Hubris

[Cursed Cat]

The thread is about Hawthorn's supposed hubris, in particular an article written by Rohan Connolly which alludes to Hawthorn taking it "one flag at a time"

For some reason, you've decided to write a 10,000 word essay on why you hate Hawthorn which traces all the way back to the day Leigh Mathews broke Neville Bruns' jaw. You close your petty, self-righteous diatribe with a gloat over Hawthorn losing the 2012 Grand Final and act as though you're above the trolling from Hawk fans

How is any of this relevant to the topic?

report it; have it removed, I don't care - it was the vibe, if that's not good enough I have no problems.

 

[Chewy]

report it; have it removed, I don't care - it was the vibe, if that's not good enough I have no problems.

That's not an answer to the question I asked .

I'm genuinely perplexed why you would catalog a lifetime's worth of angst regarding the Geelong vs Hawthorn rivalry into a thread about Hawthorn's (supposed) hubris

What was the relevance?

 

[Cursed Cat]

Your post was pretty accurate and well balanced until this paragraph. You're deluded if you think that decent in nastiness was initiated exclusively (or even largely) by Hawthorn supporters. The truth is the nasty chapter of the Hawthorn-Geelong rivalry stems from Geelong knowing they f#cked up in '08 and reacting to, an admittedly 'all to ready to mock', Hawthorn fan base by trying to discredit the flag in just about any and every way thinkable. This reaction was as widespread and as vitriolic as any 'campaign' that you're saying followed it. Apportion blame if you can from that knot of a scenario if you dare but the truth is that it has been a tit for tat conflict that started with the odd backhand and ballooned into deep rooted bitterness. To try to retrospectively apportion the lion's share of the blame to one of the parties is frankly just clutching a straws and if you were honest with yourself you'd admit that.

see my reaction to hk89's post, if you could be arsed.

In short :
of course my views tend towards favouring Geelong's BF supporter base, as your views will always support Hawthorns.

In one of my posts I mentioned that, personally, I didn't like those who attempted to discredit the 2008 win.
The 'campaign' that you mention (and that I coined ) has obviously cut pretty deep with many Hawthorn supporters.

Given some of the stuff that I mentioned earlier re : BF's Hawthorn fans undermining Geelong's (more significant) achievements, I can certainly attest to how annoying that is.
You could go back through my history and I never once mentioned 'luck' in relation to '08, let alone 'Bradbury', which was kinda stupid.
The whole BF Cold War is unworthy of the two teams, to be honest, but in many ways it is inevitable and self-perpetuating.

 

[seysearles]

see my reaction to hk89's post, if you could be arsed.

In short :
of course my views tend towards favouring Geelong's BF supporter base, as your views will always support Hawthorns

You should have stopped here.

If you acknowledge that fact don't then try to explain why Hawthorn are to blame for the animosity as a matter of analysis. It means bugger all besides self justification. Just be honest and say its a rivalry that both clubs are equally guilty of perpetuating.

 

[Vigawla]

Beware Cursed_Cat! Your posting on BF was not good enough! For shame.... You have been warned by the Hawthorn Internet Gods.
Seriously, relax guys. You sound like hounds taking apart a toy monkey.

To be relevant to the thread though. Hubris

 

[Pessimistic]

N

Just so you know;

- Hawthorn fans still feel aggrieved that Geelong supporters reacted badly after 2008 and called it a 'Bradbury premiership';
- Geelong fans still feel aggrieved that Hawthorn supporters cared more about rubbing salt in the wounds than celebrating their own success in 2008, and the fact they still gloat about it despite Geelong having won two flags since.

Neither supporter base will ever see eye to eye on this.

There were some reasonable Hawks supporters offering commiserations after '08 and likewise, Cats supporters dropping by your board with kind words. It's unfair to tarnish both supporter groups with the same brush.

No we were outraged that many of the cats fans used the word bradbury over and over but rarely used the word choke, which is, incidentally, applicable to both 2008 and 2012

 

[Pessimistic]

I said earlier and it's so true, your average hawks fan has never felt defeat on this level, never felt the pain and disappointment , there like that rich kid at school, remember the one who got the cool toys 8 months before Xmas - the same toys your dad busted his gut for too get you, and put under that tree. They have never truly appreciated the game in all respects as they have never been kicked in the guts, never suffered in support. hell just on Friday a bloke at work was telling me " we (hawks) have a Devine right to success, were not like your feral mob, we don't loose flags we WIN them"

Wonder how he's coping right now, funny thing is I probably won't even bother saying a word to him on Monday morning (if he even shows up!) this ones for him!

To be fair, many clubs have not been threatened with merger or closure, despite many clubs being in much deeper fiancial trouble than the hawks were in 96.

We really earned the chip on our shoulders.

I doubt many born australians have seen real hardship anyway

 

[enormohead1]

vaginal hubris?

 

[fpm84]

No we were outraged that many of the cats fans used the word bradbury over and over but rarely used the word choke, which is, incidentally, applicable to both 2008 and 2012

We didn't choke in 2008 and nor did you on Saturday. Both teams were beaten by superior opponents on the day. Both teams were also beaten by opponents that had far superior finals campaigns overall.

 

[fpm84]

I'm pretty sure that the root of this animosity is the fact that you felt hard done by for losing an un-losable flag. You may say that the hatred comes from Hawthorn supporters being bad winners. Either way losing is in it's nature humbling. We're copping it right now from just about every supporter group (unlike you in '08). The point i'm making is that I don't believe that we will hold a vendetta against Sydney in the same way you guys have towards us. Time may prove me wrong but its not the way I feel right now and it's not the impression i am getting from my fellow supporters. I would like to think we will rise above it. I certainly couldn't see us reveling in another team beating Sydney in next seasons grand final.

This is how you, a Hawthorn supporter, sees it.

The way I, a Geelong supporter, sees it is vastly different. I was abused at 3/4 time of the 2008 GF by Hawk supporters. For the record, I didn't see any Cat supporters do this in '07, '09 or '11 nor any Swan fans do it on the weekend. That night, the Geelong board on here went into meltdown with Hawthorn supporters calling us "chokers" and "handbaggers." I don't know about you but I've seen my team win three flags in recent years and I couldn't think of any sadder way to 'celebrate' by sitting on the Internet trolling people I don't know.

At nearly every Geelong v Hawthorn game since 2008 - all of which we've won - I've had a Hawk supporter nastily say to me "doesn't make up for '08 does it?" Well no, it doesn't. But winning two flags since, and beating you on route to one last year (when all week we heard "Geelong can't beat us when it matters", and then after we won it was changed to "Geelong can't beat us in grand finals") certainly helps. You found out yourself on Saturday how hard they are to win. And for your sake I hope your team responds to the defeat with the character Geelong did, for which I'll be eternally thankful.

In terms of us celebrating your loss, I think it's irrelevant what Geelong supporters do on their own board. Apparently when we lost to Fremantle, there was a thread on the Hawthorn board where people were posting photos of Freo singing their theme song. But who cares? At the end of the day neither of us won the flag this season and Sydney is the only team with any bragging rights.

 

[the_interloper]

To be fair, many clubs have not been threatened with merger or closure, despite many clubs being in much deeper fiancial trouble than the hawks were in 96.

We really earned the chip on our shoulders.

I doubt many born australians have seen real hardship anyway

Geez, you're not assuming much about people there are you???

 

[Lunchlady Doris]

Your post was pretty accurate and well balanced until this paragraph. You're deluded if you think that decent in nastiness was initiated exclusively (or even largely) by Hawthorn supporters. The truth is the nasty chapter of the Hawthorn-Geelong rivalry stems from Geelong knowing they f#cked up in '08 and reacting to, an admittedly 'all to ready to mock', Hawthorn fan base by trying to discredit the flag in just about any and every way thinkable. This reaction was as widespread and as vitriolic as any 'campaign' that you're saying followed it. Apportion blame if you can from that knot of a scenario if you dare but the truth is that it has been a tit for tat conflict that started with the odd backhand and ballooned into deep rooted bitterness. To try to retrospectively apportion the lion's share of the blame to one of the parties is frankly just clutching a straws and if you were honest with yourself you'd admit that.

No, the vitriol from both parties was around when I joine dup to BF in 2006. The term 'Bradbury flag' was coined by a Hawthorn supporter talking about Geelong's win in 2007, before the Hawks took 08. Of course much glee was had by Cats supporters, but also supporters of every other club, in returning it with interest, to a much more applicable scenario.

 

[Pessimistic]

Geez, you're not assuming much about people there are you???

Gee Im not projecting the words and actions of a couple of poeople on an entire supporter base am I ?
The guy was coming the poor v rich rubbish
Anyway this was exactly the opposite of what this OP intended, so lets just leave it

 

[seysearles]

No, the vitriol from both parties was around when I joine dup to BF in 2006.

Well speaking personally I had no animosity towards Geelong pre-2008. I supported them in the 1992, 1994, 1995 and 2007 grand finals and generally thought that they were a relatively likeable club up until that point. If there was animosity over the '89 grand final (which I was at) or the Neville Bruns incident it was never incessant or concentrated enough to make me feel any differently about them. My tolerance was exceed only post-2008 grand final when the tantrums and campaign (there really is no other word) to undermine the value of our premiership began. This is why, although i'm willing to admit we may more than likely behaved self-righteously in victory, i'm convinced that the root of this conflict comes from misdirected frustration that they lost that flag when they know they shouldn't have.

The term 'Bradbury flag' was coined by a Hawthorn supporter talking about Geelong's win in 2007, before the Hawks took 08. Of course much glee was had by Cats supporters, but also supporters of every other club, in returning it with interest, to a much more applicable scenario.

Unless you can prove that i'm going to have say that its bullshit. To begin with 2007 had no relevance to the meaning of the term and secondly it's been (and continues to be) the party line for the entire Geelong BF clan following your loss in 2008.

 

[seysearles]

And for your sake I hope your team responds to the defeat with the character Geelong did, for which I'll be eternally thankful.

If we handle anywhere nearly as badly as you guys handled '08 I would be both saddened and disgusted. Thankfully that's not what I'm seeing thus far with the consensus being 'let's put it in the past and move on to 2013 with our dignity intact'.

 

[Slattery_20]

Is this the same Hugh Bris who apparently moved to Essington after they got Bomber Thompson? Why does this bloke swap clubs so often, and why have I never actually seen any evidence of his actual existence?

 

[Lunchlady Doris]

Unless you can prove that i'm going to have say that its bullshit. To begin with 2007 had no relevance to the meaning of the term and secondly it's been (and continues to be) the party line for the entire Geelong BF clan following your loss in 2008.

You can believe whatever you like, but that's the facts.

 

[Tatts22]

If we handle anywhere nearly as badly as you guys handled '08 I would be both saddened and disgusted. Thankfully that's not what I'm seeing thus far with the consensus being 'let's put it in the past and move on to 2013 with our dignity intact'.

Assuming he meant your TEAM handle it the way the Cats did - by winning 2 of the nest 3 flags.

 

[fpm84]

If we handle anywhere nearly as badly as you guys handled '08 I would be both saddened and disgusted. Thankfully that's not what I'm seeing thus far with the consensus being 'let's put it in the past and move on to 2013 with our dignity intact'.

I'm talking about your team. We moved on from a grand final defeat by winning two of the next three premierships. Will the Hawks?

Nice selective editing too, by not commenting on any of my points about the abuse and nastiness many of us have received from Hawthorn fans from the day of the 2008 GF onwards. At least I had the decency to explain my grievances. You sound like you're putting your fingers in your ears saying "la-la-la-la - I can't hear you."

 

[Chewy]

Resentment lingered, Bruns broke the players 'code' and gave a damning testimony at the tribunal, Matthews was deregistered

This is typical of the warped view that biased Geelong fans have.

The reason why Hawthorn fans booed Neville Bruns and called him a squealer was that he pressed assault charges, not because of his tribunal evidence, you peanut.

Michael Tuck never pressed assault charges for the punch Bruns threw in the first half of that game and Matthews never pressed assault charges against Steve Hocking for the "square up" that came seconds after he hit Bruns.

Geelong can dish it out, but they can't take it back. They run like little girls to their mummies and have a nice ol' squeal about it. That's their club culture.

 

[Chewy]

No, the vitriol from both parties was around when I joine dup to BF in 2006. The term 'Bradbury flag' was coined by a Hawthorn supporter talking about Geelong's win in 2007, before the Hawks took 08. Of course much glee was had by Cats supporters, but also supporters of every other club, in returning it with interest, to a much more applicable scenario.

One of the trickle down effects of Hawthorn's Grand Final choke (and its after-effects here on BigFooty) is that Geelong fans can no longer claim the moral high ground over the Hawk fans. This was bogus anyway. I always laughed at the way Geelong posters on Big Footy acted as though it was a one way street and played the role of victims. Geelong are good at dishing it out, but can't take it when it comes back at them.

I don't mind the banter and the games we play. All good fun and all part of the rivalry. I used to wince on behalf of some of the Geelong sooks when they screamed "TROLL!" I used to think, "What a bunch of babies!"

I still do.

 

[Lunchlady Doris]

One of the trickle down effects of Hawthorn's Grand Final choke (and its after-effects here on BigFooty) is that Geelong fans can no longer claim the moral high ground over the Hawk fans. This was bogus anyway. I always laughed at the way Geelong posters on Big Footy acted as though it was a one way street and played the role of victims. Geelong are good at dishing it out, but can't take it when it comes back at them.

I don't mind the banter and the games we play. All good fun and all part of the rivalry. I used to wince on behalf of some of the Geelong sooks when they screamed "TROLL!" I used to think, "What a bunch of babies!"

I still do.

Cool.

 

[Ironmonger]

Never found Hawthorn supporters to be overly arrogant, personally. They had a very good team this year, probably should have won the flag. I don't think it's arrogance to be coinfident about that.

Something seriously wrong with the OP, though, putting the boot in first chance he gets. Nasty stuff.

 

[Partridge]

This is how you, a Hawthorn supporter, sees it.

The way I, a Geelong supporter, sees it is vastly different. I was abused at 3/4 time of the 2008 GF by Hawk supporters. For the record, I didn't see any Cat supporters do this in '07, '09 or '11 nor any Swan fans do it on the weekend. That night, the Geelong board on here went into meltdown with Hawthorn supporters calling us "chokers" and "handbaggers." I don't know about you but I've seen my team win three flags in recent years and I couldn't think of any sadder way to 'celebrate' by sitting on the Internet trolling people I don't know.

They've been calling us that for a long, long time. Way before 2008. All I can ever remember from Hawthorn fans - and I'm talking mid-1980s, forget recently - was "when was your last premiership" or "handbaggers". Given that we have a player out there who has lost a kidney it's the single most ignorant and stupid term in football. Given that we had another player who had lost a kidney playing when it was coined it's even dumber.

They have always taken a great delight in our non-success, and rubbed salt in the wounds at every possible opportunity. This was going on in 1987, and 1989, and 1990, and 1991, and so on. For them to act all meek and innocent, like it's all because of how nasty we were after 2008 - pure unadulterated bullshit. As ever, the blinkers are firmly in place.

The truth is among some very knowledgeable and good footy fans, there are a subsection of Hawthorn supporters (especially in the 25-35 age group) who grew up with nothing but sustained success (which is great), cannot fathom anything else, but strangely enough seem very threatened and despise any club who achieves any success at all. You only need read back through 2007 - every week had a prediction by Hawthorn fans about how Geelong were going to fall over. First it was interstate teams, then physically tough footy, then playing big games at the MCG, then finals, then grand finals and so on.

They have deserved every ounce of disrespect they are getting shown now. What you're seeing after 25 years is an entire generation of supporters who have no idea how to handle it.

 

[Partridge]

This is typical of the warped view that biased Geelong fans have.

The reason why Hawthorn fans booed Neville Bruns and called him a squealer was that he pressed assault charges, not because of his tribunal evidence, you peanut.

Michael Tuck never pressed assault charges for the punch Bruns threw in the first half of that game and Matthews never pressed assault charges against Steve Hocking for the "square up" that came seconds after he hit Bruns.

Geelong can dish it out, but they can't take it back. They run like little girls to their mummies and have a nice ol' squeal about it. That's their club culture.

Really? What about Hawthorn after Round 22, 2009? Never seen such squealing. I loved how Brown made threatening gestures, but despite having the entire second half never actually did anything. Naturally your angry midget made baseless threats as well, like Brown he's never hit anyone in his life who was looking.