FTA-TV Game of Thrones - season 8

[Roobs321]

Pretty crazy that post because it's true. Have barely heard of it in media since it finished. One of the all time great TV fu** ups.

A couples months after it finished it broke the record for most Emmy nominations in the same year, and went on to win Best Drama series in its 8th season. Quiet.

It is fairly normal for a series to go quiet after it is finished, especially one with a big plot intrigue angle, and that wasn't a sleeper hit that took a couple years to find an audience. When something has been followed popularly for that long, everyone wants to take a breath.

 

[Vader]

A couples months after it finished it broke the record for most Emmy nominations in the same year, and went on to win Best Drama series in its 8th season. Quiet.

It is fairly normal for a series to go quiet after it is finished, especially one with a big plot intrigue angle, and that wasn't a sleeper hit that took a couple years to find an audience. When something has been followed popularly for that long, everyone wants to take a breath.

Half of those nominations were actors nominating themselves. The most salient point is that it only won one award, and even then it was a widely panned decision.

 

[Roobs321]

Half of those nominations were actors nominating themselves. The most salient point is that it only won one award, and even then it was a widely panned decision.

One as in Best Drama + Best Supporting Actor? (not to mention all the "non-major" creatives, like Editing, Sound Editing, Score, Makeup, Visual Effects, etc. i.e. things you would win an Oscar for)

None of the other drama series won any more awards than GoT.

 

[Vader]

One as in Best Drama + Best Supporting Actor? (not to mention all the "non-major" creatives, like Editing, Sound Editing, Score, Makeup, Visual Effects, etc. i.e. things you would win an Oscar for)

None of the other drama series won any more awards than GoT.

GoT won plenty of awards in the earlier seasons... but next to nothing for S8, because it was utter garbage.

 

[bourbons]

This was the problem with the last season. They started catering to people who were happy with 'epic tv'. The story fell to pieces, character and story arcs abandoned, plot holes galore. All for 'epic tv'. Even that though, the battle of the dead was an awful episode.

Nah I don't think it was a specific direction they took just to 'cater' to people who wanted epic set pieces, that was just a by product of having such a condensed final season.

GRRM had given them the outline, there were obviously big action pieces they had to fit into those 6 episodes. They just didn't have the time to focus on politics, machinations and the more character driven stuff. Perfect example was Jon and Dany, that whole story would have played fine if it happened over a season or more, they could have made the thematic stuff echoing her dad hit even harder and been more meaningful. But her descent into madness and Jon's turn had to be squeezed into, what, 4 episodes? Definitely felt rushed.

How anyone at HBO thought it was a reasonable idea to allow things to be wrapped up in that amount of eps is the question imo.

 

[bourbons]

Eh? Says who?

When a show ends that's kinda what happens, the hype around it disappears. I'd say GoT has endured more than most - still see a heap of t-shirts around, my mates still quote lines at each other etc.

 

[bourbons]

Pretty crazy that post because it's true. Have barely heard of it in media since it finished. One of the all time great TV fu** ups.

Have you heard about many other shows in the media once they finished?

 

[quotemokc]

Eh? Says who?

When a show ends that's kinda what happens, the hype around it disappears. I'd say GoT has endured more than most - still see a heap of t-shirts around, my mates still quote lines at each other etc.

Says at least 100k~ people that liked that post.

How many shows have gone from hero to zero so quickly?

 

[SM]

Says at least 100k~ people that liked that post.

How many shows have gone from hero to zero so quickly?

Quickly? There's already hype around the prequel show coming out, I still see plenty of references in other media.

 

[bourbons]

Says at least 100k~ people that liked that post.

How many shows have gone from hero to zero so quickly?

All of them?

I don't really understand the contention - do shows generally get written about for months or years after they finish?

 

[SM]

All of them?

I don't really understand the contention - do shows generally get written about for months or years after they finish?

And I mean, here we are, writing about the show, months after it finished..

 

[Vader]

One as in Best Drama + Best Supporting Actor? (not to mention all the "non-major" creatives, like Editing, Sound Editing, Score, Makeup, Visual Effects, etc. i.e. things you would win an Oscar for)

None of the other drama series won any more awards than GoT.

Here is the list of 2019 GoT nominations - winners are in bold:
Outstanding Drama Series
Outstanding Lead Actor - Kit Harrington
Outstanding Lead Actress - Emilia Clarke
Outstanding Supporting Actor - Nikolaj Coster-Waldau
Outstanding Supporting Actor - Peter Dinklage
Outstanding Supporting Actress - Lena Headey
Outstanding Supporting Actress - Sophie Turner
Outstanding Supporting Actress - Maisie Williams
Outstanding Supporting Actress - Gwendoline Christie
Outstanding Guest Actress - Carice van Houten
Outstanding Directing - D.B. Weiss
Outstanding Directing - David Nutter
Outstanding Directing - Miguel Sapochnik
Outstanding Sci-Fi/Fantasy Costumes
Outstanding Hair Styling for a Single-Camera Series - The Long Night (I s**t you not... this is really a category) (how could they even see the hair styles in the pitch black?)
Outstanding Main Title Design
Outstanding Make-Up for a Single-Camera Series
Outstanding Music Composition for a Series (Original Dramatic Score)
Outstanding Prosthetic Make-Up for a Series, Limited Series, Movie or Special
Outstanding Single-Camera Picture Editing for a Drama Series - Katie Weiland
Outstanding Single-Camera Picture Editing for a Drama Series - Tim Porter
Outstanding Single-Camera Picture Editing for a Drama Series - Winterfell
Outstanding Sound Editing for a Comedy or Drama Series
Outstanding Sound Mixing for a Comedy or Drama Series (One Hour)
Outstanding Special Visual Effects
Outstanding Stunt Coordination for a Drama Series, Limited Series or Movie
Outstanding Writing for a Drama Series - David Benioff & D.B. Weiss
Outstanding Production Design for a Narrative Period or Fantasy Program (One Hour or More)
Outstanding Casting for a Drama Series
Outstanding Cinematography for a Single-Camera Series (One Hour)
Outstanding Creative Achievement in Interactive Media Within A Scripted Program

To be honest, I wasn't aware that they had won so many in the technical categories. What I did know was that they had multiple acting nominations, with Dinklage their only winner. Note the 4 nominations in the Outstanding Supporting Actress category - this is exceedingly unusual, and only happened on this occasion because the actors nominated themselves.

I don't begrudge GoT it's wins in the technical categories. It was superbly produced, and fully deserved to win in these categories.

However, it was just really badly written, and not overly well acted. It's a joke that the DBs were nominated for Outstanding Writing, given how badly they murdered S8.

 

[Marlowe]

Game of Thrones the new "no one ever talks about Avatar" and both are gonna permeate the next decade with sequels/prequels.

 

[Bomberboyokay]

"Who talks about shows after they've ended though lol???"

That's misleading. People have conversations about the end of Breaking Bad, The Sopranos, The Wire, etc and what-it-all-meant. People haven't been doing that with Game of Thrones. Next to nobody is wondering what happens next for Jon, Arya and Redhead.

 

[Roobs321]

GoT won plenty of awards in the earlier seasons... but next to nothing for S8, because it was utter garbage.

It tied its own record for most Emmys won by a single season. What are you smoking?

 

[Roobs321]

"Who talks about shows after they've ended though lol???"

That's misleading. People have conversations about the end of Breaking Bad, The Sopranos, The Wire, etc and what-it-all-meant. People haven't been doing that with Game of Thrones. Next to nobody is wondering what happens next for Jon, Arya and Redhead.

Breaking Bad took a few years to really penetrate pop culture. I was watching it from the beginning, and it wasn't until about S4 that randoms had seen it. The Wire was even worse in that regard, I'd imagine 90% of Wire fans today didn't even start watching it until after it had finished (I myself only started watching between S4 & 5). And The Sopranos was notorious in Australia for its volatile broadcast scheduling and, like Mad Men, easily bypassed a lot of people (not to mention TV having a different reputation then, let alone cable TV). Compare that to Game of Thrones which mostly everyone was watching at least half a decade ago, from middle-aged to little kids.

Breaking Bad had a fairly clean bow-tie ending which people had expected. People weren't necessarily talking avidly about that ending a year later. The Wire's final season was seen as a mild disappointment.

TV shows aren't made so that we talk endlessly about how they end. There have been some ordinary shows that had excellent endings, and some masterful shows that had fizzled endings or even cruel cancelled endings. But if the show has been going for several seasons, it has already put enough in the bank for the ending to not taint the show. Even something as endgame-bent as GoT always tended to be.

In all honesty, if a show has to have a poor episode somewhere, I'd prefer it to be the finale. Push it as far away from the start as possible. Shows shouldn't be given the benefit of the doubt just because they had some garbage filler along the run and then went out beautifully.

When people talk about TV as being like a book, they tend to be talking about a season, rather than an entire show run. A song of fire & ice is more of a chronicle, and GRR Martin released it (unfinished) in several books, underline the plural.

 

[SM]

"Who talks about shows after they've ended though lol???"

That's misleading. People have conversations about the end of Breaking Bad, The Sopranos, The Wire, etc and what-it-all-meant. People haven't been doing that with Game of Thrones. Next to nobody is wondering what happens next for Jon, Arya and Redhead.

That's a fallacy. Stop hating on things because it gets you off, it's getting real old.

 

[bourbons]

"Who talks about shows after they've ended though lol???"

That's misleading. People have conversations about the end of Breaking Bad, The Sopranos, The Wire, etc and what-it-all-meant. People haven't been doing that with Game of Thrones. Next to nobody is wondering what happens next for Jon, Arya and Redhead.

Hmm maybe, impossible to measure I suppose.

Reckon I've had about the same amount of post show discussion re: GoT as I did with BB. Not that there's really much to discuss at the finish of both shows, pretty conclusive. Guess I wouldn't mind knowing what Jon's up to beyond the wall lol

 

[Gasometer]

My teen read me this this morning and I replied it’s no different to when anything ends...a Band, a career, a movie series and TV Shows...and then time brings it back with nostalgia

GoT will be judged favourably in time






And that’s regardless of the last 3 pages)

 

[Vader]

It tied its own record for most Emmys won by a single season. What are you smoking?

It won a heap in the technical categories, and those wins were richly deserved - the production values were exceptional (as you'd expect given the budget). S8 won very little outside of those categories, particularly when you consider the number of nominations they put themselves up for.

S7 & S8 destroyed the legacy, of what was at the time rated one of the greatest shows on television.

 

[estibador]

I recently read some interesting comments on another forum which resonated with me. The thread was actually about Dexter but obviously the point applies to many tv shows:

"Since I remember episodic television from the 1980's and 90's pretty well, and how most seasons had at least 8 or 9 filler episodes out of 24, and the ones that were good weren't that great to begin with. Back in the day we were happy to get five or six solid X-Files episodes per season.

I think you're all just a little too spoiled for your own good. Somehow modern television started being held to absolutely inhuman unfair standards, where every single episode must be the equivalent of a 4 star film. Yeah that mindset is not very rational. The Sopranos, Breaking Bad and The Wire managed to create a new category of unbearable elitist snobbery.

As far as times changing and having to adjust to the new standards constantly being set. I don't buy into that one little bit. Because the standard is way too high and quite frankly unreasonable and people are getting more and more in the know, smarmy and full of it by the day.

It's people that need to change, not the shows. We've lost our innocence, we've gotten too hip, too obnoxious and too savvy, and it's robbed us of the joy being beguiled by the magic of storytelling."

Now I'm not saying my way of consuming tv is right and other people are wrong, but I'll never understand the thought process behind watching something for enjoyment only to make a concerted effort to self-sabotage that enjoyment in order to prove how 'hip, savvy and intelligent' you are.

It's not some mark of intelligence to poke holes and tear something apart. On the contrary, it's the easiest thing in the world to do. I'm quite happy to suspend disbelief (within reason) in order to enjoy something, and I hope I never lose that.

 

[Vader]

I recently read some interesting comments on another forum which resonated with me. The thread was actually about Dexter but obviously the point applies to many tv shows:

"Since I remember episodic television from the 1980's and 90's pretty well, and how most seasons had at least 8 or 9 filler episodes out of 24, and the ones that were good weren't that great to begin with. Back in the day we were happy to get five or six solid X-Files episodes per season.

I think you're all just a little too spoiled for your own good. Somehow modern television started being held to absolutely inhuman unfair standards, where every single episode must be the equivalent of a 4 star film. Yeah that mindset is not very rational. The Sopranos, Breaking Bad and The Wire managed to create a new category of unbearable elitist snobbery.

As far as times changing and having to adjust to the new standards constantly being set. I don't buy into that one little bit. Because the standard is way too high and quite frankly unreasonable and people are getting more and more in the know, smarmy and full of it by the day.

It's people that need to change, not the shows. We've lost our innocence, we've gotten too hip, too obnoxious and too savvy, and it's robbed us of the joy being beguiled by the magic of storytelling."

Now I'm not saying my way of consuming tv is right and other people are wrong, but I'll never understand the thought process behind watching something for enjoyment only to make a concerted effort to self-sabotage that enjoyment in order to prove how 'hip, savvy and intelligent' you are.

It's not some mark of intelligence to poke holes and tear something apart. On the contrary, it's the easiest thing in the world to do. I'm quite happy to suspend disbelief (within reason) in order to enjoy something, and I hope I never lose that.

What The Wire, Breaking Bad, and The Sopranos did differently was that they moved away from the 22/24 episode per season model. This allowed them to remove those filler episodes, using only as many episodes as they had story to tell. This allowed them to have a much higher average standard than the old 22/24 eps per season shows.

Where GoT fell down, particularly in S8, was that they tried to tell too much story in too few episodes. The DBs made a conscious decision to finish it in 6 episodes. Make no bones about it - this was their decision, not HBO's. They rushed the ending to the extent that it just made no sense - Dany went from being the saviour of the innocent to Mad Queen for no reason, without giving themselves time to show and explain her transition.

Mind you, it's also reviled because the DBs wrote some absolute garbage which made no sense at the time, and still doesn't - think resurrected Dothraki hordes and laser guided ballistas (and many other examples). The end of GoT was almost as bad as the final episode of Dexter, which is almost universally rated as the worst show ending of all time.

The reason we hold GoT to such a high standard is because that's the standard it set - and achieved regularly - for most of its run. Seasons 1-5 were some of the best television ever made. These seasons truly were magical storytelling... In contrast, seasons 7 & 8 were some of the most visually spectacular but woefully written television ever made. Yes, it's unfair to hold every show to a gold standard - but it's not unfair when the show spent most of its run operating at that level.

 

[SM]

I still don't get why people conveniently leave Season 6 out of discussion. Is it because it's a fantastic season that doesn't suit the narrative that D&D were s**t once the material ran out?

 

[Kirby]

I still don't get why people conveniently leave Season 6 out of discussion. Is it because it's a fantastic season that doesn't suit the narrative that D&D were s**t once the material ran out?

Correct.

 

[Vader]

I still don't get why people conveniently leave Season 6 out of discussion. Is it because it's a fantastic season that doesn't suit the narrative that D&D were s**t once the material ran out?

Probably because S6 wasn't shortened, and condensed to the point that the writing became unintelligible. S6 told 1 season's worth of story in 10 episodes. S7 & S8 attempted to fit 5 seasons of story into 13 episodes - it's no wonder they failed miserably.