Josh Simpson

[clogged]

http://www.news.com.au/sport/afl/wh...oking-the-goodes/story-fnelctok-1226520683504

Here is the article for you reference.

That article glosses over Vezpremi, Willoughby, Daniel O'Keefe, Lewis Johnston, Jed Lamb - all first round draft picks over the past decade that are no longer with the Swans.

 

[Belnakor]

Its interesting to compare to Son-Son, i read an interview where he said the reason he loves AFL is because he can provide for his family. Doesn't seem like that is a priority for Josh.

 

[Reginald Perrin]

FYI - I apologise for the length of this post...

No need to apologise. Plenty on here lodge long posts with nothing of value at all, yours was excellent.

I'm going to have to pick you up on the fourth world thing though, hyperbole detracts from the overall power of the message.

 

[pokerspiv]

Pitt and Simpson were probably too high risk, high reward for more liking. I remember the swans recruiter writing an article that they go for the guaranteed player rather than the high risk high reward players, and I think we should do that a bit more and save the speculative pick for later in the draft. The Swans recruiter compared it investing 200k in the stock market, and he pretty much said he would always go with the safe stock pick.

That approach would have seen us pick Daniel Rich instead of Stephen Hill. Just sayin'.

As for the stock market analogy, it really depends on how much you have to invest. If 200k represents 50% of your portfolio then sure, invest it in safe stocks. If you're Warren Buffet though, you'd probably take a punt on something high risk, high reward.

Translated to drafting, I guess that means the more draft picks you have, the more you can afford to punt. If you traded some players away and have 6 picks in the first 60, then you can afford some speculation since it stands to chance that at least 2 of those players will turn out well. If you only have 2 picks then you need to be more conservative.

 

[Reginald Perrin]

Especially this particular issue. There are hundreds of country kids who could have played AFL but instead chose to remain at home. Farmers' kids especially. Many of them can't imagine any life other than farming. I'm no expert on aboriginal culture but I'm willing to bet that, to many aboriginal people, staying with family is more important than money. And playing football with family and lifelong friends is more attractive than playing with a team of relative strangers to many, not just indigenous people.

I'm sure everyone here probably knows someone who plays at an amateur level who is good enough to take money to play elsewhere, but doesn't.

You're not really an expert on farming either, otherwise you would know the problems farmers faced during the mining boom when the majority of their kids left the farm chasing the big bucks. There is no parallel with what people in Josh's situation face at all.

 

[go_the_dockers]

That approach would have seen us pick Daniel Rich instead of Stephen Hill. Just sayin'.

As for the stock market analogy, it really depends on how much you have to invest. If 200k represents 50% of your portfolio then sure, invest it in safe stocks. If you're Warren Buffet though, you'd probably take a punt on something high risk, high reward.

Translated to drafting, I guess that means the more draft picks you have, the more you can afford to punt. If you traded some players away and have 6 picks in the first 60, then you can afford some speculation since it stands to chance that at least 2 of those players will turn out well. If you only have 2 picks then you need to be more conservative.

We probably wouldn't have Fyfe either, ohh well their goes my arguments. Please continue

 

[clogged]

I never saw Fyfe or Hill as unsafe picks tbh. IMO players for which the best answer to the question "what's their best role" is half back flanker are the most risk.

 

[Moo]

GilG - Josh Simpson the person everyday of the week.

 

[pokerspiv]

I never saw Fyfe or Hill as unsafe picks tbh. IMO players for which the best answer to the question "what's their best role" is half back flanker are the most risk.

It was pretty much agreed upon at the time that Daniel Rich was guaranteed to be a solid AFL player, whereas nobody really knew about Hill who was skinny and underdeveloped compared to Rich. Dockers picked Hill on potential and were rewarded, but it doesn't always work out that way.

Even until the start of this year some people might have said that we should have picked Rich. I doubt anyone still thinks that now.

 

[beetz]

Knee injury aside, Rich is a solid player and wouldn't have been a bust if Freo if they took him over Hill.

However having said that, if I had to choose I'd still have Hill. He is an absolute joy to watch.

 

[clogged]

Everything I read about Hill in his draft year was that he was ready to go in year 1 and likely to be taken in the first round. That's not a risk.

 

[Kram]

It would've been interesting to know where Hill would have gone if he wasn't picked by Freo.

 

[pokerspiv]

Everything I read about Hill in his draft year was that he was ready to go in year 1 and likely to be taken in the first round. That's not a risk.

I just remember at the time that the majority of the media were surprised that Hill went before Rich.

 

[slicedndiced]

Are you guys able to give some indication, without being too specific, of what pressures he is facing? Is it relatives/friends pressuring him to return to country or asking for money? Is there some version of the tall poppy syndrome where he is being chastised for 'becoming a white fella' or something similar?
I have a pretty good understanding of the culture but not so much the family unit and how indigenous hierarchy effects each individual within that group.

You've pretty much covered it mate. Right on the money.

That and his personal disconnect from country.

Its interesting to compare to Son-Son, i read an interview where he said the reason he loves AFL is because he can provide for his family. Doesn't seem like that is a priority for Josh.

Deep understanding being shown here.

But your empathy with aboriginals is on record on BF over the years.



Any chance that the drafting debate could go elsewhere?

This is probably one thread that doesn't need to go off topic.

 

[Allikat]

Freo picking up Josh Simpson in the first place was one of my prouder moments towards Freo. Getting a young aboriginal father from a remote community was always going to be risky but it would be a shame for the AFL to waste the amount of talent he's shown so far. And allowing him to continue playing in his home state, by being picked by Freo, was the first step in giving him the best opportunity to transition into a professional athlete. I love that Freo have always been a bit of a leader when it comes to supporting indigenous players and communities, and have shown this so well with the time and patience they've put in to Josh. There's not many teams that would change their mindset and put the effort in to make Josh's career happen for him, rather than try & change the person & drop them when the team realises the player isn't going to be the stereotypical AFL player.

This really highlights as well not just what a poor job the AFL & some teams are doing, but how poor the country as a whole is going when it comes to support for remote aboriginal communities & culture. While I grew up in the city, it was in a predominantly indigenous area, and I've also done my fair whack of travel to remote areas and it pained me to see people I grew up with end up in the same cycles as their families in terms of dropping out of school and some getting into alcohol or drugs at a very early age.

 

[pokerspiv]

You're not really an expert on farming either, otherwise you would know the problems farmers faced during the mining boom when the majority of their kids left the farm chasing the big bucks. There is no parallel with what people in Josh's situation face at all.

Majority of kids leaving is hardly a problem for farmers. Technological progress means less labour is needed per hectare every year, and working holiday visa regulations make it pretty easy to find casual labour when needed. It's dividing up the farm among the ones who stay that's a bigger issue.

I don't really think you know anything about the subject. You're just trying to have a dig at me as usual, and failing miserably.

 

[eddy2918]

Show some respect I reckon. Keep your personal shit out of here.

 

[Belnakor]

You've pretty much covered it mate. Right on the money.

That and his personal disconnect from country.

So basically he gives you a laundry list of excuses and you agree. Bravo.

Deep understanding being shown here.

thanks mate.

 

[Belnakor]

It would've been interesting to know where Hill would have gone if he wasn't picked by Freo.

pre draft most people had Hill low 1st round high 2nd round.

 

[Belnakor]

It was pretty much agreed upon at the time that Daniel Rich was guaranteed to be a solid AFL player, whereas nobody really knew about Hill who was skinny and underdeveloped compared to Rich. Dockers picked Hill on potential and were rewarded, but it doesn't always work out that way.

he played like 10 games for West Perth, not exactly under the radar.

 

[slicedndiced]

So basically he gives you a laundry list of excuses and you agree. Bravo.



thanks mate.

Seriously, if you haven't got anything of value to add, (and that definitely appears to be the case), then stay out of the thread.

 

[Keys]

Its interesting to compare to Son-Son, i read an interview where he said the reason he loves AFL is because he can provide for his family. Doesn't seem like that is a priority for Josh.

Unless I'm mistaken Walters grew up in the city which means whilst he and Simpson share their aboriginality there are any number of differences in their upbringing and world view which makes comparisons flawed.

Pretty sure I've said it before in this thread but I hope Simpson finds a pathway through football that brings him happiness and that he succeeds at Fremantle if for no other reason than if he were to be lost to AFL it makes it that little bit harder for the next indigenous kid from the bush to be drafted because recruiters will be that little bit more wary about the risks

On a broader level I think there's a role for the AFL to provide a development pathway for kids from remote communities outside the draft system that allows for talented young men to develop away from the clubs until a certain age before they become eligible for the draft - like Gerard Neeshams clontarf academy for blokes above school age

 

[pokerspiv]

he played like 10 games for West Perth, not exactly under the radar.

Not saying he was unknown, but that it was hard to tell at that stage how good he was going to be. Whereas Rich had dominated everything he did prior to the draft and was tipped to go earlier. I remember a few media commentators criticising Fremantle at the time (we were a struggling team then) for not going with the known quantity in Rich.

 

[Belnakor]

On a broader level I think there's a role for the AFL to provide a development pathway for kids from remote communities outside the draft system that allows for talented young men to develop away from the clubs until a certain age before they become eligible for the draft - like Gerard Neeshams clontarf academy for blokes above school age

The clontarf academy is an excellent example of something that does work. Putting a guy into a pressure cooker AFL system is not.

 

[Reginald Perrin]

Majority of kids leaving is hardly a problem for farmers. Technological progress means less labour is needed per hectare every year, and working holiday visa regulations make it pretty easy to find casual labour when needed. It's dividing up the farm among the ones who stay that's a bigger issue.

I don't really think you know anything about the subject. You're just trying to have a dig at me as usual, and failing miserably.

So totally the opposite of your previous stance that kids are reluctant to leave the farm to play AFL because they just love the place, therefore totally at odds with the topic of discussion. That's what I thought.