Mega Thread General MFC Discussion Part III

[Johnny Karate]

I think so too, haven't heard a peep from the club re: vaccines. Up to him whether he wants to sacrifice his career or not.

He’s actually spoken out about it. It’s in an article on abc news. He’s vaccinated and is in favour of certain professions such as front line health workers having mandatory vaccines but believes that it’s unethical to force footballers to have it.

I don’t really agree with him but it’s not crazy Qanon/hivis logic, that’s worth getting into a pointless online shitfight about.

Just glad that he’s vaxxed and he’s absolutely entitled to his opinion.

Vaccinated AFL player against mandatory COVID jabs as AFLW player tests positive

Vaccinated Melbourne premiership star Tom McDonald says forcing players to get inoculated against COVID-19 is "ethically wrong", and an AFLW player reportedly tells her club she is not getting the shot.

www.abc.net.au

 

[schmuttt]

He’s actually spoken out about it. It’s in an article on abc news. He’s vaccinated and is in favour of certain professions such as front line health workers having mandatory vaccines but believes that it’s unethical to force footballers to have it.

I don’t really agree with him but it’s not crazy Qanon/hivis logic, that’s worth getting into a pointless online shitfight about.

Just glad that he’s vaxxed and he’s absolutely entitled to his opinion.

Vaccinated AFL player against mandatory COVID jabs as AFLW player tests positive

Vaccinated Melbourne premiership star Tom McDonald says forcing players to get inoculated against COVID-19 is "ethically wrong", and an AFLW player reportedly tells her club she is not getting the shot.

www.abc.net.au

Pleasantly surprised he is vaccinated tbh

 

[jhong]

Who would of believed T-Mac and premiership star would have ever ended up in the same sentence. He is as entitled to an opinion as every one else , no one is forced to listen .

 

[KickLongTackleHard]

This video popped up as a suggestion on YouTube after watching Ronald Dale with the 2021 premiership cup, very good video summary on the history of his Melbourne days and move to Carlton, highly recommend:

 

[Gysberts2Bate]

Pleasantly surprised he is vaccinated tbh

I dare say he wouldn’t be if he wasn’t a footballer

 

[AmericanAFL]

He’s actually spoken out about it. It’s in an article on abc news. He’s vaccinated and is in favour of certain professions such as front line health workers having mandatory vaccines but believes that it’s unethical to force footballers to have it.

I don’t really agree with him but it’s not crazy Qanon/hivis logic, that’s worth getting into a pointless online shitfight about.

Just glad that he’s vaxxed and he’s absolutely entitled to his opinion.

Vaccinated AFL player against mandatory COVID jabs as AFLW player tests positive

Vaccinated Melbourne premiership star Tom McDonald says forcing players to get inoculated against COVID-19 is "ethically wrong", and an AFLW player reportedly tells her club she is not getting the shot.

www.abc.net.au

Pretty reasonable positions by Tmac in my opinion.

 

[Toump Ass]

Always been a bit special, my boy Tom.
I seen him out and about, had to bite my tounge to not ask him if his mother still dressed him.
The haircut's a bit of a giveaway too, isn't it. Not quite right I reckon.

Is Mad Cow Disease still a thing?

 

[Grimesy87]

Pretty reasonable positions by Tmac in my opinion.

Some posters just got to pick I reckon.

Agree with everything he said.

 

[djpaulydemon]

Heard on the radio Tmac spoke out on vaccines, was hoping he wasn't anti vax and was pleasantly surprised.

His arguments are fine, no one should be forced to get a vax, but at the same time the AFL has has lost a lot of money and collective time and effort to keep the last 2 seasons alive. They are in their rights to prevent players from travelling, training and playing etc. if players players refuse, now that they have a very effient way of preventing outbreaks. Playing AFL is always a privilege and not really a right in my mind.

Its a non issue anyway a very high % of AFL players will be voluntarily vaxxed as they have so much access to doctors and good info. And the motivation to avoid all the protocols. Now that we can reflect a tiny bit it was a pretty awesome collective effort from AFL, clubs and players to avoid outbreaks like they did.

 

[mrmonkey]

Heard on the radio Tmac spoke out on vaccines, was hoping he wasn't anti vax and was pleasantly surprised.

His arguments are fine, no one should be forced to get a vax, but at the same time the AFL has has lost a lot of money and collective time and effort to keep the last 2 seasons alive. They are in their rights to prevent players from travelling, training and playing etc. if players players refuse, now that they have a very effient way of preventing outbreaks. Playing AFL is always a privilege and not really a right in my mind.

Its a non issue anyway a very high % of AFL players will be voluntarily vaxxed as they have so much access to doctors and good info. And the motivation to avoid all the protocols. Now that we can reflect a tiny bit it was a pretty awesome collective effort from AFL, clubs and players to avoid outbreaks like they did.

It's really beyond the AFL's control with vaccine mandates. It's a national competition that requires travelling all over the country and to be able to do that you need to be vaccinated.

 

[Gysberts2Bate]

Weid would be shattered that TMac got the vaccine IMO, would have been holding his breath

 

[JP2]

His arguments are fine, no one should be forced to get a vax

No player would be "forced" to get a vax, any more than they are presently "forced" to train, or "forced" to risk injury by chasing a piece of leather around a field for a couple of hours every week. These are simply among the requirements of being an AFL footballer, and if any of these impositions are too terrifying for any players to abide by, then they are free to walk away from their six-figure contracts and spend their time curating posts on patriot-nature-news.biz with all their bleach-injecting, conspiracy-mongering friends instead. Freedom doesn't mean doing whatever you want and having the world bend to your will, it means the ability to make choices, and the choice in this case will be entirely in the players' hands. Don't want the vaccine? Fine, that's up to them. But the consequences of that decision will be spelled out for them, and they will hold ultimately responsibility for whatever happens to them should they choose to go down that path.

 

[00Stinger]

‘Not just about you’: Backlash erupts after AFL star’s vaccination claim

AFL greats have hit out at people’s reasons for opposing Covid-19 vaccination as the issue comes to the forefront in the footy world.

www.news.com.au

When you have a bloke like Adam Cooney

Adam Cooney

Age

38

Ht

187cm

Wt

83kg

Pos.

Fwd

Career

Season

Last 5

D

21.7

5star

K

11.5

4star

HB

10.2

5star

M

4.0

4star

T

2.7

4star

G

0.8

4star

No current season stats available

D

10.2

3star

K

6.6

3star

HB

3.6

3star

M

2.6

3star

T

2.0

4star

G

0.8

4star

opposing your views that is probably a good thing, Cooney would have to be the dumbest mother *er going around

Also can some explain this to me.

If you get the vaccine so that your symptoms aren't as bad but you can still catch covid and pass it on to others, than how is it selfish for someone not to get the vaccine if they don't want to?

I mean they are only really putting themselves at risk, not others

 

[schmuttt]

‘Not just about you’: Backlash erupts after AFL star’s vaccination claim

AFL greats have hit out at people’s reasons for opposing Covid-19 vaccination as the issue comes to the forefront in the footy world.

www.news.com.au

When you have a bloke like Adam Cooney opposing your views that is probably a good thing, Cooney would have to be the dumbest mother f***er going around

Also can some explain this to me.

If you get the vaccine so that your symptoms aren't as bad but you can still catch covid and pass it on to others, than how is it selfish for someone not to get the vaccine if they don't want to?

I mean they are only really putting themselves at risk, not others

Vaccinated people have a much lower viral load so are less infectious in general. It is also selfish not getting the vaccine as otherwise the health system gets overwhelmed and due to the requirements for a COVID ward and COVID patients in ICU means we run out of beds.

 

[00Stinger]

Vaccinated people have a much lower viral load so are less infectious in general. It is also selfish not getting the vaccine as otherwise the health system gets overwhelmed and due to the requirements for a COVID ward and COVID patients in ICU means we run out of beds.

ok so if the viral load is lower in vaccinated people I can agree with that.

The health system getting overloaded I kind of agree but can't help but find the messaging round it contradicting especially when you look at the high percentage of people who are in there in the first place because of their own actions

I mean do we call morbidly obese people, smokers, alcoholics or people with drug overdoses selfish for taking up ICU beds?

 

[Toump Ass]

That vaccinated people are less likely to transmit the virus to other people- including those who can't get the vaccine (ie: young kids, because the vaccine isn't approved for them yet), is enough reason to consider Tom's opinion just a bit selfish IMO.

And why wouldn't you want to reduce the load on a health system that's bursting?

My in-law works at Peter McCallum and they've started seeing cancer patients with COVID now. Dunno if some of them just couldn't be vaccinated because of severely compromised immune systems, or they were vaccinated but still got COVID, but it's pretty ****ed.

Two in-laws are health workers and they've had it bloody tough for two years now. I dunno how they do it.

 

[Bluelegs]

ok so if the viral load is lower in vaccinated people I can agree with that.

The health system getting overloaded I kind of agree but can't help but find the messaging round it contradicting especially when you look at the high percentage of people who are in there in the first place because of their own actions

I mean do we call morbidly obese people, smokers, alcoholics or people with drug overdoses selfish for taking up ICU beds?

Not as much because Hospitals can account for those loads over long periods of time. Infectious viral diseases have the capacity to spread quickly and overwhelm the system.

 

[00Stinger]

Not as much because Hospitals can account for those loads over long periods of time. Infectious viral diseases have the capacity to spread quickly and overwhelm the system.

Yeah fair enough

I don't necessarily disagree with the selfish call, I just find it weird that it is acceptable to call someone who doesn't want to take a vaccine that has been rushed selfish as they can contribute to overloading the system yet if I dare say the same thing to an obese person for instance I am public enemy number 1 and am bang out of order

Even funnier that if this pandemic has taught me anything it is that 90+% of people are self centered in a crisis, yet the same people aren't afraid to call out everyone else over selfishness

 

[Toump Ass]

To be fair there is a lot of nuance around the mandatory vaccine discussion which can't be articulated in a 30 second sound-byte, so even if Tom doesn't appear to be the smartest bloke in the world I'm not going to assume I know exactly what he thinks.

I mentioned elsewhere I had complications after my first Pfizer dose (I had my second and was fine), but I was told the vaccine might not have been effective on me given the state of my immune system.

So while I've got a horse in the race, I think there are some reasonable arguments as to why mandating vaccines isn't the right thing to do: for one, we are segregating a part of the community and potentially pushing them towards that weird and wonderful world of right wing anti-vax fascism, and I think there is some merit in saying that people should have autonomy of their own bodies and choose what they put into them.

That said, a compelling counter-argument might simply be: "Sure, but stop being a campaigner".

In any case, I'm more triggered by Tom's diet and the fact that he has a poster of himself in his own house than his health advice.

 

[00Stinger]

To be fair there is a lot of nuance around the mandatory vaccine discussion which can't be articulated in a 30 second sound-byte, so even if Tom doesn't appear to be the smartest bloke in the world I'm not going to assume I know exactly what he thinks.

I mentioned elsewhere I had complications after my first Pfizer dose (I had my second and was fine), but I was told the vaccine might not have been effective on me given the state of my immune system.

So while I've got a horse in the race, I think there are some reasonable arguments as to why mandating vaccines isn't the right thing to do: for one, we are segregating a part of the community and potentially pushing them towards that weird and wonderful world of right wing anti-vax fascism, and I think there is some merit in saying that people should have autonomy of their own bodies and choose what they put into them.

That said, a compelling counter-argument might simply be: "Sure, but stop being a campaigner".

In any case, I'm more triggered by Tom's diet and the fact that he has a poster of himself in his own house than his health advice.

Yeah by segregating people who don't want to vaccinate I feel they are just pushing those people towards right wing extremism. Plus I feel the messaging from the government, media and in general a large % of the public is creating more harm than good.

Isn't it the job of the government especially to make everyone feel welcomed and included not outcast and segregated? Are we not an inclusive society? Does our national anthem not insinuate that we are a free nation? Because honestly I am starting to think we aren't.

Could they not use better messaging in promoting the vaccine than if you don't you are a 'covidiot' or an 'extremist' or whatever it may be.

Of the say 10% of the population that don't want the vaccine I would hazard a guess that probably 50% of them are scared for whatever reason and with some better promotion and messaging could be enticed into getting the jab. But the hardline 'If you don't get it you are outcast from society' is only pushing them further away and closer to the right wing extremism. Of course there is always a small % of the population that are anti vax on all vaccines but there is clearly a substantial amount of people who have had all other vaccines and even giving them to their children but are reluctant on this one.

Of course on the flip side I do realize that there are a lot of idiots out there that sometimes need to be pushed in the right direction to do things but i don't think the government and media have gone about it in the right way

 

[djpaulydemon]

No player would be "forced" to get a vax, any more than they are presently "forced" to train, or "forced" to risk injury by chasing a piece of leather around a field for a couple of hours every week. These are simply among the requirements of being an AFL footballer, and if any of these impositions are too terrifying for any players to abide by, then they are free to walk away from their six-figure contracts and spend their time curating posts on patriot-nature-news.biz with all their bleach-injecting, conspiracy-mongering friends instead. Freedom doesn't mean doing whatever you want and having the world bend to your will, it means the ability to make choices, and the choice in this case will be entirely in the players' hands. Don't want the vaccine? Fine, that's up to them. But the consequences of that decision will be spelled out for them, and they will hold ultimately responsibility for whatever happens to them should they choose to go down that path.

Not sure if you are directing your post at me but I was essentially making a similar point. AFL players can't really be forced as they have options to leave and do something else if they truly want to.

 

[Bluelegs]

Fwiw, while I don't agree with Tmac here I certainly don't think his opinion is that outlandish or worthy of the ridiculous reaction some have had to it.

For mine, his argument only works if you accept that we would have gotten to 90% vaccination rate without a mandate which I'm not convinced of.

 

[schmuttt]

Fwiw, while I don't agree with Tmac here I certainly don't think his opinion is that outlandish or worthy of the ridiculous reaction some have had to it.

For mine, his argument only works if you accept that we would have gotten to 90% vaccination rate without a mandate which I'm not convinced of.

It isn't an outrageous opinion even if I think he is wrong. Was quite watered down from what I expected following his social media.

Of the say 10% of the population that don't want the vaccine I would hazard a guess that probably 50% of them are scared for whatever reason and with some better promotion and messaging could be enticed into getting the jab. But the hardline 'If you don't get it you are outcast from society' is only pushing them further away and closer to the right wing extremism. Of course there is always a small % of the population that are anti vax on all vaccines but there is clearly a substantial amount of people who have had all other vaccines and even giving them to their children but are reluctant on this one.

Don't disagree the messaging has been poor but we are headed for one of the highest vaccination rates worldwide, so either way the population seems to be pretty compliant.

 

[djpaulydemon]

Fwiw, while I don't agree with Tmac here I certainly don't think his opinion is that outlandish or worthy of the ridiculous reaction some have had to it.

For mine, his argument only works if you accept that we would have gotten to 90% vaccination rate without a mandate which I'm not convinced of.

Thats very true. I still have some people I used to work in a warehouse with on social media and they feel like they were forced to get a vax because they would of been fired if they didn't.

They wouldn't have got it without a mandate. Now they probably dislike the gov and employers even more, but have potentially saved themselves or their family from being hospitalised and improving their chances of getting treatment for something unrelated like a cancer biopsy that becomes easier to get with less pressure on hospital systems. They wouldn't have been persuaded by any amount of evidence or role models advocating for a vax.

Hard to tell whether those type of people become more alienated and conspiritorial or they realise getting a vax doesn't negatively affect them as much as expected.

 

[stEdy]

Australians just don't have the ideological fervour of most other countries.

We want to go to the pub and want to go on holidays.

We're approaching one of the highest vaccination rates in the world because people who originally have opposed getting the vaccine are changing their minds - maybe because they're seeing friends/families in their circles actually get quite sick, or maybe because they want to go on holidays.

Our compliance has worked out really well for us in this situation. America only has 66% single dosed - that is a disgrace.

It's sad that a public health measure for the health and safety of all has become so politically charged and divisive.