Coach John Longmire

[MarkP]

Brett Ratten is the name you're after. Don't reckon he was hard done by tbh. Never took the club to where the board thought they were and his last season they finished 10th

Yep that's the one.

Just to be clear not advocating him or anyone else but rather making the point there are always, always, options in sport. Often surprising g ones.

 

[miggs]

#boycottthepoll

 

[sataris]

I think the club would be putting together a 25 year contract for Longmire based on his last 5 years.

 

[The Gong]

It feels like the whole "Bloods culture" thing has just gone up in smoke. Since about 2003 onwards it's been an environment of very high accountability where young players could rotate in and learn from the older players what it meant beings one of the Bloods, how you would put your body on the line for your teammates and every game was a contested ball barrage from the Swans. That seemed to be still there in 2012 but when you have players like Goodes, ROK and Bolton now moved on then maybe that Bloods Culture just isn't a thing anymore. Young players are coming into the system and aren't being exposed to that ethos. We were never the most skilled team but to beat us you had to be prepared to take some big hits and scrap for it. Right now we look like a really soft team. That hardness that was the Swans brand is just not there. Maybe Horse is too analytical and he needs to bring some the passion back into the team that made us such a formidable opponent.

 

[BORK]

It feels like the whole "Bloods culture" thing has just gone up in smoke. Since about 2003 onwards it's been an environment of very high accountability where young players could rotate in and learn from the older players what it meant beings one of the Bloods, how you would put your body on the line for your teammates and every game was a contested ball barrage from the Swans. That seemed to be still there in 2012 but when you have players like Goodes, ROK and Bolton now moved on then maybe that Bloods Culture just isn't a thing anymore. Young players are coming into the system and aren't being exposed to that ethos. We were never the most skilled team but to beat us you had to be prepared to take some big hits and scrap for it. Right now we look like a really soft team. That hardness that was the Swans brand is just not there. Maybe Horse is too analytical and he needs to bring some the passion back into the team that made us such a formidable opponent.

Have been arguing this for a long time. In fact since 2014 off this site in person with others and was alluding to it last year before they made a grand final on this site.

JPK one of very few in that side who seems to embody the culture that made the club so successful relative to their list quality in the 2003-2012 period.

Now there appears to be too many glamour Bondi boys who got found out in the 2014 and 2016 grand finals and some of whom appear to be not coping so well when the chips are down.

That culture changed happened under Longmire.

 

[bradmanstandguy]

It feels like the whole "Bloods culture" thing has just gone up in smoke. Since about 2003 onwards it's been an environment of very high accountability where young players could rotate in and learn from the older players what it meant beings one of the Bloods, how you would put your body on the line for your teammates and every game was a contested ball barrage from the Swans. That seemed to be still there in 2012 but when you have players like Goodes, ROK and Bolton now moved on then maybe that Bloods Culture just isn't a thing anymore. Young players are coming into the system and aren't being exposed to that ethos. We were never the most skilled team but to beat us you had to be prepared to take some big hits and scrap for it. Right now we look like a really soft team. That hardness that was the Swans brand is just not there. Maybe Horse is too analytical and he needs to bring some the passion back into the team that made us such a formidable opponent.

I agree,but Horse had his hands tied with injuries. Doesnt excuse our star midfield for not performing! And this revolving door policy of youngsters is not helping! Have we had the same team playing for two weeks in a row no we havent !

 

[skipper kelly]

I agree,but Horse had his hands tied with injuries. Doesnt excuse our star midfield for not performing! And this revolving door policy of youngsters is not helping! Have we had the same team playing for two weeks in a row no we havent !

We have played the most players this year of any club. 34 with the next most being 32 (Melbourne). In that regard at least the selection committee has tried to change things up.

 

[bedford]

We have played the most players this year of any club. 34 with the next most being 32 (Melbourne). In that regard at least the selection committee has tried to change things up.

The had no choice !

 

[sataris]

Who is on this mystical selection committee?

 

[skipper kelly]

The had no choice !

True.

 

[RW]

Assuming BigFooty posters represent our supporter base as a whole (hehe), Longmire's current approval ratings based on the poll results so far are:

Approve 46%
Disapprove 28%
Undecided 26%

 

[Olian]

Assuming BigFooty posters represent our supporter base as a whole (hehe), Longmire's current approval ratings based on the poll results so far are:

Approve 46%
Disapprove 28%
Undecided 26%

Most politicians would take those numbers.

 

[The King!]

Assuming BigFooty posters represent our supporter base as a whole (hehe), Longmire's current approval ratings based on the poll results so far are:

Approve 46%
Disapprove 28%
Undecided 26%

Need a second candidate

 

[hairy biker]

Need a second candidate

 

[GotTheGoodes]

View attachment 366525

He just looks like he could kill a grizzly bear with nothing but a paper clip doesn't he??

 

[Tedeski]

Have been arguing this for a long time. In fact since 2014 off this site in person with others and was alluding to it last year before they made a grand final on this site.

JPK one of very few in that side who seems to embody the culture that made the club so successful relative to their list quality in the 2003-2012 period.

Now there appears to be too many glamour Bondi boys who got found out in the 2014 and 2016 grand finals and some of whom appear to be not coping so well when the chips are down.

That culture changed happened under Longmire.

Perhaps so!
Three Grand Finals & a p'ship also happened under Longmire.
But i agree that GF day 2014 was when I realised the Bloods was not the same & I say that culture disappeared when Jude Bolton retired & ROK became a NEAFL player.

 

[Number37]

Perhaps so!
Three Grand Finals & a p'ship also happened under Longmire.
But i agree that GF day 2014 was when I realised the Bloods was not the same & I say that culture disappeared when Jude Bolton retired & ROK became a NEAFL player.

Do you think the bloods culture disappeared because we became too successful?

 

[Tuco]

There's an argument the Bloods ethos which Kirk and Maxfield et al championed was a response to the need to glue together a patchwork of raw junior talent and an underrated senior group under an umbrella of "us versus them" and "never give in" mentality.

In 2005, almost the best thing that happened to the club was a dozen journos picked us to win the wooden spoon. This was just the perfect storm for the Bloods!

What it evolved into is still very much here - a peer process of honest group review and a supposed culture of rewarding players for doing what is asked of them. These individual KPIs are pretty different to what a lot of armchair critics think they are.

Sustained success since that time may well have eroded the basic idea that we as a group need to stick together through thick and thin just to survive.

Frankly this season is a reversion back to 2002. Perfect time to reset the clock and fire up that old Ford Cortina Engine again.

The real question for the group is do they believe in the Bloods anymore - or have they moved on to something else? Personally and professionally, I think they very much do live and breathe it still.

 

[connolly]

Perhaps so!
Three Grand Finals & a p'ship also happened under Longmire.
But i agree that GF day 2014 was when I realised the Bloods was not the same & I say that culture disappeared when Jude Bolton retired & ROK became a NEAFL player.

Perhaps the "culture" is the problem now. The culture has become a dogma. Our real problem apart from the slowing of aging stalwarts is that the team is over micro managed on the field. AFL has shifted quickly and we have simply not evolved. All cultures evolve. Ours hasn't. The dominant teams this season innovate and take risks. Our "culture" was based on a risk minimisation style of football. A symptom of the risk aversion football we are rigidly being managed is the dropping of Aliir and to a lesser extent Newman. Aliir is the example of the modern young football. He takes risks, takes the game on and yes he horror of horrors makes mistakes. So he is dropped to the seconds to learn not to make mistakes. This is the old Bloods management not culture approach and it is now completely outmoded. We have two fundamental problems:
1. We are predictable in the way we move the ball out of the middle, at stoppages and especially transitioning out of defence. Aliir excluded you can set your watch on how long it takes us to break out from defence. Too slow and too stereotyped. The opposition coaches are on to us.
2.Our players are over-thinking their football. And worse when they make a mistake they go back into a conservative mode of playing. This is death in the contemporary game. Teams and players can not play conservation risk averse football. We should tell Kirk to STFU about the pre-eminance of structure and just coach from experience, let the players take risks, tell them to try the mistake again and TAKE RISKS. As the great John Kennedy said at three quarter time in a Grand Final that changed a certain defeat into victory "Don't think DO". We have two outstanding innovative footballers in Franklin and Aliir. We should structure our game around their unpredictability. Unpredictability is anathema to football micro managers. Of course our game plan must have structure, our players must have the Bloods culture of commitment and team ethos but lets not confuse a culture with an overly micro-managed conservative risk averse football. It wont win games anymore.

 

[connolly]

There's an argument the Bloods ethos which Kirk and Maxfield et al championed was a response to the need to glue together a patchwork of raw junior talent and an underrated senior group under an umbrella of "us versus them" and "never give in" mentality.

In 2005, almost the best thing that happened to the club was a dozen journos picked us to win the wooden spoon. This was just the perfect storm for the Bloods!

What it evolved into is still very much here - a peer process of honest group review and a supposed culture of rewarding players for doing what is asked of them. These individual KPIs are pretty different to what a lot of armchair critics think they are.

Sustained success since that time may well have eroded the basic idea that we as a group need to stick together through thick and thin just to survive.

Frankly this season is a reversion back to 2002. Perfect time to reset the clock and fire up that old Ford Cortina Engine again.

The real question for the group is do they believe in the Bloods anymore - or have they moved on to something else? Personally and professionally, I think they very much do live and breathe it still.

Its a reversion to 1939. Seriously our game strategy (not game plan) is outmoded. We are the French army at the Maginot Line facing blitzkriegs. It didn't go well

 

[GotTheGoodes]

Perhaps the "culture" is the problem now. The culture has become a dogma. Our real problem apart from the slowing of aging stalwarts is that the team is over micro managed on the field. AFL has shifted quickly and we have simply not evolved. All cultures evolve. Ours hasn't. The dominant teams this season innovate and take risks. Our "culture" was based on a risk minimisation style of football. A symptom of the risk aversion football we are rigidly being managed is the dropping of Aliir and to a lesser extent Newman. Aliir is the example of the modern young football. He takes risks, takes the game on and yes he horror of horrors makes mistakes. So he is dropped to the seconds to learn not to make mistakes. This is the old Bloods management not culture approach and it is now completely outmoded. We have two fundamental problems:
1. We are predictable in the way we move the ball out of the middle, at stoppages and especially transitioning out of defence. Aliir excluded you can set your watch on how long it takes us to break out from defence. Too slow and too stereotyped. The opposition coaches are on to us.
2.Our players are over-thinking their football. And worse when they make a mistake they go back into a conservative mode of playing. This is death in the contemporary game. Teams and players can not play conservation risk averse football. We should tell Kirk to STFU about the pre-eminance of structure and just coach from experience, let the players take risks, tell them to try the mistake again and TAKE RISKS. As the great John Kennedy said at three quarter time in a Grand Final that changed a certain defeat into victory "Don't think DO". We have two outstanding innovative footballers in Franklin and Aliir. We should structure our game around their unpredictability. Unpredictability is anathema to football micro managers. Of course our game plan must have structure, our players must have the Bloods culture of commitment and team ethos but lets not confuse a culture with an overly micro-managed conservative risk averse football. It wont win games anymore.

I see what you're saying & would agree, we sometimes seem to play conservative/highly structured footy. Up to the opening of round 1 this year don't you think it has worked though? GFs are pretty hard to come by, yes we lost in 14 & 16 but we have been top 2-top 4 in the whole comp year after year for pretty much a decade +... Maybe this is the year it finally all fails & we see change (we already have IMO) but to say a strong risk averse structured style of play doesn't work I think is incorrect. It can work in modern footy, we've just failed to live up to individual roles this year thus far IMO. Be it burn out from years of success or the simple fact they're all just about out of high school, either way, we'll bounce back if we stick with the same ethos... Play your role. Play it no matter what. Don't deviate from your role. There's a reason for it & it will help the team. We will be better off overall if you do that.

E.g.
If the coaching staff want AA to lock down more on a defender & he just doesn't then he deserves to go back to NEAFL. Our success wasn't built on blokes not doing the team thing first.

If Talia hasn't followed the players words in his "come back" then I don't care how fit or how much he looks like he could benefit the team on the field, he shouldn't play if that means the culture & code of the club remains intact.

Also, no1 ever tells Kirk to STFU. You go and wash your fuc*in mouth out with alcohol immediately.

 

[Tuco]

Its a reversion to 1939. Seriously our game strategy (not game plan) is outmoded. We are the French army at the Maginot Line facing blitzkriegs. It didn't go well

Maginot line? A flatfooted/stationary defensive line, build in a previous age, to counter outmoded tactics which while appearing to be functional turned out to be easily overcome vs a mobile offensive force?

Mein Got. You may be right.

 

[connolly]

I see what you're saying & would agree, we sometimes seem to play conservative/highly structured footy. Up to the opening of round 1 this year don't you think it has worked though? GFs are pretty hard to come by, yes we lost in 14 & 16 but we have been top 2-top 4 in the whole comp year after year for pretty much a decade +... Maybe this is the year it finally all fails & we see change (we already have IMO) but to say a strong risk averse structured style of play doesn't work I think is incorrect. It can work in modern footy, we've just failed to live up to individual roles this year thus far IMO. Be it burn out from years of success or the simple fact they're all just about out of high school, either way, we'll bounce back if we stick with the same ethos... Play your role. Play it no matter what. Don't deviate from your role. There's a reason for it & it will help the team. We will be better off overall if you do that.

E.g.
If the coaching staff want AA to lock down more on a defender & he just doesn't then he deserves to go back to NEAFL. Our success wasn't built on blokes not doing the team thing first.

If Talia hasn't followed the players words in his "come back" then I don't care how fit or how much he looks like he could benefit the team on the field, he shouldn't play if that means the culture & code of the club remains intact.

Also, no1 ever tells Kirk to STFU. You go and wash your fuc*in mouth out with alcohol immediately.

I agree the tightly managed risk averse style served us well but football strategy changes quickly. Ours is now outmoded. It has to change. We have to mould a game strategy around the players we have. At the moment we have the most dangerously brilliant forward in the game playing up the ground trying to minimise the mistakes our midfielders make moving the ball into the forward line. If that's not a risk averse strategy I don't know what is. Isolated with his opponent Buddy will beat any defender three times out of four. He is booming kick for goal, Give him space and let him work his magic. But the micro-managers have him playing as a wingman!! As for the Dalai Lama- Parker's form demise coincided with the DL getting him to read books FFS. I rest my case

 

[GotTheGoodes]

I agree the tightly managed risk averse style served us well but football strategy changes quickly. Ours is now outmoded. It has to change. We have to mould a game strategy around the players we have. At the moment we have the most dangerously brilliant forward in the game playing up the ground trying to minimise the mistakes our midfielders make moving the ball into the forward line. If that's not a risk averse strategy I don't know what is. Isolated with his opponent Buddy will beat any defender three times out of four. He is booming kick for goal, Give him space and let him work his magic. But the micro-managers have him playing as a wingman!! As for the Dalia Lama- Parker's form demise coincided with the DL getting him to read books FFS. I rest my case

Lol. Kirky is forwards coach not midfield coach. Parkers attitude is different to his form or the structures he is placed in. You can blame Dew for the structures. You can blame the fact he's had to fight his way through tackle after tackle for years at the highest level in huge games for a current lack of form. Not many players his age have played as many blockbusters or finals as him.

He's a leader now & has had to adjust to the loss of Mitchell too. He's down on form with the rest of the boys. But he'll come good.

Nothing to do with the positive influece of one of our all time best ever captains & leaders in Kirk IMO. I just think it's ridiculous if you think Kirk is to blame at all.

I like how our forwards have generally performed since Kirk has been there.

Bud has started marking the ball better. Not giving away as many frees. Kicking has improved (thanks Davis). Tackling & pressure has increased markedly.

Reid been good this year. Paps been a good introduction. Hewy been good. Xav was above expectations. All increased their forward pressure, tackling & work around stoppages &/or around the packs IMO.

 

[connolly]

Lol. Kirky is forwards coach not midfield coach. Parkers attitude is different to his form or the structures he is placed in. You can blame Dew for the structures. You can blame the fact he's had to fight his way through tackle after tackle for years at the highest level in huge games for a current lack of form. Not many players his age have played as many blockbusters or finals as him.

He's a leader now & has had to adjust to the loss of Mitchell too. He's down on form with the rest of the boys. But he'll come good.

Nothing to do with the positive influece of one of our all time best ever captains & leaders in Kirk IMO. I just think it's ridiculous if you think Kirk is to blame at all.

I like how our forwards have generally performed since Kirk has been there.

Bud has started marking the ball better. Not giving away as many frees. Kicking has improved (thanks Davis). Tackling & pressure has increased markedly.

Reid been good this year. Paps been a good introduction. Hewy been good. Xav was above expectations. All increased their forward pressure, tackling & work around stoppages &/or around the packs IMO.

Sorry mate. I have a tremendous admiration for Kirk as a footballer and a person. Apologies for a poor attempt at humour. But I do think for what its worth our forward structure has been terrible. Not blaming Kirk. Just think we should try and structure around isolating Buddy one on one against his opponent. And play Cameron next to him. To draw that second defender away. Our forward line is now structured defensively to create turn overs. That's ok but shouldn't be the main way we set up. Make Buddy's opponent try and hold him one out as the ball comes towards them. I think we are trying to over finess coming into the forward line. I know most people here subscribe to the "lower the eyes" mantra but with a brilliant player like Buddy lets just create space and make it mere mortal against a brilliant once in a generation footballer. To do that we have to move the ball much quicker. The hold the ball and pick targets strategy from defence means that Buddy is covered by the time the ball transitions slowly up the ground. I think our players are hesitating fatally in defence as they try to pick the best option. Just move it as the modern game is more about space and speed. The other team that used a hold and pass strategy Hawthorn are joining us on the bottom of the ladder. The game is now all about forward momentum. We have to change how we transition out of defence. We have Aliir a potential champion who is made for the new game. As is Rampe. Lets use them to the optimum. Not try and straight jacket them into close checking defenders. They are rebounders with speed and instinctive football skills. And we played him in the reserves to teach something he will never be. Yes they will make some mistakes but better than the hesitant deer in the headlights football we are now playing.