Rumour GFC 2021 Player Trading, Drafting FA, Rumours and Wish lists

[Catsmaninamerica]

No Duncan though…hmmm


On iPhone using BigFooty.com mobile app

i have him on a back flank, replacing Oconnor

 

[Cataholic]

So on the bottom for 5 years! Melbourne must had at least 10 1st rounder on their list by being cellar dwellers for a decade.

Quite a few of us watched the side meander through 40 odd years of achieving absolutely nothing to see 2007 - 11.

Now another 10 years have already passed us by.

That's what, 55 years of footy for the 3 premierships? I'd say we're fairly hardened and not so brittle as to fall into despair if we drop out of the 8. It's very familiar territory.....

 

[Catsmaninamerica]

We beat the Premiers twice in 2013 during the season. Failed in finals.
1-1 with the premiers in 2014, failed in finals.
2-0 against the premiers in 2016, failed in finals.
1-0 against the premiers in 2017, failed in finals.
1-0 against the premiers in 2019, failed in finals.

You can call it doomsdayers all you want, Scott is now a master in failure, his teams reputation is finals bottlers, at the end of the day who cares about Rd23 in the QF we were atrocious and in the PF Scott turned us into a meme club and the only saving grace is they did a number on the dogs so our loss isn't as embarrassing. But don't be mistaken this club is an abject finals bottle job waiting to happen every September. We haven't had a positive finals series since 2011. Best we have done was 2w2l which resulted in a GF loss where we bottled a half time lead.

Hang on. A master failure and a meme club? You’re actually either a child, or have an iq of sub 60. He’s won a premiership as a coach and had us finish top 4 a record amount of times. You spoiled entitled
Brat. Clearly you have no memory of the 70’s 80’s or 90’s and, you have no concept of how hard flags are to win. This board has descended into a breeding ground for halfwits and babies.

 

[MacStradbroke]

Melbourne has shown that their list management, gameplan, strategies etc have been far better than ours.

It's up to CS & Co to either concede that, or ignore the evidence.

Yeah they’ve benefitted from being shit..for a very long time. I don’t like that approach.

 

[catman2006]

if you want to ignore injuries and a virus that came in September, that’s your prerogative. To win a flag, you need everything to go right. And
Your best midfielder getting a broken hand, and your best player and defender breaking a foot, and a virus sweeping through the changing rooms isn’t everything going right. I’m jot suggesting we would have won the flag by the way. I’m suggesting that if 4 young players have outstanding summers and improve, we could easily be around the mark next year, and there’s no cause for panic just yet.

We are miles off we had a chance to beat Port and we failed badly, struggled against a 2nd string GWS team and no one was going to beat Melb this year only saving grace, we need to revamp a more offensive backline add more pace to the midfield and get the half forward line working that will take more than 4 new players. Being around the mark isn't good enough we have had that past 5 years and we have a grand final appearance to show for it which was done on the back of attacking footy.

 

[CatToTheFuture]

Melbourne only got that by being absolute sh*t for many years plus dodgy afl compo (see frawley) thats not a plan to follow and we would be silly to try. Even in our bad years we wont drop enough to get top 5 picks..we just have to maximise what picks we will have.

We can try fluke a compo pick though. Extend and back end Parfitt, Henry, Miers. If they end up getting a big dollar offer somewhere at a time when we are possibly not very good we might fluke something.

 

[Cataholic]

Yeah they’ve benefitted from being sh*t..for a very long time. I don’t like that approach.

To be fair, that's how the AFL's equalisation process is meant to work.

The more successful you are, the tighter the tap to talent is turned off. Eventually you're dragged down.

Then the tap is steadily opened up the more unsuccessful you become.....

Of course, that's simplistic, and if a club is just inept, well, they get to blow up the free ride they receive.

We've done well to defy the force of gravity, but we either have to become much smarter with our strategies, or take a fall.

 

[MacStradbroke]

This is definitely a fair point, and should really be included in any conversation when it comes to the sheer talent differential between our two sides.

This is a breakdown of all their first and second round picks:

Pick 2 - Christian Petracca
Pick 3 - Clayton Oliver
Pick 3 - Christian Salem
Pick 3 - Luke Jackson
Pick 3 - Angus Brayshaw
Pick 12 - Kysaiah Pickett
Pick 14 (traded in) - Jake Lever
Pick 21 - Jake Bowey
Pick 26 (F/S) - Jack Viney
Pick 28 - Tom Sparrow
Pick 29 - Charlie Spargo
Pick 31 - Bayley Fritsch
Pick 32 - Trent Rivers
Pick 33 - James Jordon (sub)
Pick 34 - Max Gawn
Pick 37 - Harrison Petty

***************

16/23 players all first and second round draft picks, with 7 first round draft picks (1 traded in) and 5 Top 10 draft picks, amongst them. Only Brown, Langdon, Neal-Bullen, May, McDonald, Hibberd and Harmes (7/23 players), as draft picks from the 3rd round onwards.

They deserve every single accolade this season, and were phenomenal during the finals, but it's hard to argue that they haven't been blessed with a metric sh*t ton of talent to get them there

Yeah the system is set up to do exactly this, reward ordinary teams with success if they are half remotely run well. Good luck to them.

 

[feelinfeline]

Food for thought. Demons won last night with 2 fairly average tall forwards. They won with a crop of mids that have been together for a number of years - mainly Petracca, Oliver and Brayshaw. Very similar to our team when Bartel, Ablett, Corey had matured. Our forwards in Mooney, N.Ablett and even Hawkins at that time we’re the best in the comp.

It’s elite midfields with finals game plans that win premierships.

Ben Brown is far better than 'fairly average' and played a very good game.

And Fritsch, a mid-size forward with a very good leap, played superbly in his biggest game (Hello, Gary Rohan).

There are definitely similarities between our 2007 midfield and Melbourne's now. And, yes, their midfield is elite and far better than ours currently.

Also, we don't have a player like Martin or Petracca who can tear a game apart. Dangerfield has done it but not in big finals, and is now probably past his best. Selwood is definitely past his best but still gives his all. No-one else we have has stepped up to replace them or looks like doing so.

 

[tielgaz]

if you want to ignore injuries and a virus that came in September, that’s your prerogative. To win a flag, you need everything to go right. And
Your best midfielder getting a broken hand, and your best player and defender breaking a foot, and a virus sweeping through the changing rooms isn’t everything going right. I’m jot suggesting we would have won the flag by the way. I’m suggesting that if 4 young players have outstanding summers and improve, we could easily be around the mark next year, and there’s no cause for panic just yet.

And the other 10 years (with the exception of last year)?

 

[CatToTheFuture]

Yep, we've got a great H & A record, but the group and gameplan has clearly proven incapable of stepping up for finals over the same journey, and never has it been more cruelly and brutally exposed than in the last PF.

We've defied the equalisation process so far, but we've been stuck between the twixt and the twain too.........some hard calls need to be made across the group, strategy, and coaching, and it's good to see Hocking starting that process.

Mind you, I can't help but wonder if Scarlett gave Scott some brutal home truths and paid the price for it.

No doubt Scarlett sees it that way. I would say Scarlett looks to be the one less capable of change though and is probably being called on it. Scarlo has had a massive d50 exit problem for years and at the same time has had a rebounding hbf kid who was tracking very well early in his career that he hasn't given opportunities to. Even if you don't think Clark is the solution, you have to say that our recent defensive success is down to other line coaches making changes to support him.

My guess is Scarlett was sacked for good reason

 

[Pollywaffle]

Would it be fair to say our game plan invites pressure due to the slow ball movement and with Finals the pressure goes up a notch?

Easy kill these days.
Love to be a fly on the wall during opposition pregame speeches v the Cats.
Nobody really fears us anymore, and we are seen as soft and panicky under pressure.
The age thing is an issue.
Perhaps the softness creeps in as players get older, losing that perception of indestructability. Fear of putting body on the line.
Young families, perspectives, priorities change. More likely to back off a bit, just pick up the pay check. Especially if coaches are picking you week in week out, season after season despite stinking it up.
In Geelong’s case throw in a number of players that were inherently soft from day one.
I doubt whether a team with an older demographic can compete wholeheartedly in today’s high contact run and gun style finals footy, and our repeated big stage failures have proven that the slowdown possession style just doesn’t really cut it anymore.

 

[MacStradbroke]

Agree, we need some aggression in the middle, Petracca type would be nice

He’s a Dangerfield clone

 

[afl genius]

Would it be fair to say our game plan invites pressure due to the slow ball movement and with Finals the pressure goes up a notch?

Yup, playing a defensive gameplan puts you on the back foot and just invites the pressure. Pressure goes up alot in finals and it usually results in the team looking ulgy. Scott still hasn't worked out after all there's years that its doesn't work, that's the worry

 

[Cataholic]

No doubt Scarlett sees it that way. I would say Scarlett looks to be the one less capable of change though and is probably being called on it. Scarlo has had a massive d50 exit problem for years and at the same time has had a rebounding hbf kid who was tracking very well early in his career that he hasn't given opportunities to. Even if you don't think Clark is the solution, you have to say that our recent defensive success is down to other one coaches making changes to support him.

My guess is Scarlett was sacked for good reason

Yeah, there appears to have been a 'disconnect' between the coaches at some point

Would be very interested to hear the circumstances around the blue they had. There's a rumour they almost came to blows.

 

[CatToTheFuture]

Food for thought. Demons won last night with 2 fairly average tall forwards. They won with a crop of mids that have been together for a number of years - mainly Petracca, Oliver and Brayshaw. Very similar to our team when Bartel, Ablett, Corey had matured. Our forwards in Mooney, N.Ablett and even Hawkins at that time we’re the best in the comp.

It’s elite midfields with finals game plans that win premierships.

100% this. And not just Melbourne but the Dogs too.

The failure rate on early KP players is just too high to reliably build on. If you take home the spoon and draft Jack Watts your draft haul is likely to be worse than the premiers.

Teens picks like SDK is about the earliest we should be looking at talls and even then I'd prefer Shannon Neale draft range selections.

Not really a problem for this draft though because we don't have early picks but there's mids available where we will have picks so let's fill our stockings

 

[MacStradbroke]

Yeah, there appears to have been a 'disconnect' between the coaches at some point

Would be very interested to hear the circumstances around the blue they had. There's a rumour they almost came to blows.

Now that would be good contest!

 

[bellpark]

Our issue is there is a massive gap between a midfield like Melbourne or the Dogs and us. We don’t have the depth by at least 2 or 3 dynamic hard running quick mids. That is a huge challenge to overcome.

 

[Lana]

Just to put the resource gap between us and Melbourne into an easy to understand form. We pulling some Oakland As level shit to get where we are.

The gap in total spend is equivalent to 6 pick 7s, I used pick 7 as the comparison as it is the highest pick we have used to acquire a player on our list.

They've almost spent the same value in trades to acquire player and almost double at the draft.

	Melbourne	Geelong	M spend to G spend Ratio
Drafted	23453	12321	1.9
Traded	5301	6625	0.8
Total	28754	18946	1.52
Trade to Draft ratio	0.23	0.54

Note: this is for player that are currently on their list and doesn't include the large numbers of Trengoves and Toumpas that they burnt to get here. They've burnt more early picks then we've had



Also last year our Cockatoo to Melbourne Future R3 to Pick 33 trades couldn't have gone any better, thanks GC, who continue their trend of giving up free DVI to anyone who asks politely

 

[Hamingja]

Gaz wasn’t even rated in the open market and it took a long time before he even was …many at the time said he was only picked because of his surname

don’t go reinventing history

He absolutely was rated as a late first rounder. It's a myth that people say he wasn't rated at all. He played rep football for Victoria / Victoria Country from primary school age.

 

[00VicWard001]

I don't mind everything EXCEPT , recruiting Dunkley or Conilgo, Why as they will cost us high end draft picks,and we need to us those picks to recruit the best players in the draft..
Over the next few years I would only try recruit big name players using RFA/UFA.. As we need to hit the draft using the picks in getting the best kids
There is no way Collingwood will deal that with Kreuger etc..
And also unfortunately Henderson doesn’t get a new deal, as I'd ratherive games int SDK, and usehis spot on a Kid

And if clubs play hardball over RFA agents - then walk away. The compensation system is there for a reason. Leave that salary headache with the other club if they don’t want to let their RFA go.

And by the same token - continue to be ruthless with the way we have trades recently. We’ve been too nice bringing players in and letting them go.

 

[Cataholic]

Now that would be good contest!

It would.

Not sure who'd I'd put my $ on!

 

[00VicWard001]

Food for thought. Demons won last night with 2 fairly average tall forwards. They won with a crop of mids that have been together for a number of years - mainly Petracca, Oliver and Brayshaw. Very similar to our team when Bartel, Ablett, Corey had matured. Our forwards in Mooney, N.Ablett and even Hawkins at that time we’re the best in the comp.

It’s elite midfields with finals game plans that win premierships.

And elite defence would be next in line too. Richmond showed this trait too.

 

[iameviljez]

Quite a few of us watched the side meander through 40 odd years of achieving absolutely nothing to see 2007 - 11.

Now another 10 years have already passed us by.

That's what, 55 years of footy for the 3 premierships? I'd say we're fairly hardened and not so brittle as to fall into despair if we drop out of the 8. It's very familiar territory.....

While I agree that pretty much any club can survive a prolonged period out of the finals, we have been extraordinarily blessed with consistency on that front.

Since 1991, we've missed the finals in... what? '93, '99, '01, '02, '03, '06, '15. That is literally it. For 30 years, that is an incredible level of consistency.

 

[CatsDoItBetter]

He absolutely was rated as a late first rounder. It's a myth that people say he wasn't rated at all. He played rep football for Victoria / Victoria Country from primary school age.

He was rated very highly and it was/is rated as the best draft we’ve had so he was being rated against some of the best. Junior (primary early high school) footy he mostly played forward. Nathan played through the midfield and was a better player at that stage.