Lets stick to the plan- build the side from the draft

[prattsta]

Well, that's a bit meaningless. Kep was number 6. JON is a former number 8.

The draft is a crap shoot.

Given the choice would you of traded picks #1, #20 & #36 for Roughead and Franklin a few seasons ago?

We can only rate the trade on what we got for it. A disinterested KPP who went home as soon as his contract was up. Surely that's as bad as screwing up a high draft pick?

What happened at the time is we got two young highly rated key position players, gave up 3 picks in the national draft - 2 of them being later selections than the players we were bringing in - and still had the number 4 pick to use in the 'super' draft.

Who is to say we don't pick up Polak and Sampi in the draft? Go for Mark Seaby at #17 etc.

It falls down all over. We got screwed in that we didn't get a player worthy of pick 1, and then got screwed trading him away in that the Hawks got a player worth more than pick 10.

Look, I agree it turns to shit when you look back on in it. It's hard to argue that we didn't bring in two quality players though.

The fact that the Hawks ended up with an AA quality premiership KPP defender has nothing to with the fact we never saw a player of that quality in our recruitment of him. A failure from start to finish where Fremantle's concerned.

Obviously we did think Croad was a quality player as we gave up picks for him. Then we just gave up on him.

Anyway I can't be bothered going over this anymore it's been done to death.

 

[Clay Davis]

The draft is a crap shoot.

It isn't really. Some clubs get it consistently right and others get it consistently wrong.

Given the choice would you of traded picks #1, #20 & #36 for Roughead and Franklin a few seasons ago?

Depends on the quality of the draft, doesn't it? If the draft is very good and (one of) the players don't want to come to Freo, then why not go the draft?

Did Schwab know whether Croad actually wanted to play for Freo? Croad's attitude at the club was pretty poor - maybe he never wanted to come here. Where was the due diligence there?

If Schwab had no faith in the drafting team, then why didn't he and Connolly make changes there? Scout for someone more capable than Smart. They were at the club for 6-7 years, and made no changes to the way we recruited players through the draft.

What you're saying is that it was OK to have traded for Croad because our drafting team would have screwed it up anyway. Fair enough, that is quite probably true. But I don't see how that absolves Schwab and Connolly of their complete mismanagement of the football side of things, because they did not make a single change to how we drafted in the time they were here.

Harvey and Rosich have changed more regarding recruitment in the 1-2 years they've been at the club than Connolly and Schwab did in nearly seven.

 

[Catch 22]

Did Schwab know whether Croad actually wanted to play for Freo? Croad's attitude at the club was pretty poor - maybe he never wanted to come here. Where was the due diligence there?

Leading goalkicker with 42 in 2002 playing in an unfamiliar role. Acquitted himself every game.

Was one of the keys to Freo attaining the membership and financial security we now have.

Croad was good for Freo.

 

[wehavethepassion]

Posters have gone off on a tangent here me thinks.

I feel i was trying to make the point that the 3-4 players who wish to or being moved on to other clubs trading for draft picks is the way to go.
then use the picks to shore up the areas of need.

I think haze, pav, sandi, roger provide the "talented/class expereince" the
young bloods can learn from.

yes we do have other expereinced players in the side but most of them are no
walk up start in 2010.

 

[Clay Davis]

Leading goalkicker with 42 in 2002 playing in an unfamiliar role. Acquitted himself every game.

Was one of the keys to Freo attaining the membership and financial security we now have.

Croad was good for Freo.

More misinformation. Membership went down in 2002. People didn't rush in to join the club because of Croad. They did in 2003 because we started winning. But during 2003 Croad did nothing. The idea that we had to get a big name player to keep the club alive was a nonsense - why didn't it work with Peter Bell, Tony Modra, or Jeff Farmer?

 

[jinxd]

I agree, let's stick to the plan.

We can all look at past years of trading and drafting but we need to move forward. Learn from the past and focus on the future. I believe Harvey & Co. are doing that now. They're not trading players into the club or trading away draft picks. They're building a team from scratch. Which is not an easy task IMHO.

BTW... If you look at the top or most successful teams in the last few years, they all tend to have a very strong midfield (eg. Geelong, Hawthorn, St Kilda, W.Bulldogs etc.). Our midfield was slow and ageing. It is now being re-built to be faster (Hill) and younger (Palmer, Suban, Ibbo). Our new team is also becoming a lot more versatile. So this year's draft is going to be interesting.

 

[Catch 22]

More misinformation. Membership went down in 2002. People didn't rush in to join the club because of Croad. They did in 2003 because we started winning. But during 2003 Croad did nothing. The idea that we had to get a big name player to keep the club alive was a nonsense - why didn't it work with Peter Bell, Tony Modra, or Jeff Farmer?

Well bugger me. After a 2-20 season membership went down. Who would have thunk that.

Schwabb and Connolly got the club back on track. Recruiting Croad was part of that.

Yeah I know, plenty of stuff ups along the way, but we are where we are as a viable club because of them.

 

[Mundy]

Here's a reason why we should go the draft. Yes, he's got some work to do with his disposal at times, remember it's his third game of seniors.

But watch the run at 3.22 and again at the end - Love this kid, could be the next Boomer Harvey IMHO.

[youtube]F1F7kS2xBgM[/youtube]

 

[prattsta]

It isn't really. Some clubs get it consistently right and others get it consistently wrong.

Even in the 2001 super draft there were mistakes made. Polak, Sampi, Molan, Cole, Watson, Brooks were all taken in the top 20 (that's 30% of players). Several of whom were taken by clubs that are generally considered to be better performers at the national draft. No player is a sure thing, and every club has there skeletons. At least Croad and McPharlin had shown something at AFL level.

There is absolutely nothing wrong with trading picks for quality players. That's exactly what we did in 2001. History proves it. Where we actually went wrong was trading a quality player - who was down in form - for a draft selection which we turned into Ryley Dunn.

If you want to make an argument about the Croad dealings it should be that you should NOT trade for picks as they are an unknown quantity.

Depends on the quality of the draft, doesn't it? If the draft is very good and (one of) the players don't want to come to Freo, then why not go the draft?

Did Schwab know whether Croad actually wanted to play for Freo? Croad's attitude at the club was pretty poor - maybe he never wanted to come here. Where was the due diligence there?

And maybe he had no problems coming to Fremantle and it wasn't until after he was getting bagged left, right and centre that he decided he'd rather be elsewhere. A dollars per goal tally on 6PR? Really, that's how we treat our players? Nice. Sign me up.

Maybe he was a little to focused on his off-field activities but what 22 year old wouldn't be when they rock up to a fan base that is expecting/treating them as the second coming?

Croad kicked 42 goals (@ 2 gpg) as a 22 year old KP player in his first season at Fremantle. I would kill to have someone on our list capable of doing that right now. Hell Pavlich didn't kick over 40 goals until his 6th season.

If Schwab had no faith in the drafting team, then why didn't he and Connolly make changes there? Scout for someone more capable than Smart. They were at the club for 6-7 years, and made no changes to the way we recruited players through the draft.

I don't know. At a guess I'd say it was because they were not very good at their jobs.

What you're saying is that it was OK to have traded for Croad because our drafting team would have screwed it up anyway. Fair enough, that is quite probably true. But I don't see how that absolves Schwab and Connolly of their complete mismanagement of the football side of things, because they did not make a single change to how we drafted in the time they were here.

That's not what I'm saying at all. What I'm saying is that it's okay to trade away draft picks as long as you are getting a quality return. In the initial Croad/McPharlin trade I believe we got a decent deal. What transpired after that is a separate issue.

Harvey and Rosich have changed more regarding recruitment in the 1-2 years they've been at the club than Connolly and Schwab did in nearly seven.

And i am loving the fact they have.

 

[smkwd]

Here's a reason why we should go the draft. Yes, he's got some work to do with his disposal at times, remember it's his third game of seniors.

But watch the run at 3.22 and again at the end - Love this kid, could be the next Boomer Harvey IMHO.

[youtube]F1F7kS2xBgM[/youtube]

Well spotted Mundy. Nice turn of pace and doesn't mind backing himself to break the lines. If he was a foot taller and kept his hands to himself, he'd be Chris Judd.

We needed to replace Peter Bell, and this kid might be it. The skills will come with time, but the self-belief is already there.

 

[footyfix]

I was lovin the Jetta and Wolfy cameos in there as well

 

[footyfix]

Oh and for the record,I was speaking to a board member recently and He said their focus is a replay of 2008 in this years draft so get ready for heaps more kids. Yeah bring it on!

 

[Centurions]

Well spotted Mundy. Nice turn of pace and doesn't mind backing himself to break the lines. If he was a foot taller and kept his hands to himself, he'd be Chris Judd.

We needed to replace Peter Bell, and this kid might be it. The skills will come with time, but the self-belief is already there.

and that is the key to to Colyer, he is quick as lightning but is under 180cm which we have too many of, we need a big bodied midfielder, though if he was there with a later pic, cant use a 1st round pick on a player who has an if about him this year...

 

[legitimatic]

I don't think anyone was suggesting using pick 4 on Colyer, but if he is there at 20 (and Jetta isn't) we should snap him up.

 

[Rob]

No argument here. We may have to accept trading will be a feature during the compromised draft period involving GC and WS. Our ability to gain the kids and target the age group that will enable player longevity at the club may be come an issue.

Bollocks. All it will mean is that our draft picks are a few spots lower than what they would have otherwise been. If we come 14th, then we'd get what, pick 8 or 9? And our later picks are going to be 8 or 10 spots lower than usual. Big deal - once you get past about pick 25 it's unlikely that you're going to get trumped for a player in the picks immediately preceding yours. If he's available at pick 35, he's probably going to be there at pick 43.

It doesn't change shit.

 

[Selggad]

Agree with the OP. Stick to the plan. Build a side. We want a team that are Freo through and through, not imports. Trading should be the exception rather than the rule and at this stage we should be drafting for picks.

 

[dominguez]

I feel i was trying to make the point that the 3-4 players who wish to or being moved on to other clubs trading for draft picks is the way to go.
then use the picks to shore up the areas of need.

Horses for courses IMO. If there is a key forward or back available this trade week we should look at it because at this stage Pavlich could be the only KPP on our list ready to play in 2011.

If we trade Tarrant for a pick in the 15-20 range and Peake and Drum for a player who could potentially play FB/CHB I'd be happy.

 

[Boppo]

Bell goes down in history as one of our best ever players, probably behind Pavlich with Sandilands rising.

J Carr was definitely a fairly ordinary return for us, and Headland you would have to say has not lived up to expectations, especially the expectations that a #1 draft pick has on them.

Disagree with Josh Carr. He kept me sane through some pretty horrible years bashing whoever their biggest player was and most of the Eagles..

 

[EastcoastDocker]

agree that we should be using the draft

I think Cuddles and schwab did what they had to do and i dont think their trades were that bad. At the time headland looked like he was gonna be sometype of prototype 2030 brownlow mid sent back in time to save FFC. croad/mcpharlin trade was meant to give us a spine for the next 8 yrs with pavlich at chf and polak drafted that year too. With tarrant they obv thought our window was still open. IMO they had a plan. It failed. Shit happens.

what is the most perpexling about FFC is that we have never been able to draft an awesome midfielder. Hopefully suban and hill can rectify that.. and palmer learns to kick...

 

[dominguez]

what is the most perpexling about FFC is that we have never been able to draft an awesome midfielder. Hopefully suban and hill can rectify that.. and palmer learns to kick...

We haven't actually taken many genuine mids in the first round which is surprising.

Walker, Hasleby, Schammer and Palmer are the only players that were true midfielders when recruited in the first round in the 15 drafts since we entered the comp.