Footy First Accountability Thread

[sauce_head]

It is no secret that I was not a fan of bringing Footy First to the club and some of the blame game I am reading being delivered to the previous admin is, for me, concerning. For mine, FF are a self serving bunch hijacking on the solid foundation of RB and his merry men. This is meant to be a discussion on whether they are delivering to their ticket or not, not a discussion on if the previous administration would have delivered better through the next few years and the real danger for Victorian team as the league expands, again.

SO let's look at what they promised:

1. Big sponsorship agreements.

2. More money to solve the injury "crisis".

3. More money on chasing the premiership and less focus on the bottom line.

4. A board that do not undertaken "inappropriate" activities in their personal time.

Are they delivering?

1. Yes one big sponsor. I am not sure that it is a better deal than in previous years. Anybody have some hard stats here?

2. Failing so far. Seems our mid tier players are again suffering from soft tissue injuries, and we may have a few less of the uncontrollable ones than in previous years; perhaps.

3. Failing. We will probably not make the eight and I would love to eat humble pie regarding the premiership in the next four years; at the expense of the bottom line, lifeblood.

4. Who knows? Who cares? It is Footy First right?

Summation:

The jury is still out, I guess, however there is little point sacrificing bottom line when the direction we are headed is downwards. They indorsed the new coach so they are responsible for taking that forward as well.

I would assume that less people are watching and membership will be down next year, so who knows how we will pay for the mystic injury prevention system we are paying through the nose for? Perhaps we will be desperate enough as a supporter group to vote for a new regime based on a voodoo injury cure?

I just personally hope that we keep a bit in the bank for our inevitable rebuilding and drop in membership over the next few years as a war chest when the AFL puts another two or three Victorian clubs to the sword.

Please feel free to save this and rub my nose in it if I am proven wrong. I will be the one smiling and admitting I over reacted as I drink from the premiership cup; but who is more likely to be wrong? Gambling everything on a premiership backed by desperate supporters grasping at a drowning injury straw whilst sitting pretty on the board...

Footy First hey? Tell that to Fitzroy supporters.

 

[Squizz]

Saucy - they have delivered. The club lost sponsors under the previous administration, and have been replaced.

Previous administration had a spat with the council and walked away from the table. Now we have secured a future somewhere relevant.

Dave Misson and Matthew Drain are highly regarded, and the recruiting department has finally been increased.

If you do not hear of "inappropriate" activities, then that's good right?

What do you want 'em to do - kick the footy for the players (I'm sure Nathan Burke is tempted)?

 

[sauce_head]

No, I want them to admit they got in on the back of fear of injuries and used that to play up on the supporters vuneralability. It was always a pitch made out of nothing and they are spending money cashing away something that can not really be controlled.

If they take us into debt as we head down the ladder, I will never forgive them.

The previous people (which I was sure I was not going to get into!) were negotiating with other councils as well. Granted, however, that is a good result.

For me, delivery will be against profit this year (less any writeoffs) in the absense of on field success.

 

[Squizz]

You need to accept that the previous administration self destructed. Maybe Footy First overplayed their hand (when they didn't need to), but that's politics for you.

We had write-offs and provisions for the Grant Thomas court case and Aaron Hamill's contract, but that's from the past.

Despite the additional spending, the club will turn a buck this year. Don't think there will be a run-up of debt (albeit the club would be expected to contribute to the development of the Frankston facilities in due course).

 

[Fehring]

Saucy - they have delivered. The club lost sponsors under the previous administration, and have been replaced.

Previous administration had a spat with the council and walked away from the table. Now we have secured a future somewhere relevant.

Dave Misson and Matthew Drain are highly regarded, and the recruiting department has finally been increased.

If you do not hear of "inappropriate" activities, then that's good right?

What do you want 'em to do - kick the footy for the players (I'm sure Nathan Burke is tempted)?

1. FF said they'd bring in - I think - three sponsors worth 1mil each (correct me if I'm wrong - they ripped their website down within hours of getting elected). they've brought in one large sponsor.

2. Previous admin walked away from table with Kingston and threatened to go to Casey, Frankston, Port melbourne or Junction Oval. FF said it would go back to the table with Kingston and Butterss was a disgrace for walking away. Within weeks of coming on board, FF signed with Frankston.

3. Misson came on board while Butterss was still there. I believe the Drain Train was on its way to Moorabbin (but not s,s and d) before Butterss left.

They've broken most of their promises, but it hasn't had a catastrophic effect: Franga was clearly the right thing to do and the injuries aren't their fault. The only really bad thing was those phantom sponsors which never materialised: we can now say for sure that they didn't deliver on the sponsor promise - they said they had three big ones in the bag.

 

[Squizz]

Whilst there may have been mention of 3 sponsors, I don't remember them being $1m each - nor would I have believed them if they had said this. Given Jeld-Wen is believed to be comfortably more than $1m a year I would be cutting some slack in this regard. UD Trucks would be a new premium sponsor and I don't remember Maximum Capital and 2XU as prime sponsors?

 

[HoldenMCaulfield]

oh dear...

http://www.news.com.au/heraldsun/sport/afl/story/0,26576,23770061-19742,00.html

We are 100 per cent behind him. If you change (coaches) every five minutes, you go nowhere. And I'm very adamant about it: he's there to stay.

There is some truth in this and I generally like the support, but I wonder if this is the right time to tell a guy who should be under pressure that his job is secure (imagine if Lyon told Fiora, Gram, R Clarke and the like that they are here to stay regardless of their performance...).

In soccer, words like these typically mean that the coach is as good as gone. Lyon has not been appointed by this board, but by the previous board. He has had little success so far, appears to not reach the players and has made St Kilda a team that only its supporters like to watch (I'm not even sure about that). Is this really the time to tell him there is no need for panic station and that he's here to stay?

I'm not sure anything drastic has gone wrong.

Where were you on Sunday, Mr. Chairman ?

Ross is, if you like, rebuilding, and I've got confidence in his game plan and approach

I thought we were going for the big one this year - bringing in older players like King, Gardiner (2x), Birss, Schneider and Gehrig certainly appears to suggest this.

But building in and around all that takes a bit of time.

This is (probably - but given that they are still mongst our five best players, hopefully not) Harvey's and Hudghton's last year (heck, even Gehrig came back as he thought that we could play for a flag this year) - how dare you, Mr. Chairman, to say that this is a rebuilding year ? Those legends won't have this time !

Oh - and if you have confidence in his game plan and approach, could you please explain it to us ?

 

[Squizz]

Wow - Domi has been stirred into action!

Comes down to whether the group is tight knit. If the board, staff, and players think they are doing the right things off the ground then we should not be sacking the coach.

Clearly issues though with putting the plans into practice, and I didn't think Westaway should have played down the problems.

 

[Mullo]

I thought we were going for the big one this year - bringing in older players like King, Gardiner (2x), Birss, Schneider and Gehrig certainly appears to suggest this.

M Gardiner was brought in the year before anyways, nothing to do with FF

C Gardiner and Schneider are both young, you ninny (23ish)

Birss was also the year before, and is also youngish..

Agree on frase, but for pick 50something, why not?

Get your facts right mate....

 

[Squizz]

You'd have to say that 23-24 year olds are a bit different to rebuilding from the U/18's.

Didn't like the whole Fraser Gehrig thing at all - he rings up at 2am from overseas the day before draft day nominations and says he is missing the game? Sounds like a dodgy ex - and we should not have fallen for the trap.

I've got no problem with King though - gives Macca some time to develop rather than throwing him straight in when he's not ready.

Schneider was always a top-up to a good team - not to make the team good - so someone misread where we were at list-wise.

 

[HoldenMCaulfield]

M Gardiner was brought in the year before anyways, nothing to do with FF

C Gardiner and Schneider are both young, you ninny (23ish)

Birss was also the year before, and is also youngish..

Agree on frase, but for pick 50something, why not?

Get your facts right mate....

As far as I remember, Birss and M Gardiner were brought in under Lyon. Who cares whether FF was at the helm then when they were brought in ? They were brought in because it was the general belief that these two or three years could be our last chance to win a premiership with this player group - it is a bit simple to now say that we are sort of rebuilding, isn't it (and I cannot remember FF saying anything about rebuilding the team when they outsted Butterss and his team) ?

Talking about getting your facts right (and being a ninny), Birss is 25, C Gardiner is 25, Schneider is 24 and Dempster is 24. Not really the age group you would consider for a rebuild ? We gave up picks 59 and 26 (and nothing for Gardiner together with King) for them - not extraordinary, but potentially useful for rebuilding of the traditional style (note that e.g. Schneider himself was picked as no. 60).

Gehrig was worth a punt, no doubt a baout that and deserved the redraft out of respect for what he has done for this club. But Gehrig is sportsman enough to realise that the punt has not paid off and has basically put himself out of action for at least eight weeks.

And this is where we get to another problem of bringing in 'oldish' (fair enough for 24+ old players ?) : they block the possible development of young players. I look at Kreuzer, Thomas, Palmer and the like - they all have had bad games, but they are given the chance to develop with the best and will get harder having the chance to play wth the current stars of their teams and having to play against the big men of the opposition. Our youngsters on the other hand are thrown in for one or two games and are then replaced again.

I am not saying that these players aren't any good (heck, Birss is one of our best at the moment) and that Lyon necessarily needs to be sacked now, but if we go on saying that everything is juuust fine or lie to yourself that we are in a rebuilding phase, we will not even get close to giving legends like Harvey, Hudghton (and Gehrig) another shot at the finals.

 

[Persevering Saint]

Butterss said the EXACT SAME THING about Thomas on June 29, 2006. He wanted him there for 10 years. I remembered the article, and looked it up on google:

http://www.highbeam.com/doc/1P1-53958494.html

 

[bubblegoose]

Percy, are you sure I can go onto: http://www.highbeam.com without anything going onto my work record?

 

[Squizz]

Yeah, the name was too dodgy for me too

 

[Fehring]

congrats to Westaway for those comments. Surely even Helen knows that the last thing we need is a new coach. Our players need to harden the f**k up and the last thing they need is to be let off the hook by firing the coach.

If Westaway and his board can show the leadership of a great club instead of a bottom feeder, I'll fall in line. I'm sick of board coups. I'm sick of coaching changes. I'm sick of knee jerk reactions. It wouldn't hurt for our supporters to harden the f**k up as well and fall in line behind our coach.

 

[ChrisFooty]

congrats to Westaway for those comments. Surely even Helen knows that the last thing we need is a new coach. Our players need to harden the f**k up and the last thing they need is to be let off the hook by firing the coach.

If Westaway and his board can show the leadership of a great club instead of a bottom feeder, I'll fall in line. I'm sick of board coups. I'm sick of coaching changes. I'm sick of knee jerk reactions. It wouldn't hurt for our supporters to harden the f**k up as well and fall in line behind our coach.

Between rounds 12-22 last year Ross Lyon was a good coach. Although he has to take some responsibility, some of these current players are just playing awful.

 

[Persevering Saint]

Percy, are you sure I can go onto: http://www.highbeam.com without anything going onto my work record?

LOL! Very funny - never even thought of that.

Apparently, it's an online library of newspapers:

 

[35Harvs]

congrats to Westaway for those comments. Surely even Helen knows that the last thing we need is a new coach. Our players need to harden the f**k up and the last thing they need is to be let off the hook by firing the coach.

If Westaway and his board can show the leadership of a great club instead of a bottom feeder, I'll fall in line. I'm sick of board coups. I'm sick of coaching changes. I'm sick of knee jerk reactions. It wouldn't hurt for our supporters to harden the f**k up as well and fall in line behind our coach.

On the topic of current board.... what about Andrew Thompson & his comments when he was commentating the Bris game? I only heard a bit of it last night on TFS.

I understand he is commentating so needs to say it how it is, but not sure he should be commentating on St Kilda games.

 

[Squizz]

Thommo's comments didn't seem that damning to me. He seemed to get pressed hard for comment by the other jerk (putting words in his mouth).

 

[35Harvs]

cheers, as I said only heard the snippet on TFS .. & read somewhere that he queried some of the coaches moves (or lack thereof) ...

 

[stfan]

Saucy - they have delivered. The club lost sponsors under the previous administration, and have been replaced.


Dave Misson and Matthew Drain are highly regarded, and the recruiting department has finally been increased.

It is wrong to credit these to FF.

1/ Both appointments (along with others such as the Olmpic Team Doc and Melbourne Victory Physio) were already occurring before FF came in ...and would have happened anyway.

2/ The new recruiting guy actually started well before FF...from memory at the start of the 2007 season so that the new guy was in charge of the 2007 draft.

Players like Jones were sourced under expanded resources deployed at the time of his drafting....in the 2006 draft.


Can you provide details of the exapansions that have been made in the recruiting department since FF came on board? Thanks.



I belive that the Footy Departments spend is up.
What I do not know is how much it is up on top of what had already been announced by the proceeding Board.


Sponosorship

Very little was said about Jeld Wen. One thing I noted was that it was announced that Jw approached the club, and not the other way around.

I think a lot of luck may have played a part here that a major international company who like sports sponosorships started taking over Australian Companies not long before the Saints Major Sponsorship came up for grabs.

 

[Squizz]

I don't believe I said FF recruited Drain, but the new board should buy tatts tickets.

The club had just lost two major sponsors, and you are saying Jeld-Wen, Coca-Cola, UD Trucks, Jayco, Maximum Capital, 2XU and ISC just fell in their lap?

And I suppose Greg Hutchinson (new coach of development as well as Casey coach) just tolates the new board?

And the rehab and physio team which has been beefed up to 10 people is paid out of Dave Misson's pocket?

It funny that these things were all the old board (so you say), but they just didn't get around to putting them in place earlier after years in charge? Geez, they are unlucky aren't they? Or maybe all those people that voted for FF are just stupid.

And you don't think we finally have some interstate scouts to stop John Beveridge jumping in his car and driving over there?

 

[Squizz]

Oh, and don't you just hate the way the membership prices didn't increase this year, and how you got a good pack (incl. scarf) with the membership, and how they improved the process with ticketed games (i.e. we don't have to pay a fee).

I suppose Butterss knitted all the friggin scarfs himself!!!

 

[sauce_head]

I hate that they are spening more on our way down. Time will tell, but spending on the incurable is witchcraft.

Let's hope I am wrong. I will be more pleased than anyone.

 

[stfan]

I don't believe I said FF recruited Drain, but the new board should buy tatts tickets.

The club had just lost two major sponsors, and you are saying Jeld-Wen, Coca-Cola, UD Trucks, Jayco, Maximum Capital, 2XU and ISC just fell in their lap?

And I suppose Greg Hutchinson (new coach of development as well as Casey coach) just tolates the new board?

And the rehab and physio team which has been beefed up to 10 people is paid out of Dave Misson's pocket?

It funny that these things were all the old board (so you say), but they just didn't get around to putting them in place earlier after years in charge? Geez, they are unlucky aren't they? Or maybe all those people that voted for FF are just stupid.

And you don't think we finally have some interstate scouts to stop John Beveridge jumping in his car and driving over there?

I have no problem crediting FF with what they have done.....

But I think it is wrong to credit the with things that they have not.

The Conditioning Department is obviously not out of Mison's pocket.

But various staff were already in the process of being hired.

The question is therefore how much EXTRA spend has occurred.

I think some certainly has,,,,but to attribute it all as being additional and soley due to FF is just blatantly wrong.