How many mature players should we draft?

[SaintsSeptember]

There is a lot of talk about who we should draft rather than just the young kids in the draft.
A mature defender?
Jacobs?
Lower?
Cockie?
etc etc

How many of these sorts of players should we draft

By mature I mean players who have been on an AFL list before , or have played at state level because they werent drafted.

 

[hayes]

IMO, zero. You need to be careful with how many mature age players you draft and I think we've drafted enough lately. One at the most.

For the most part mature agers are what they are, young guys could be anything. You get nowhere playing it safe.

 

[Manimal_Dunstan]

I'd say 2 in the National draft. Seriously wish they didn't cut back the Rookie Lists.

 

[holllywood]

IMO, zero. You need to be careful with how many mature age players you draft and I think we've drafted enough lately. One at the most.

For the most part mature agers are what they are, young guys could be anything. You get nowhere playing it safe.

how old is 'mature'?

harry taylor was recruited as a 21 year old, and now he is an all-australian.

unless you consider mature to be over that? then you could argue geelong knew what they were getting with j-pod and it turned out okay for them.

'mature' shoudnt be treated as the same as 'recycled'. it can be perfect for players that are late bloomers or if a player has been identified to be able to plug a hole in a team (eg. j pod at geelong).

 

[Persevering Saint]

For mine, a mature strong bodied defender is going to HAVE to be mature aged, otherwise we'll just be setting ourselves up for a "Rocca vs Dawson" scenario. And I think if a good player like Cockie is still sitting there, why not take him?

1-2 for mine.

 

[hayes]

how old is 'mature'?

harry taylor was recruited as a 21 year old, and now he is an all-australian.

unless you consider mature to over that? then you could argue geelong knew what they were getting with j-pod and it turned out okay for them.

'mature' shoudnt be treated as the same as 'recycled'. it can be perfect for players that are late bloomers or if a player has been identified to be able to plug a hole in a team (eg. j pod at geelong).

If it were up to me I'd be going with a 21 and under policy. J-Pod filled a massive hole at FF for the Cats, most of the time around here people mention midfielders and I just don't see the point in that. It's not just about picking up a player, you're sacrificing a spot for another player that could've been anything.

 

[SaintsSeptember]

I guess by mature I mean someone who has either been on an AFL list already or has been playing at state level after being overlooked by the drart.

Dont mind the idea of a defender ( that big tassie guy looks good) for a late pick. But I prefer the earlier picks to be young guys. We already have Curran who will stuggle to get a game if no-one gets injured.

 

[hayes]

Probably should say like Geelong had a massive hole at FF, we have a massive hole at FB so I wouldn't be opposed to a mature aged player, but even then I wouldn't be going over 23 unless we're in a premiership window.

 

[SaintsSeptember]

Yeah we all have our own opinions, and even if the poll shows a majority its not to say the majority is right.
There was just so much discussion about drafting players like Cockie, Jacobs and others, I wondered if a lot of posters thought we should get more.
I wouldnt mind getting Wells at 26. Just because if he's OK we can buy some years until a defender develops.
( I think Brown was also around 25).

 

[SaintLex]

1-2:

I really like the idea of getting a mature age full back to plug our hole in defense. If he turns out to be a star, then great, we've got ourselves a bargain. If not, then there's another depth player who we can replace with a free agent or via trade at the end of 2013. A mature KPD is a must have, for me.

I also wouldn't be opposed to grabbing another mature age player, even if they don't fill an immediate and urgent need for next year but can add another mature body to the midfield once Joey, Dal and Lenny start to slow down a little bit. I guess it all depends on who is avaliable for this one - a late pick on a mature age player would probably be better than a late pick on an 18 year old who has question marks over certain areas of his game. At least with the mature player you pretty much know what you're going to get so it minimises the risk.

 

[Ducky Tie]

One mature aged key back. That's it.

 

[Highlander35]

A mature Key defender is pretty much a necessity.

Then I think that if we either have a really good draft (so we don't need anymore kids) or a really bad draft (we didn't really get any good ones), we should pick up a mature midfielder like Cockie or Cook.

 

[stkildathunda]

If the Best Available is a "mature" aged player then we must pick them, cant go overlooking guys just cos they arent 18 years old

 

[Plugger35]

I don't have any problem with drafting mature age players where you need a ready made player. Obviously we need a another big bodied key defender which you aren't going to get by drafting an 18 year old kid.

I'd prefer us to be drafting mainly kids but I'm not against drafting the odd mature aged player if they are under 25, still have the potential to be a good player and can fill a hole in your list. Probably don't want to be drafting any more than 1 or 2 mature age players per year though.

 

[SaintsSeptember]

If the Best Available is a "mature" aged player then we must pick them, cant go overlooking guys just cos they arent 18 years old

Makes no sense , because with the young players you are drafting potential.
Dean Polo would be a better player NOW than much of the draft.

 

[Plugger35]

Makes no sense , because with the young players you are drafting potential.
Dean Polo would be a better player NOW than much of the draft.

I think if you draft a mature age player they still need to have the potential to improve to become a better player, ie. someone like Cockie who never really got much of an opportunity at AFL level due to injuries, the strength of West Coast's midfield etc.

I can't see the point in recycling players like Polo who had plenty of opportunities at Richmond and failed, he was never going to improve as a player and it's no surprise he got delisted after a couple of years.

 

[Squizz]

I've got no issues with drafting multiple players, as long as they are still relatively young and have shown they are developing (not just older role players that don't have significant potential upside as Plugger alluded to, other than sometimes being able to prove a point in their first season).

With out list the way it is, I see no point punting on kids who didn't show that much at U/18 level - as opposed to (once we've exhausted any strong U/18 talent) guys who have had a breakout season in another league and are considered to have the ability to cope (and further improve) with AFL training loads.

 

[Tongue In Cheek]

Unless the club thinks we are a serious chance for top 4 and a flag tilt, none except where there is clear talent on display eg. Lee and Hickey.

Otherwise we have a plodder taking a spot on the list where we might be unearthing the next Siposs.

 

[Baldur]

If there is mature big defenders available then 1-2, otherwise none.

 

[SaintsSeptember]

Unless the club thinks we are a serious chance for top 4 and a flag tilt, none except where there is clear talent on display eg. Lee and Hickey.

Otherwise we have a plodder taking a spot on the list where we might be unearthing the next Siposs.

\

Its interesting if you go onto the main board, there is a thread about where people think all the teams will finish next season.
Personally I cant see StKilda going anywhere near the bottom 4 where most people have us.
A chance for top 4?
We were a "chance" last season but it was not realised, probably due to lack of depth in key area's.
All indicators are that the playing group and the coaches are pumping up for a big season.
As I've said before, the altitude training in the USA isn't something you'd waste money on if you werent giving it a shot.
Maybe the club is delusional, but I like to think that the truth is that BF are writing us off prematurely and I like that.

I like the idea of keeping one eye on the future though, which is what really pissed me off about Lyon.

I put 1-2 in the pole, but I'd be happier with one than 2 , and I wont be horribly disappointed if we take none.

 

[Tongue In Cheek]

\

Its interesting if you go onto the main board, there is a thread about where people think all the teams will finish next season.
Personally I cant see StKilda going anywhere near the bottom 4 where most people have us.

Agree, I think there's some wishful thinking going on on the parts of Saints haters.

I follow Riewoldt's logic regarding this year's result - the ladder doesn't lie. And while I don't predict doom and gloom for us, neither can I see where the real improvement's going to come from - yet. We're in a generational transition that is going to last a little longer than 2007's did.

As for altitude training, I think the club is subscribing to the idea that this is simply what a modern AFL team does. No complaints from me.

 

[Persevering Saint]

I think throwing a young guy in the KPF role is a recipe for disaster - it will create a mentality in them of getting beaten and intimidated, and that can be darn hard to break. I'd rather they learned their craft without too much pressure for the first few years until they are physically capable and have learned the tricks necessary for that role. It's no good having a kid have 7 kicked on him week-in-week-out, just to give them experience.

A mature ager in that role gives us time to let a few young uns develop, such as Lever.

 

[SaintsSeptember]

I think throwing a young guy in the KPF role is a recipe for disaster - it will create a mentality in them of getting beaten and intimidated, and that can be darn hard to break. I'd rather they learned their craft without too much pressure for the first few years until they are physically capable and have learned the tricks necessary for that role. It's no good having a kid have 7 kicked on him week-in-week-out, just to give them experience.

A mature ager in that role gives us time to let a few young uns develop, such as Lever.

Good Idea, I reckon Riewoldt, Wilkes, and maybe Lee (21 - 2 years younger than McEvoy ) would fit the bill.
( Lever is more a defender ).

 

[Persevering Saint]

Agh, I meant to say KPD!

 

[SaintsSeptember]

Agh, I meant to say KPD!

Haha , I thought your post was wackier than usual. I guess if we didn't have anyone else, the club would be inclined to persevere with Blake, Fisher, Gilbert and Dempster until someone else was good enough.
The only other factor is that aparently Lee was a very good defender before it was discovered that he was a very good forward.