Analysis Is Leppa the Right Man for the Job?

[Elixuh]

I wonder if we'll even be competitive by the time my son is old enough to be interested in footy..

Just sit him down each week and secretly play games from the 01-04 era. When it comes around to GCS and GWS games pretend the tv is broken. He won't know.

 

[lioninthesand]

....and would hope some supporters who want him gone, could do the same.

All 75% of them? We would have 2k members left. Mac Mum, this was never the plan and this season has been unacceptable, its just whether circumstance is enough to excuse our intolerable position. An average losing margin over 8 games of 71 on our home deck? Come on, discussions about him losing his job shouldnt arouse such anger in you. You yourself said he had one more year with less injuries to prove himself this time last year when the jungle drums were beating - this is why its almost impossible to see reason in these situations when dealing with club legends. He SHOULD be sacked, keeping him on is russian roulette with 7 bullets in the chamber, but we will see if circumstance can save him. Its ok to keep him on and it is not unreasonable to part ways, and we should trust that our board will make the decision based on a s**t tonne of inside info from every department of our footy club, not because a few boof heads in the media are targetting him. We will all know soon.

 

[Ruse]

This BS of players leaving has got to stop. If Green goes, so be it. He will only be 1 player and most have signed up and all are sticking around so something must be right!

I don't get where the players going backwards is coming from? Granted I don't see it and that's ok because I don't follow it as closely as some on here do. But, to me, isn't that an issue with our Facilities, Trainers, Assistant Coaches, physios, fitness people and the Coach?

So those laying all the blame at Leppa's feet are saying there is no other person or issues or other factors that could be attributing to this? It is all Leppa's fault and there is no one else or nothing else to blame? Or is this becoming a convenient excuse to get rid of our coach?

Correct me if I am wrong but weren't the same reasons being trotted out to get rid of Voss? Players leaving and Players regressing under him? Look how that turned out.

Maybe players would want to stay if the coach didn't go around grabbing players necks and choking them.

 

[Nunez]

Maybe players would want to stay if the coach didn't go around grabbing players necks and choking them.

Sigh

 

[Elixuh]

Maybe players would want to stay if the coach didn't go around grabbing players necks and choking them.

 

[James North]

Maybe players would want to stay if the coach didn't go around grabbing players necks and choking them.

I don't get it - Voss didn't do that to anyone...

 

[Fossey]

There are enough elements to put a fairly strong case forward that we should keep Leppa. Unfortunately, I think there are also enough elements (primarily W/L + score against + maybe also lack of development) which work against him and which probably can't be overcome in this industry - especially by a club that is in such a weak position as ours.

One of the biggest and most obvious questions I would be asking is whether there is enough evidence to suggest that he can turn it around next year and do enough to deserve a further contract extension. I would hazard a guess that the answer to that is no. So the only outcome in this scenario is that he is sacked next year instead of this year. Not sure how much more the club can take in terms of a performance similar to this year and the pressure that brings. Had we had a more successful era under Voss and had then moved into this list turnover and development phase I think he would have been given more time.

It is a tough gig in a tough industry but eventually the numbers get you regardless of the plan you put forth I think.

Whilst I think getting rid of Leppa this year, would be a huge mistake, that will actually put us further behind, if they did, who do you see as replacing him? Can't see any experienced coaches lining up ..... And do you think replacing him with an inexperienced coach is a good idea. Just can't see the point of pissing off at least a fair chuck of Lions supporters if there is not an almost guaranteed better option ( which I don't see).

 

[M Malice]

whitings report on tonights meeting-

http://www.afl.com.au/news/2016-08-23/leppitsch-makes-lastditch-pitch-to-save-his-job

 

[Elixuh]

Whilst I think getting rid of Leppa this year, would be a huge mistake, that will actually put us further behind, if they did, who do you see as replacing him? Can't see any experienced coaches lining up ..... And do you think replacing him with an inexperienced coach is a good idea. Just can't see the point of pissing off at least a fair chuck of Lions supporters if there is not an almost guaranteed better option ( which I don't see).

I think we have experienced coaches in the frame. With the AFL involved I think something will come to fruition.

I can't speak to what inexperienced coaches exist, but am probably on your side in that I'm not sure how much of a difference it would make. If we were going untried again, I would prefer we just kept Leppa.

The question is, if we have another poor year next year...on what grounds will Leppa's contract be extended? Especially given how close he is to getting the sack now.

 

[lioninthesand]

I genuinely think theres a chance he stays.

 

[Football Pope]

There are enough elements to put a fairly strong case forward that we should keep Leppa. Unfortunately, I think there are also enough elements (primarily W/L + score against + maybe also lack of development) which work against him and which probably can't be overcome in this industry - especially by a club that is in such a weak position as ours.

One of the biggest and most obvious questions I would be asking is whether there is enough evidence to suggest that he can turn it around next year and do enough to deserve a further contract extension. I would hazard a guess that the answer to that is no. So the only outcome in this scenario is that he is sacked next year instead of this year. Not sure how much more the club can take in terms of a performance similar to this year and the pressure that brings. Had we had a more successful era under Voss and had then moved into this list turnover and development phase I think he would have been given more time.


It is a tough gig in a tough industry but eventually the numbers get you regardless of the plan you put forth I think.

Yep it's a tough gig in a tough industry and with a year on his contract ...The payout may be a lot more than board has considered.

Leppa has been following a board backed statement to the letter, well echoed by Swann in the attached link. In fact Swann went as far as to public guarantee Leppa's job for next year..

"Brisbane "journey"is of blooding youngsters from which it would not be changing course. and we will have a bit of pain along the way."

The primary objective being -blooding youngsters and retaining them .... The on field performances W/L + score against ..The blame could easily be diverted to support staff which Leppa inherited from Voss...(3 have already gone.)

http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-ne...justin-leppitsch-his-job-20160606-gpd4df.html

 

[Elixuh]

Yep it's a tough gig in a tough industry and with a year on his contract ...The payout may be a lot more than board has considered.

Leppa has been following a board backed statement to the letter, well echoed by Swann in the attached link. In fact Swann went as far as to public guarantee Leppa's job for next year..

"Brisbane "journey"is of blooding youngsters from which it would not be changing course. and we will have a bit of pain along the way."

The primary objective being -blooding youngsters and retaining them .... The on field performances W/L + score against ..The blame could easily be diverted to support staff which Leppa inherited from Voss...(3 have already gone.)

http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-ne...justin-leppitsch-his-job-20160606-gpd4df.html

I don't put much emphasis on this kind of stuff. What is a club board or club CEO going to say? They're going to back the coach publicly 100%. At the end of the day you can guarantee a coaches position during the season and then sack him with little blowback. But publicly denouncing or not giving your support to the coach midseason has far bigger immediate consequences and would cause turmoil (unless things are really dire).

From the meetings the club has had with the AFL and from what the AFL did for Melbourne you'd think we'd be singing to their tune a bit and if they're offering assistance and to help get an experienced coach over the line then IMO it is in our best interests to just play ball now. Look at where we're at as a club.

 

[3KZ is Football]

Outlining the problems he inherited when he took over as Lions coach in late 2013, Leppitsch on Tuesday offered the board a detailed presentation on his plans for the club's future.

http://www.afl.com.au/news/2016-08-23/leppitsch-makes-lastditch-pitch-to-save-his-job

Nice one Leppa, it was all Vossie's fault then was it? You obviously inherited a 'debt and deficit disaster' when you took over at the Lions. Problem is that it is late 2016 and you have taken us backwards.

 

[Football Pope]

I don't put much emphasis on this kind of stuff. What is a club board or club CEO going to say? They're going to back the coach publicly 100%. At the end of the day you can guarantee a coaches position during the season and then sack him with little blowback. But publicly denouncing or not giving your support to the coach midseason has far bigger immediate consequences and would cause turmoil (unless things are really dire).

From the meetings the club has had with the AFL and from what the AFL did for Melbourne you'd think we'd be singing to their tune a bit and if they're offering assistance and to help get an experienced coach over the line then IMO it is in our best interests to just play ball now. Look at where we're at as a club.

Yep! Easy to play ball and the AFL have already stated that they wont be assisting in any payouts..sort of tells me they are saying let it be for the next 12 months. What we really need now is stability...Easier to put in position, people who can take over from Leppa as caretakers should things continue ..And see if a desirable coach, like Melbourne has, is well rested and wanting to get back into the coaching gig at the end of Leppas contract......

The Club has backed Leppa publicly stating that he was following the 'objective' when everybody from the outside were stating things were pretty dire and should be sacked...Swann didn't have to say anything about Leppa or guarantee he would be coach next season,. Just mentioned that Leppa was contracted till the end of next year. Going forward, there would be a review of all positions at the end of the year...

 

[Elixuh]

Yep! Easy to play ball and the AFL have already stated that they wont be assisting in any payouts..sort of tells me they are saying let it be for the next 12 months. What we really need now is stability...Easier to put in position, people who can take over from Leppa as caretakers should things continue ..And see if a desirable coach, like Melbourne has, is well rested and wanting to get back into the coaching gig at the end of Leppas contract......

The Club has backed Leppa publicly stating that he was following the 'objective' when everybody from the outside were stating things were pretty dire and should be sacked...Swann didn't have to say anything about Leppa or guarantee he would be coach next season,. Just mentioned that Leppa was contracted till the end of next year. Going forward, there would be a review of all positions at the end of the year...

I don't think that is where we're at or what will happen but understand your sentiments. I actually have a lot of sympathy and understanding for Leppa and would support a decision to keep him on - I just don't think that is what will happen. AFL clearly willing to offer assistance. It is in our best interests to just follow whatever it is they want to do.

 

[Football Pope]

I don't think that is where we're at or what will happen but understand your sentiments. I actually have a lot of sympathy and understanding for Leppa and would support a decision to keep him on - I just don't think that is what will happen. AFL clearly willing to offer assistance. It is in our best interests to just follow whatever it is they want to do.

To be honest Leppa has done what he set out to do...and it had club backing..

I don't buy that, the AFL clearly willing to offer assistance. It is in our best interests to just follow whatever it is they want to do...If it is the case, it's going to get really messy....Reckon the AFL would distance themselves from terminating one coach to install their preferred option as being a condition of any assistance..

If the Club terminate on AFL advice as " a condition of assistance' not sure Leppas manager, Craig Kelly, who manages other coaches, would be taking that lightly...Think it might be hard job filling the position ....just my opinion.

 

[Elixuh]

To be honest Leppa has done what he set out to do...and it had club backing..

I don't buy that..If it is the case, it's going to get really messy....reckon the AFL would distance themselves from terminating one coach to install their prefered option as being a condition of any assistance..

If the Club terminate on AFL advice as " a condition of assistance' not sure Leppas manager, Craig Kelly, who manages other coaches, would be taking that lightly...Think it might be hard job filling the position ....just my opinion.

I'm not arguing that he hasn't. I'm arguing that the industry won't support the overall results of the past 3 years (and in particular this year).

I don't even think much of what has happened is a reflection on Leppa as a coach. People argue that the plan meant that things were only going to get worse before they got better but that it shouldn't have been this bad...I think when you're delving into the territory of such a large list turnover and you have the mountain of issues this club has, then the possibilities regarding just how bad things can get is probably reflected by the results this season. Injuries and the draw certainly haven't helped.

I would say that the sentiment of the general public is that Leppa needs to go. So I'm not sure if the AFL will receive much backlash and would probably have the majority of support if Leppa/his manager decided to make it ugly. I'm sure there are things the other side can hit back with regarding Leppa as well...

 

[blackpowerlappin]

I genuinely think theres a chance he stays.

I'm starting to think the same

 

[Football Pope]

I'm not arguing that he hasn't. I'm arguing that the industry won't support the overall results of the past 3 years (and in particular this year).

I don't even think much of what has happened is a reflection on Leppa as a coach. People argue that the plan meant that things were only going to get worse before they got better but that it shouldn't have been this bad...I think when you're delving into the territory of such a large list turnover and you have the mountain of issues this club has, then the possibilities regarding just how bad things can get is probably reflected by the results this season. Injuries and the draw certainly haven't helped.

I would say that the sentiment of the general public is that Leppa needs to go. So I'm not sure if the AFL will receive much backlash and would probably have the majority of support if Leppa/his manager decided to make it ugly. I'm sure there are things the other side can hit back with regarding Leppa as well...

Apart from those brainwashed by the media, the sentiment from most within the industry is Leppa has done the best with the available talent..we've gone down the track of 3 years of a 4 year rebuild for long term gain...as complex as that can be..and as you mention, bad luck from injuries..what-else could he have done?

AS a club we look pathetic having to go with cap in hand to the AFL to give us a hand because we cant manage our own affairs or bail ourselves out....The way this looks is we are prepared to accept the 30 pieces of silver at the cost of several of our club champions.

We took this path as a Club now haven't got the balls to follow it through...Like most supporters I'm sick of the excuses...So over The AFL needs to step in or the swap the coach routine as being the only answer..when things haven't gone to plan.

 

[Lace Out]

Our list next year will be quite a bit younger than the list Leppitsch took over.

Was referring to Leppa's list this year.The year he will judged upon and removed.

 

[BrindleKat]

I take umbrage at a few points made here.

Firstly there seems to be an assumption that the prescribed course didn't involve certain milestone markers along the way that needed to be met to indicate that we were indeed still on the course. And that the original course lasted longer than a 3 year period. If the agreed timeframe between the board and the coach was for 4 or even 5 years then the initial contract term would have been for that. Clearly there was an agreed course for 3 years with certain targets during that time, the fact that there was a contract renewal before this agreed period ended and a review of the progress made was completed is probably the biggest issue I have with the board. I can't see for the life of me how many of of those would have been met, mitigating circumstances aside.

This then flows into the whole flip-flop, abandon their word argument and the branding of people who question or complain about where we are as whiners or being impatient. Thats a pretty unfair label to give to the large majority of supporters on here who have been very patient for signs of obvious improvement to reveal themselves. That people are questioning where this improvement lies isn't whining, its perfectly legitimate.

 

[Elixuh]

Apart from those brainwashed by the media, the sentiment from most within the industry is Leppa has done the best with the available talent..we've gone down the track of 3 years of a 4 year rebuild for long term gain...as complex as that can be..and as you mention, bad luck from injuries..what-else could he have done?

AS a club we look pathetic having to go with cap in hand to the AFL to give us a hand because we cant manage our own affairs or bail ourselves out....The way this looks is we are prepared to accept the 30 pieces of silver at the cost of several of our club champions.

We took this path as a Club now haven't got the balls to follow it through...Like most supporters I'm sick of the excuses...So over The AFL needs to step in or the swap the coach routine as being the only answer..when things haven't gone to plan.

We wouldn't be in this position if the entire system was tolerant of such sustained poor performances even if it is part of a rebuild. It's just the way it is. Things might be a tad different if the club were in a better position.

I'll be upset if they get rid of Leppa for an untried coach. I still think its shitty and unfair to turf him for an experienced coach but could easily live with it. I guess whoever the next coach is will reap the benefits of the work Leppa has done over the past 3 years. Would be soul destroying for Leppa to watch on if that were the case.

 

[BrindleKat]

Hi, umbrage welcome,

Sorry for dropping the clutch before putting the mouth into gear mate, I know I should stay away from the internet when I'm hungry!

Yeah, I suppose we can all get bit emotional about a club we have followed for most of our lives, and I am probably one of the worst offenders, after actually reading a few more posts I realise I might have been letting my heart rule my head, I suppose all I want is to see Leppa get a fair go after watching him give his all to the club over the years. No stab in the back followed by a mind your head on the way out, but an honest appraisal of the his part in the apparent disaster of a year on the field.

As Elixuh said "..... the AFL have already stated that they wont be assisting in any payouts..sort of tells me they are saying let it be for the next 12 months. What we really need now is stability...Easier to put in position, people who can take over from Leppa as caretakers should things continue ..And see if a desirable coach, like Melbourne has, is well rested and wanting to get back into the coaching gig at the end of Leppas contract......"

 

[ZoBlitz]

This thread is a lot better when reading from Munich after drinking litres of beer.

 

[Milk Steak]

This thread is a lot better when reading from Munich after drinking litres of beer.

Can't remember the name of the place,but there's a restaurant in Munich,not far from Hauf Bra Haus (excuse spelling) that has huge wall of pork knuckles roasting on a rotisserie in the window. Go there, best pork I've ever eaten