Fremantle Legends

[theGav56]

leg⋅end

6. a collection of stories about an admirable person.
7. a person who is the center of such stories: She became a legend in her own lifetime.
8. Archaic. a story of the life of a saint, esp. one stressing the miraculous or unrecorded deeds of the saint.
9. Obsolete. a collection of such stories or stories like them.


Here is my list and some comments;

Peter Bell; Not only was he the first person officially recruited by the club, but being delisted, returning, captaining and playing fine football for the club are enough to get him Legend status. His career is peppered with acts of courage, genuine football intelligence, B&F's and AA honours, plus Premierships *sigh*. Being a Korean orphan adds a little bit of uniqueness, which is always good in a legend.

Mathew Pavlich; Best player the club has had, and one of the few genuine champions of the game the club has had. In addition, he has played all of his career so far for the club despite some strong temptation to "go home".

Shane Parker; Always underrated, and rarely beaten, Parker typified our defense as a player who was often fighting outside of his weight, size and class division, but Parker was rarely beaten, and never shirked a contest. Part of his legend status was Parker's willingness to play on the biggest gorillas as well as the speediest dwarfs in the competition. And some of the stories that will be told regarding Parker would refer to his clashes with Gherig as well as his patented running style. Also a noted goal kicker. Or was it goals?

Clive Waterhouse; A controversial inclusion to a club legends type of list, but I include Clive because he almost personified the clubs often comical early years. This includes a mix of talent bordering on brilliance along with an almost debilitating lack of ability in crucial areas of the game, making Waterhouse a flawed genius, who never needed a nickname and is one of the few AFL players who could be identified by their first name; our very own Elvis, or Cher, or Lassie. He was the first player we had who could turn a game, and the first player we had who people would come through the gate to watch, and while it seems absurd to include him ahead of player such as Kickett or even Cook, for me those qualities get him on my list.

Shaun MacManus; The last of the originals almost gets him to legend status, signifying a longevity that someone with that many knee operations should not enjoy. That he did survive is a enormous credit to him. Adding to his legend status is his moment of incredible bravery in the clash with Wirrpunda, his role as captain during the worst period in our history, and his demonstrated dedication to improving the areas of his game that were his weakest.

 

[estibador]

Kickett should definitely be in there. 2nd, 2nd and 1st in our first three club champion awards and would have been AA in 97 if he played for a Vic team. Our most consistent performer in the early years and it's an insult to the great man to have a freak show amusement like Clive in there ahead of him.

But even besides all that he deserves to be called a Freo legend just for being the most important figure in the demolition derby drama. It was a real defining moment in our history when we took a stand and announced we weren't going to be bullied around like a little brother any more - and Kickett was the one who stepped up and made it happen. Now that's the stuff real legends are made of.

 

[theGav56]

Kickett should definitely be in there.

No he shouldn't, it's my list. Good to know he'd be on yours.

..... and it's an insult to the great man ....

No, it's an opinion, and a zillion miles from an insult. Also, it is not a list of Great Men, and none of my Fremantle Legends list would even come close to being on a list of great men. I mean, they play football for goodness sake.

 

[estibador]

Well if you're suddenly going to turn around and be all pedantic about it none of them are legends either. I mean they only play football for goodness sake.

 

[Bradesmaen]

Tony Modra... he was a god, no way a god can be left off a legends list.

 

[Kenny_01]

Kickett should definitely be in there. 2nd, 2nd and 1st in our first three club champion awards and would have been AA in 97 if he played for a Vic team. Our most consistent performer in the early years and it's an insult to the great man to have a freak show amusement like Clive in there ahead of him.

But even besides all that he deserves to be called a Freo legend just for being the most important figure in the demolition derby drama. It was a real defining moment in our history when we took a stand and announced we weren't going to be bullied around like a little brother any more - and Kickett was the one who stepped up and made it happen. Now that's the stuff real legends are made of.

Agreed Esti.

 

[theGav56]

Well if you're suddenly going to turn around and be all pedantic about it none of them are legends either. I mean they only play football for goodness sake.

I titled it "Fremantle Legends" on a football website, and made it clear it was "my" list. Fine with other opinions. What I am not looking for is the "I'm right, you are wrong type" of posts we've seen about MacManus, and which you decided you'd use here. I know they'll come, but it will be a much more interesting thread without them.

 

[estibador]

Stop being such a sook Gav. All I did was point out a player that I thought should be added to your opening list of legends.

Would it be a much more interesting thread if we all just named the same players over and over again?

 

[PalaceGun]

Don't you have to win something to be a legend? The only thing these players have won is a wooden spoon (not interested in personal awards).

Great players some of them, fine... but there are no legends there.

 

[theGav56]

Don't you have to win something to be a legend? The only thing these players have won is a wooden spoon (not interested in personal awards).

Great players some of them, fine... but there are no legends there.

You missed Peter Bell's career didn't you.

 

[Bradesmaen]

Don't you have to win something to be a legend? The only thing these players have won is a wooden spoon (not interested in personal awards).

Great players some of them, fine... but there are no legends there.

No, you don't have to win anything to be a legend of any club in any sport.

Oh wait, I forgot you're a troll and not a Fremantle supporter.

Carry on.

 

[theGav56]

Stop being such a sook Gav. All I did was point out a player that I thought should be added to your opening list of legends

Actually that is not true, or even close to it.

.... it's an insult to the great man to have a freak show amusement like Clive in there ahead of him.

You chose to nsult Waterhouse, then imply that it was an insult not to include Kickett. I'm not suggesting Waterhouse is anything that he isn't.

I have no problem with your thoughts on Kickett.

 

[Alfonz]

To qualify as a football legend the most important factor, by an absolute mile, is funnily enough ... football ability. As such we only have 2 – Bell and Pavlich. And one of those achieved much of his legend status with another club.

As for McManus, the fact that he is considered a legend is merely a poor reflection on our club and what sort of players we have had. People bring up his “efforts” and “commitment” etc, but as far as I'm concerned in these areas McManus was no different to how a footballer should be, and no different to hundreds of players who have played the game.

The fact we had so little footballers who put in the effort made McManus stand out, but in reality he was just an average footballer who tried very hard. In terms of a club legend then maybe, the same way an 80 year old bootstudder who was born in the grandstands might be, but not a football legend.

Kickett put in just as much effort on the field as McManus, and was a far superior footballer, so I don't really see how anybody could put McManus above Kickett.

 

[PalaceGun]

No, you don't have to win anything to be a legend of any club in any sport.

Oh wait, I forgot you're a troll and not a Fremantle supporter.

Carry on.

Sorry to wake you, go back to sleep misery guts.

 

[anti.]

+ kickett punched reid, therefore he's in my list.

 

[PalaceGun]

You missed Peter Bell's career didn't you.

Last time I checked he won two Premierships with North Melbourne Football Club.

I'm fine with him being classed a North Melbourne legend.

 

[Bradesmaen]

To qualify as a football legend the most important factor, by an absolute mile, is funnily enough ... football ability. As such we only have 2 – Bell and Pavlich. And one of those achieved much of his legend status with another club.

As for McManus, the fact that he is considered a legend is merely a poor reflection on our club and what sort of players we have had. People bring up his “efforts” and “commitment” etc, but as far as I'm concerned in these areas McManus was no different to how a footballer should be, and no different to hundreds of players who have played the game.

The fact we had so little footballers who put in the effort made McManus stand out, but in reality he was just an average footballer who tried very hard. In terms of a club legend then maybe, the same way an 80 year old bootstudder who was born in the grandstands might be, but not a football legend.

Kickett put in just as much effort on the field as McManus, and was a far superior footballer, so I don't really see how anybody could put McManus above Kickett.

Not nessicarily. You are thinking legend of the game, not legend of the club. Hell, a legend of the club could be a CEO that hangs around for 20 years and we get 5 premierships in that era thanks to his leadership, he becomes a legend of the club without playing a single game. Therefore footballing ability is not needed.

 

[theGav56]

To qualify as a football legend the most important factor, by an absolute mile, is funnily enough ... football ability. As such we only have 2 – Bell and Pavlich. And one of those achieved much of his legend status with another club.

I disagree. The legend of Peter Bell is enhanced because he left and came back, not diminished, and it is certainly enhanced because he was delisted as not being good enough. Too short and too slow, both things that go towards football ability, but he overcame those limitations.

 

[paul8241]

+ kickett punched reid, therefore he's in my list.

What he said.

We could say that Danny Southern is a legend too. "The Anaesthesist". Just not one of ours.

 

[Bluto]

I titled it "Fremantle Legends" on a football website, and made it clear it was "my" list. Fine with other opinions. What I am not looking for is the "I'm right, you are wrong type" of posts we've seen about MacManus, and which you decided you'd use here. I know they'll come, but it will be a much more interesting thread without them.

You've been around long enough to realise that this type of thread is more attractive to trolls than regular posters. It doesn't matter how carefully you phrase your OP this is thread will be like crack to them.

 

[estibador]

You chose to nsult Waterhouse, then imply that it was an insult not to include Kickett.

FWIW I'd probably have Clive in there too, circus freak or not. But I'd definitely have Kickett ahead of him. In fact I'd have Kickett ahead of anyone except Pav (maybe Bell too I suppose).

+ kickett punched reid, therefore he's in my list.

Seems like as good a reason as any.

It's spelt Read btw - but since you're an eagles supporter and are probably only used to yelling out 'go number 24' I'll let you off.

 

[Reasonable]

leg⋅end

6. a collection of stories about an admirable person.
7. a person who is the center of such stories: She became a legend in her own lifetime.
8. Archaic. a story of the life of a saint, esp. one stressing the miraculous or unrecorded deeds of the saint.
9. Obsolete. a collection of such stories or stories like them.


Here is my list and some comments;

Peter Bell; Not only was he the first person officially recruited by the club, but being delisted, returning, captaining and playing fine football for the club are enough to get him Legend status. His career is peppered with acts of courage, genuine football intelligence, B&F's and AA honours, plus Premierships *sigh*. Being a Korean orphan adds a little bit of uniqueness, which is always good in a legend.

Mathew Pavlich; Best player the club has had, and one of the few genuine champions of the game the club has had. In addition, he has played all of his career so far for the club despite some strong temptation to "go home".

Shane Parker; Always underrated, and rarely beaten, Parker typified our defense as a player who was often fighting outside of his weight, size and class division, but Parker was rarely beaten, and never shirked a contest. Part of his legend status was Parker's willingness to play on the biggest gorillas as well as the speediest dwarfs in the competition. And some of the stories that will be told regarding Parker would refer to his clashes with Gherig as well as his patented running style. Also a noted goal kicker. Or was it goals?

Clive Waterhouse; A controversial inclusion to a club legends type of list, but I include Clive because he almost personified the clubs often comical early years. This includes a mix of talent bordering on brilliance along with an almost debilitating lack of ability in crucial areas of the game, making Waterhouse a flawed genius, who never needed a nickname and is one of the few AFL players who could be identified by their first name; our very own Elvis, or Cher, or Lassie. He was the first player we had who could turn a game, and the first player we had who people would come through the gate to watch, and while it seems absurd to include him ahead of player such as Kickett or even Cook, for me those qualities get him on my list.

Shaun MacManus; The last of the originals almost gets him to legend status, signifying a longevity that someone with that many knee operations should not enjoy. That he did survive is a enormous credit to him. Adding to his legend status is his moment of incredible bravery in the clash with Wirrpunda, his role as captain during the worst period in our history, and his demonstrated dedication to improving the areas of his game that were his weakest.

When was this?

His kicking got worse the longer he played.

As someone has already mentioned this club has only had two legends, Bell and Pavlich. To suggest otherwise is a massive, desperate stretch.

 

[anti.]

Seems like as good a reason as any.

It's spelt Read btw - but since you're an eagles supporter and are probably only used to yelling out 'go number 24' I'll let you off.

i had it as 'read' initially then i thought it looked wrong and i changed it to 'reid'.

he doesnt deserve to have his name spelt properly anyway.

 

[Cica]

When was this?

His kicking got worse the longer he played.

As someone has already mentioned this club has only had two legends, Bell and Pavlich. To suggest otherwise is a massive, desperate stretch.

It all depends what you define as a legend.

I think that Bell and Pavlich are both legends at AFL level and could be classed as AFL Legends. I do not think McMannus could be classed as AFL legend but in my eyes he is always going to be a legend to us true Fremantle supporters. So McMannus is Fremantle Legend.

 

[Crimson King]

Haselby?