Autopsy Fitzmagic! vs the Pies

[LuckyHawk]

Last year we would have won this game by 7 goals but not now.
So a detailed explanation of why we don't dominate teams like we used to:
Not enough doing enough well enough for long enough.

 

[Flukey!]

Does anybody else think that Sidebottom gave up his chase on Fitz too early?

 

[flinchfree]

Last year we would have won this game by 7 goals but not now.
So a detailed explanation of why we don't dominate teams like we used to:
Not enough doing enough well enough for long enough.

You left out the biggest.
Not the same players.
So there are new players, a Great that is missing with illness, and other greats who are 3-4 years past prime but dig deep when called upon.
We are seeing what this team can do, this year, at this point in their development.

It may be enough because it's not whether your best is as electric as another team. It's whether what you do can prevail, take away from what they're trying to do, and at the end have more points than the other.

Would that be good enough for everyone, or does it have to be a schooling to be ok......

 

[OnTheRocks]

My three year old son wore his 2015 member toddler tee all day went to the shops in it like a true hawthorn supporter went to the fish and chip shop... We barely won but so glad I kept the tee on my son at least he's not a bandwagoner

probs gets that trait from his mum. Kidding. Happy for the little man

Just watched Fitzmagic's interview after the game. Intelligent well spoken bloke that is humble and thankful for getting a chance to play for the Hawks. Doesn't even care if he doesn't get a game for finals, he's just thankful to play any role he can for the club....

Wow, Fitzy is so Hawthorn.

I must admit, i had written off Whitecross, Nd i think Clarko may have too. Threw him in the seniors as a replacement and couldnt justify dropping him ever since. Absolute kudos to Whitey, fantastic effort.

I'm glad he has reminded everyone of his worth.

Our tackling is a worry - I have noticed the opposition all year have been able to get the arms free (quite easily) & dish the handball out to defensive side of a stoppag.

4 minutes left in the 2nd quarter. WX missed a tackle & The Pies score a point but could easily have been a goal. WX reaction typifies why he is in the side, he was disappointed by his failure to stick that tackle. Luved WX game & he thoroughly deserves his spot.

 

[BC6619]

Here's a stat for the Sicily haters, and for those that claim he is lazy, doesn't apply defensive pressure and fails to tackle.

Yesterday Sicily was 9th for defensive pressure acts on the ground out of 44 players. Sure he didn't lay a huge count of tackles but his intent was there. Sic was also 2nd in our side for meters gained, with only 13 possessions that shows how penetrating and damaging he can be.

I get that people look at him and see his strut and laconic running action as lazy, but to be honest it's not the case.

Good to see some support for Sicily plenty of bashers out there that obviously dont watch what he does for the full game.
he had a hand in 4 goals and kicked an important goal in the last when scores were level. Hes direct opponent marsh hardly touched the ball dont hang a bloke in his first year at the top level for a slipped tackle or a mistake that seasoned premership players still make

 

[Dixie Flatline]

Last year we would have won this game by 7 goals but not now.
So a detailed explanation of why we don't dominate teams like we used to:
Not enough doing enough well enough for long enough.

You left out the biggest.
Not the same players.
So there are new players, a Great that is missing with illness, and other greats who are 3-4 years past prime but dig deep when called upon.
We are seeing what this team can do, this year, at this point in their development.

It may be enough because it's not whether your best is as electric as another team. It's whether what you do can prevail, take away from what they're trying to do, and at the end have more points than the other.

Would that be good enough for everyone, or does it have to be a schooling to be ok......

Hawthorn also has a long win streak going against the Magpies (I haven't looked it up but I don't believe Buckley has ever won a game against Hawthorn). Pride and the desire to knock off an opponent who has the wood over you can be strong motivators.

 

[LuckyHawk]

You left out the biggest.
Not the same players.
So there are new players, a Great that is missing with illness, and other greats who are 3-4 years past prime but dig deep when called upon.
We are seeing what this team can do, this year, at this point in their development.

It may be enough because it's not whether your best is as electric as another team. It's whether what you do can prevail, take away from what they're trying to do, and at the end have more points than the other.

Would that be good enough for everyone, or does it have to be a schooling to be ok......

I think all of us would take three 6 point wins on our way to a four peat.
And yes, all our young, inexperienced players are the main reason we have come back to the field.

 

[Hawk Dork]

Hawthorn also has a long win streak going against the Magpies (I haven't looked it up but I don't believe Buckley has ever won a game against Hawthorn). Pride and the desire to knock off an opponent who has the wood over you can be strong motivators.

It would have been pencilled in as a Grand Final for them

 

[LuckyHawk]

Does anybody else think that Sidebottom gave up his chase on Fitz too early?

Fitz isn't slow and Sidebottom may have been out of gas being at the end of the game.

 

[Fourthawn]

Have watched it several times and ..... still have no idea how Silk got that ball out from under the pack to handball to Fitz.

Magician.

 

[Chubberson]

Fitz isn't slow and Sidebottom may have been out of gas being at the end of the game.

He could have pressured more, honestly I think he didnt rate him a chance at goal and peeled off to cover. Bet he wont do the same next time.

 

[HomerJayS]

I thought Sic's biggest mistake was in the last, (I think) when he was running down the wing, had 3 or 4 bounces, and kicked it as far as he could, to a 2 on 1, when there were two Hawks running through CHF frantically waving, calling for him to centre the ball, and not a pie in site. Cost us a certain goal at a critical time. He does have times when he makes the wrong decision, but from his limited game time, we know he can be a match winner.

He's got a bit to learn yet. As posted earlier he's a bit lazy off the ball defensively. I could see him falling out for Stratton with Burton taking his spot up front.

 

[QuietB]

Last year we would have won this game by 7 goals but not now.
So a detailed explanation of why we don't dominate teams like we used to:
Not enough doing enough well enough for long enough.

Hale > Fitzpatrick
McEvoy > Pittonet
Lake > Whitecross
Stratton > Burton
Roughead > Sicily
Suckling > Hartung (maybe)

Its not rocket science

 

[QuietB]

Fitz isn't slow and Sidebottom may have been out of gas being at the end of the game.

Sidebottom is slow, particularly for a midfielder.

 

[Bad Boy Beama]

Has a Hawthorn club debutant ever had such a massive clutch moment? I'm sure there might be another - but this one stands out for now.

Dermott Brereton against North in the 1982 finals

 

[tige19]

He's got a bit to learn yet. As posted earlier he's a bit lazy off the ball defensively. I could see him falling out for Stratton with Burton taking his spot up front.

See my post earlier, the lazy call is pure speculation and complete bullshit.

 

[Ned Ryerson]

Dermott Brereton against North in the 1982 finals

I didn't mean a better debut overall. And 5 goals in a final on debut is massive. But we won that game by a handy margin, yes - thanks to Dermie, but I was talking about a clutch moment. Think Judas in the 2007 elimination final. LeBron's block in game 7 this year. A clutch play is when you pull something out of the fire when your back is against the wall in the dying stages. I am referring to the Fitzmagic final goal - not all round club debut.

 

[LuckyHawk]

Hale > Fitzpatrick
McEvoy > Pittonet
Lake > Whitecross
Stratton > Burton
Roughead > Sicily
Suckling > Hartung (maybe)

Its not rocket science

Yep, thats the same as my post except you've put in the names.

 

[Schopp]

I thought Fitzpatricks goal had been disallowed given his expression after kicking it. I noticed that too about Steele but Fitz was just too quick for him and he was probably cooked. I remember when he played for Melbourne and thought he was an athlete for a big guy. Has had a lot to deal with including battling chronic fatigue so good on him am rapt for him - hopefully he and Whitecross have a September to remember.

 

[JoondalupJ]

Few thoughts

I'd like to keep Sicily in the team... we constantly bomb it into the 50 & he is the only one capable of taking a contested mark. I thought his efforts were fine yesterday. Made some mistakes but most our players do.

Gunners is off... hopefully he'll be right with the extra break.

Burton looks to already have the composure of a 100 gamer. I think we've found one.

Collingwood ran & attacked in numbers through the corrider/wings - highlighting just our important Stratts is to cut off the inside 50s. Geelong could get on top here...

Our tackling is a worry - I have noticed the opposition all year have been able to get the arms free (quite easily) & dish the handball out to defensive side of a stoppage. Our clearances are a worry because it is affecting Gibbo's game immensely.

Your right , they aren't sticking tackles like before, they need that hardness back, some look half hearted.

But also Stratton is a key, I hope he's up for it and we may see Hawks playing like finalist Hawks.

Still a weird year , a weird year , so much so, for me, that I am not sure its the way it flowed, or its a plan around copping the least wearing out and the best performances to come.

Sounds a bit far fetched , but get back and win in a few seconds is simply hard to follow, especially when it happened regularly all year,does that mean we are just on the fringe now, or are we a bogey man in the finals. No one knows about.

 

[Bad Boy Beama]

I didn't mean a better debut overall. And 5 goals in a final on debut is massive. But we won that game by a handy margin, yes - thanks to Dermie, but I was talking about a clutch moment. Think Judas in the 2007 elimination final. LeBron's block in game 7 this year. A clutch play is when you pull something out of the fire when your back is against the wall in the dying stages. I am referring to the Fitzmagic final goal - not all round club debut.

My Bad for getting confused.

Fitz's run then goal was massive, I think from my vantage point in the Olympic Stand, I had a similar reaction to him, to be honest my jaw dropped and hit the Collingwood supporter in front of me.

 

[Gralin]

See my post earlier, the lazy call is pure speculation and complete bullshit.

I was watching him off the ball and when it was down our end he was not chasing most of the time, wasn't really zoning properly either, lot of finger pointing and ball watching. He's not alone in doing it this year and I think some of the bad habits of preservation mode that a lot of our senior players go into have rubbed off on him.

He did some great things (a couple of beautiful lace out passes, a great mark and goal) some good things (decent pressure a couple of times, bit of dash, working into the game after some horrible early mistakes) and some poor things (fumbles, pulling out, not chasing) he's young and he's not alone in doing it.

He's pretty boom or bust though at this stage and his last 6 weeks have been pretty quiet. Think he will probably get the nod in 2 weeks and stay in when we have to make room for 2-3 players but he'd have to be close to bottom 6 at the moment a lot of the time and needs to lift his intensity when he doesn't have the ball, and his second and third efforts when he doesn't mark it.

 

[Argy]

Does anybody else think that Sidebottom gave up his chase on Fitz too early?

Yep, but like Hodge said after the game when asked to comment on the kick... "no one knew where it would go".

 

[flinchfree]

I didn't mean a better debut overall. And 5 goals in a final on debut is massive. But we won that game by a handy margin, yes - thanks to Dermie, but I was talking about a clutch moment. Think Judas in the 2007 elimination final. LeBron's block in game 7 this year. A clutch play is when you pull something out of the fire when your back is against the wall in the dying stages. I am referring to the Fitzmagic final goal - not all round club debut.

Most clutch Hawthorn moment I've seen: Bucky's goal against Melbourne in 87' (I think..?) Prelim Final. Gonads of absolute steel as he had plenty of time to think about it and understand the consequences.
Unfrickinbelieveable moment.

 

[tige19]

I was watching him off the ball and when it was down our end he was not chasing most of the time, wasn't really zoning properly either, lot of finger pointing and ball watching. He's not alone in doing it this year and I think some of the bad habits of preservation mode that a lot of our senior players go into have rubbed off on him.

He did some great things (a couple of beautiful lace out passes, a great mark and goal) some good things (decent pressure a couple of times, bit of dash, working into the game after some horrible early mistakes) and some poor things (fumbles, pulling out, not chasing) he's young and he's not alone in doing it.

He's pretty boom or bust though at this stage and his last 6 weeks have been pretty quiet. Think he will probably get the nod in 2 weeks and stay in when we have to make room for 2-3 players but he'd have to be close to bottom 6 at the moment a lot of the time and needs to lift his intensity when he doesn't have the ball, and his second and third efforts when he doesn't mark it.

Every player who has ever played the game needs to lift their intensity when they have haven't got the ball, that's not isolated to Sic.

I get what you're saying, but if the kid was so lax in the defensive area then why was he inside the top 10 for defensive pressure acts?