone who oppose their views should be rounded up and executed in a gas chamber like the Jews were and they do not even make an attempt to distance themselves from lunatics like that, it is the kind of situation at the moment.

While we still live in the age of white male guilt it is going to be an awkward transition period until things start to turn shitful and men become the disadvantaged. Once that happens then the movement will be dead for good.

One area women have gone backwards in since the second wave is in the tech industry, get a whiff of the shitstorm that happened with gamergate since that rolled out in August, the way they have the media reporting just one side is really 1984 type of thought control, i am impressed. I am just sad I am not on the winning team. :(

They hounded that poor ESA scientist with the terrible shirt, don't they watch Big Bang Theory? Scientists are not really in full grasp of the social order, made the poor bastard cry and make an emotional apology for his sexist shirt. Seriously, how much was that dude's shirt suppressing anyone's opportunity for equality? It is a very sad world we live in. Sure his shirt was terrible, but seeing guys mobbed down like that is like watching a pack of female lions tear apart a poor Zebra, poor f***er had no chance. :p
 

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I had a work mate cat call a chick while we were driving through the city. She smiled, blushed and walked on. It made the following discussion all the more difficult when i told him to not cat call women from my car.
 

Tas

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I had a work mate cat call a chick while we were driving through the city. She smiled, blushed and walked on. It made the following discussion all the more difficult when i told him to not cat call women from my car.
Yeah, it is not good, you are just as likely to offend as you are to make them smile. I don't think people should consciously do things which could offend others, if giving up cat calling is one of the few prices of a more moderate society then it isn't a huge price to pay.
 

Floor Pie

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http://time.com/3576870/worst-words-poll-2014/

Here you can vote to ban the word "feminist" in 2015!!!

feminist: You have nothing against feminism itself, but when did it become a thing that every celebrity had to state their position on whether this word applies to them, like some politician declaring a party? Let’s stick to the issues and quit throwing this label around like ticker tape at a Susan B. Anthony parade.
Because we all know, none of us have a problem with feminism, it's just that they distract us from the real issues!!!

So let's not talk about the real issues, let's focus on stopping feminism!!!

Because we care!!!
 

fleabitten

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I think Mr Pie is denying that there is any such thing as a feminist myth. Or he thinks the ends justify the means and it's okay to lie as long as it's for a good cause. So he's chosen to mock rather than have a conversation.
 

Floor Pie

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I think Mr Pie is denying that there is any such thing as a feminist myth. Or he thinks the ends justify the means and it's okay to lie as long as it's for a good cause. So he's chosen to mock rather than have a conversation.
Putting words in my mouth? You're such a feminist!
 

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fleabitten

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Just trying to guess at your motives for avoiding addressing what we are talking about. Do you think these causes would be better served if they were discussed honestly or are you fine with lies and exaggeration as long as attention is being brought to the issues?
 

Floor Pie

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Just trying to guess at your motives for avoiding addressing what we are talking about. Do you think these causes would be better served if they were discussed honestly or are you fine with lies and exaggeration as long as attention is being brought to the issues?
You've liked the other posts, but you've singled me out. How convenient that I'm a man...

Could you be more of a feminist?


But seriously, as soon as you want to honestly discuss real issues, I'll be happy to join you. In the mean time, let's play your game!
 

fleabitten

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How am i not discussing the issue? You're employing the same old tactics. All we need is chief to arrive with the lock and ban and the process will be complete.

I'm asking honestly, do you think women's issues would be better addressed without all the BS? I acknowledge that many of the issues are real and need attention, but like a lot of people (male and female), i find the way that many feminists exaggerate/lie to be counterproductive and it alienates a lot of people.
 

Floor Pie

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How am i not discussing the issue? You're employing the same old tactics. All we need is chief to arrive with the lock and ban and the process will be complete.

I'm asking honestly, do you think women's issues would be better addressed without all the BS? I acknowledge that many of the issues are real and need attention, but like a lot of people (male and female), i find the way that many feminists exaggerate/lie to be counterproductive and it alienates a lot of people.
No, you are exacerbating the alienation of feminism to people with your bullshit.

Your saying that you just want to talk about the issues, but this damn feminism is getting in your way...
When in reality, you just want to talk about feminism, and how it's bad.

Ab so lute ly women's issues would be better addressed without all the bullshit. But you are part of the problem.
 

Floor Pie

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Women don't want equality, they want to be treated special and given the same rewards as men without doing the same amount or type of work. Look at construction sites, who is holding the slow sign and who is doing the real work?

There was a news story recently where a bus driver gave up his seat to a woman who was holding a child because the bus was full and no one would let her sit down. I've been in that exact situation and no one did jack shit to give me a seat. Do people give men who are 60 lbs overweight special treatment? nope, so why should a pregnant woman be given special treatment, it's alot easier to carry a 5 lb baby than to be 30 lbs overweight.

http://forum.ebaumsworld.com/showthread.php?371023-Anti-feminism-thread&p=6821077&viewfull=1#post6821077
 

fleabitten

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You literally just said that i was absolutely right and that i was the problem in consecutive sentences. I dont know what you other post has to do with anything.
 

Floor Pie

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When women are let loose to do as they please, away from the authority of men, they have not come up with a cornucopia of great inventions and discoveries. Instead they have aborted tens of millions of infants, blamed all their problems on men, voted leftists into office, become excessively promiscuous, gotten worthless college degrees and demanded equally worthless make-work jobs, believe that wealth falls like manna from heaven, come to believe marriage is temporary, destroyed children's lives though easy divorce and single parent-hood...and rationalized every bit of it.

And those are usually the ones with the higher IQs. The dumber ones get low-paid jobs, have kids out of wedlock, and get various types of welfare.
http://uncabob.blogspot.com.au/2013/10/feminists-are-r-selected-destroyers.html
 

Floor Pie

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You literally just said that i was absolutely right and that i was the problem in consecutive sentences. I dont know what you other post has to do with anything.
I clear it up for you. You said, disingenuously, that women's issues would be better addressed without the bs.

I said it would, and that your bs is part of the problem. So no, I don't absolutely agree with you, I took your disingenuous point, and explained how it could be valid.
 

Floor Pie

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Do you want to talk about actual issues?

What about the rape-myth?
The idea that a woman is partially to blame for being raped?

For me, a male of female who is raped, cannot be blamed for being raped. Only the rapist can be blamed.
But there are people who disagree.
What are your thoughts?
 

fleabitten

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How am i being disingenuous? Okay forget it. I will see myself out. It is you who is part of the problem and the reason why so many reasonable people have come to despise feminism.

Believe it or not, i actually do act in real life to make a difference. You were doing it to mock me, but i am what you would label a feminist if you knew me in person. I don't accept that label, just as the women close to me do not, because it has become synonymous with hysterical twits and people like yourself who are incapable of honest discussion.
 
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