Recommitted Jacob Hopper [re-signed]

[YEMOC NAYR]

In an open draft he actually went pick 7. None of the four clubs with earlier picks were interested, otherwise they would have called his name.

At best you could argue that he might have gone pick 6 because when Melbourne bid on mills and the swans matched, it moved everyone back one place.

But "could have gone #2" is absolute rubbish, you could also say he could have gone #1 - but that too would be rubbish, because the basic reality of the situation is that he didn't.

If he wasn't an academy selection. #1 & #2 he was never going to be selected because those clubs need to use these new players as a beacon of hope and you can't do that if you nominate a kid that you don't get. It's well known that around that time there was questions as to why those 2 kids didn't get nominated earlier.

If they weren't academy, they'd have gone higher.

My opinion is just this. He hasn't done anything wrong, he's getting games in a top side. His draft value hasn't dropped. He and Mills were universally seen as the best mids in that crop. Oliver was a bolter and Parish was behind Kennedy and Hopper.

 

[Colonial]

If he wasn't an academy selection. #1 & #2 he was never going to be selected because those clubs need to use these new players as a beacon of hope and you can't do that if you nominate a kid that you don't get. It's well known that around that time there was questions as to why those 2 kids didn't get nominated earlier.

If they weren't academy, they'd have gone higher.

My opinion is just this. He hasn't done anything wrong, he's getting games in a top side. His draft value hasn't dropped. He and Mills were universally seen as the best mids in that crop. Oliver was a bolter and Parish was behind Kennedy and Hopper.

He was never nominated so he wouldnt have gone higher.
Unless someone has a time machine to go back and tell the recruiters how good he is he wasnt ever going to be higher.

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[Ichabod Noodle]

If he wasn't an academy selection. #1 & #2 he was never going to be selected because those clubs need to use these new players as a beacon of hope and you can't do that if you nominate a kid that you don't get. It's well known that around that time there was questions as to why those 2 kids didn't get nominated earlier.

If they weren't academy, they'd have gone higher.

Rubbish. All a club had to do was call their name. They didn't. Draft was open. Wide open.

And 3000 points is much more difficult to match. Not sure we could have, given we also wanted a couple of other academy kids.

And you still haven't explained why Melbourne didn't bid on him instead of Mills, or even after Mills was matched they had a chance to call his name, or why Essendon didn't call his name with either of the next two picks after that.

He went pick 7, he might have gone pick 6 without the Mills bid. But he was clearly considered to be behind the players called before him. He went top 10. That's about right. He was a top ten player in his draft year. But that's about it and any attempt at rewriting history is just pathetically fanciful.

 

[YEMOC NAYR]

Rubbish. All a club had to do was call their name. They didn't. Draft was open. Wide open.

And 3000 points is much more difficult to match. Not sure we could have, given we also wanted a couple of other academy kids.

And you still haven't explained why Melbourne didn't bid on him instead of Mills, or even after Mills was matched they had a chance to call his name, or why Essendon didn't call his name with either of the next two picks after that.

He went pick 7, he might have gone pick 6 without the Mills bid. But he was clearly considered to be behind the players called before him. He went top 10. That's about right. He was a top ten player in his draft year. But that's about it and any attempt at rewriting history is just pathetically fanciful.

Pathetic? Calm down now. You can lose the internet persona mate. Not interested in a dick measuring contest.

The general consensus, even this year by many is that Hopper and Kennedy went below value. Without considering how they are tracking right now. I'll stand by that. I don't think it's as simple as oh well they didn't get selected then so they people didn't think they were worth it.

 

[aussierulesrules]

It's been reported more than once in articles that Carlton would have given him serious consideration with pick 1 had he not been in another team's academy (and thus they almost certainly would have been pushed back to pick 2- not to mention probably ruffling feathers at their feeder club!).

 

[Bokonon_]

It's been reported more than once in articles that Carlton would have given him serious consideration with pick 1 had he not been in another team's academy (and thus they almost certainly would have been pushed back to pick 2- not to mention probably ruffling feathers at their feeder club!).

That's a bit of a stretch, SOS has history with us and we have traded a lot with Carlton where it's mutually beneficial. It's disrespectful to both clubs to say Carlton wouldn't act in their best interest, and that we would childishly resent it.

 

[dlanod]

The general consensus, even this year by many is that Hopper and Kennedy went below value. Without considering how they are tracking right now. I'll stand by that. I don't think it's as simple as oh well they didn't get selected then so they people didn't think they were worth it.

The general consensus on here and in the media also had Waylen Manson as a top 5 pick... First rounder at worst.

 

[Rich01]

Reckon Carlton are all over him. Their first pick this year will do it.

 

[pinot]

Blues likely will make an offer for first rounder as mids in this years draft is soft.. they are all talls.. we are ok with talls for now and have Ben Silvagni coming on next year as key forward

 

[mpal6]

If he wasn't an academy selection. #1 & #2 he was never going to be selected because those clubs need to use these new players as a beacon of hope and you can't do that if you nominate a kid that you don't get. It's well known that around that time there was questions as to why those 2 kids didn't get nominated earlier.

If they weren't academy, they'd have gone higher.

My opinion is just this. He hasn't done anything wrong, he's getting games in a top side. His draft value hasn't dropped. He and Mills were universally seen as the best mids in that crop. Oliver was a bolter and Parish was behind Kennedy and Hopper.

This whole beacon of hope story line doesn't add up. In 2014 Isaac Heeney was nominated by Melbourne at pick #2 and Swans matched. That's what would've happened with a draftee, academy or not. Hopper and Kennedy didn't go earlier coz the clubs didn't rate them higher than where they went. The idea of "if not academy, they'd have gone higher" is BS.

 

[TigerTime88]

Who cares where he was drafted.

Point is some VIC clubs will come with some big $$$ offers and he will have a decision to make.

 

[Colonial]

Reckon Carlton are all over him. Their first pick this year will do it.

They are all over our entire list.

Doesnt mean they will get any this year.

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[Jeremias]

Reckon Carlton are all over him. Their first pick this year will do it.

Reckon we'll find a way without giving up our first pick.

As was the case last year, SOS will be very keen to bring in young talent and keep that early presence in the draft.

Our 2018 pick may well be on the table, though.

 

[king rising]

smacks of illegal inside trading this GWS Carlton affair

 

[Jeremias]

smacks of illegal inside trading this GWS Carlton affair

Why is that?

 

[Colonial]

Reckon we'll find a way without giving up our first pick.

As was the case last year, SOS will be very keen to bring in young talent and keep that early presence in the draft.

Our 2018 pick may well be on the table, though.

If there is a trade on the table it would need to involve a 1st.so of your 2017 isnt on the table then it would need to be the 2018, at least


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[Jeremias]

If there is a trade on the table it would need to involve a 1st.

I don't disagree with that - it's very hard to see Hopper moving without a R1 pick going in the opposite direction. I'm just saying we almost certainly won't be trading our first pick this year.

Last year we were told ad nauseum we'd have to trade our first to secure Marchbank and Pickett, but that obviously did not eventuate.

Expect a similar story this year - we'll almost certainly hold on to our 2017 1st and either deal our 2018 1st or make some other moves to satisfy the Giants.

 

[reload141]

Reckon we'll find a way without giving up our first pick.

As was the case last year, SOS will be very keen to bring in young talent and keep that early presence in the draft.

Our 2018 pick may well be on the table, though.

So... in other words you will lose your early presence in the draft in 2018.

 

[Jeremias]

So... in other words you will lose your early presence in the draft in 2018.

Potentially yes, pending other moves.

 

[Taylor]

Carlton could use the pick(s) they get for Gibbs as part of the deal for Hopper, assuming that is still the plan at the end of the season.

 

[SterlingArcher]

So... in other words you will lose your early presence in the draft in 2018.

Still got Gibbs with question marks over his head.

A net result of Gibbs for Hopper, obviously with us having some slips in the draft order (no way we improve our positioning from that trade) would be a good win for us. GWS would likely get a top 10 draft pick and Adelaide can get a midfielder who would be undervalued as a late teens pick while their window is wide open.

 

[pinot]

We need at least two really good mids this year and keep Gibbs.

We need to replace Thomas, Palmer and Smedts. Kerridge is okay for depth for another year IMO but the first three we require replacements

 

[Moist Biscuit]

The general consensus on here and in the media also had Waylen Manson as a top 5 pick... First rounder at worst.

Darcy Hourigan as a late teen picks a few years ago... Nek Minute, Overlooked by every club in the National and Rookie drafts.

 

[Chism]

We are all over Hopper but whether we get him is another issue BUT if he leaves GWS i reckon we are the favourites to land him.

Would be a fantastic get for our current midfield and i am not planning on having Gibbs next season with us so he is a ready replacement with his whole career in front of him.

I doubt we also trade away our 1st rd pick for him and let the wheeling and dealing ensue!

 

[Mr_Plow]

Will likely be a Carlton player next year.

GWS first round picks seldom go elsewhere.