Life Members

[ptw]

Its been 10 years and what does everyone think.

My view:

The directors of PAFC in 1990 were acting in the best interests of their club...which is what they are put there for.

They were not acting in the best interests of SA football, but you could argue they were not there to do that anyway.

If you take the view that the SANFL were talking to the VFL and plaing hard to get then Port just pulled the rug out completely from underneath them destroying their negotiating position.

You could also argue whether the SANFL were acting in the best interests of SA football as well ???

At the time I was stoked and it was just another chance to stick it up my Norwood mates (who ended up sticking it up me)...but looking back I would like to know what the result for SA football, the national comp, and Port if Port had stuck to the SANFL line and held firm with the other clubs.

I tend to think that:

SA football would be stronger as we may well have had some form of zone to be able to keep players in the state.

The national comp would be better as it would be more of an Australian Football Leauge and not an expanded VFL.

Port would probably be far less significant than it is now.

With hindsight what may have been best if for Port to talk with the SANFL saying "look...were going...but we willgive you 24 months to work out a deal...SO LONG AS we go as well". Easy in hindsight though.

What do you think ?

ptw

 

[Macca19]

I think it was to the benefit of the SANFL. If Port didnt speak with the AFL, then SANFL would be very stale at this stage. Not much money would of been going into the SANFL or the clubs, and it would of got boring. With Port pushing the liscence, the crows were formed, which created a big revenue for the football clubs in this state.
The AFL were having discussions with Norwood at the same stage as having them with Port, but Port beat them to the announcement!
I tend to think that that loser Max Basheer and his cronies were living in the past. Joining the AFL was a step forward for this state. Not a step back as they were thinking. If we didnt push, then SA football would be pretty much dead right about now.

 

[Guest]

I think the lack of turmoil that occurred is the big factor. We still have the second best competition in the land and are attracting some very good discards from the AFL.

It's difficult to wonder what would have happended if the Crows hadn't joined the AFL ten years ago. There would probably still be teams in NSW, QLD and two from WA and SA would have been left out in the cold.

The fact that Port pushed the SANFL into action was, in hindsight, a huge bonus for SA because the SANFL were stuffing around waiting for the VFL to make a load of concessions that were never going to happen.

 

[ptw]

and SA football is not dead now Macca ?

ptw

 

[ptw]

Spogs

if you look at the deal Port had it crapped on the Crows deal...it included significantly more draft concessions, no liscence fee, and the retention of a zone.

If the AFL would offer that to Port why not to the SANFL. In the end they did not have to as the SANFL lost their monopoly on SA football and the AFL could trade Port off against the SANFL.

Anyway...interesting that we should hold these views given our respective teams !!

ptw

 

[Grave Danger]

It's funny really, Port Adelaide has the image of being a 'working class' club whose supporters are a bunch of dole bludging ferals. But when you look a bit deeper, Port's audacious go-it-alone 1990 bid and the fact that the second AFL license went to one club, rather than another SANFL-wide collective would have the free enterprise purists smiling.

Premier Olson should be a Port supporter!

 

[carb70]

I believe Port were sucked in by the VFL. They were really in a no win situation it was either they make the move to the VFL or Norwood were going to jump in before them. The thing that pissed me off was then Norwood played innocent like they were the good boys.

Then Glenelg take us to court, but I was never prouder of the club than GF day 1990 when we beat Glenelg out on the field not in the courts and I will never forget the look on the faces of the pathetic Glenelg supporters as I walked out of Football Park.

The SANFL I believe were going to join the VFL but they wanted to join it under their conditions not the VFLs. I think Port took that option away from the SANFL.

I believe if Port didn't try to join in 1990 we would today have Norwood and Port in the AFL instead of the Crows. We would of had one team on the Eastern side of town the other on the Western and their would be a better rivalry with even supporter bases. Then we could of had Norwood and Port reserve sides in the SANFL.

I think the SANFL would be happy with the Crows being a finacial success though but they did have a 7 year head start on Port which means they have the majority of the states supporter base. The SANFL are probably a bit concerned about Ports situation as far as crowds and the finacial loss recorded last year. But that will be ok in years to come because I beleive the club is heading in the right direction to be the states more successful team which will bring the people to our games.

I think the biggest loser out of all this has been Norwood but as far as the local league goes it still strong but not as strong as it was 10 years ago but you could also say that the league in 1990 wasn't as strong as it was in 1980 and so on. I think the SANFL will survive mainly because of our 2 AFL clubs.

 

[Macca19]

Originally posted by ptw:
and SA football is not dead now Macca ?

ptw

no i dont think it is. I think its going ok. There is a lot more money going thru, a lot more past AFL players going thru the SANFL, the skill level i believe has stayed on a par i think, seeing as most of the SANFL players with skill have been drafted.
I think its going ok...crowds are down, but thats bound to happen with two AFL teams, and the crows playing away usually on a saturday arvo which is when the SANFL games are played.

 

[Macca19]

Originally posted by ptw:
Spogs

if you look at the deal Port had it crapped on the Crows deal...it included significantly more draft concessions, no liscence fee, and the retention of a zone.

If the AFL would offer that to Port why not to the SANFL. In the end they did not have to as the SANFL lost their monopoly on SA football and the AFL could trade Port off against the SANFL.
ptw

The AFL wanted Port in...not an adelaide side. They spoke to both Norwood and Port in 1990, Port went public about it, while Norwood lied about the whole thing to save face. The AFL has always wanted Port in thr league.

 

[Asgardian]

Ports moves circa 1990 were pre-emptive, if we did not make said moves, the AFL would have got a SA team through another door.

I was of the opinion the SANFL directors were most comfortable camped on their hands around that time.

The SANFL was going to suffer a decline, because we did not have the available cash reserves to long hold off the recruiting of our good players. So in effect Port's stand forced the issue, and ultimately has proven to be a financial godsend to the SANFL.

------------------
Chris

(Yes Virginia, there is a Santa Claus)

 

[ptw]

Asgardian

that's one way of looking at it.

The other way is that the SANFL were actually negotiating with the VFL....just looking to enter a team on the SANFL's not the VFL's terms.

By Port doing what we did we took that option away from the SANFL...who were forced with a gun to their head to negotiate knowing that at any time the AFL could walk straight to Port and have a team anyway.

Macca

The AFL did not want Port at all. The AFL directors voted 9-6 against Port and 15-1 in favour of Adelaide (people say this was an issue with Collingwood but ignore the other 5 clubs who voted against us). The AFL wanted a team from SA to get the TV rights. They wanted that team to be as popular as possible. This meant first priority was a composite side...2nd was the most popular state side.

I agree that Norwood were the big losers and that their cries were a bit hard to take at the time given their obvious involvement as well.

I still think it was the wrong thing to do....if you look at it from a SA football perspective.

ptw

 

[Macca19]

Hey Chris

from what remember and have read, the AFL board had always wanted port inn, but couldnt pass it alone. From memory, the AFL contacted Port, but Norwood contacted the AFL about the matters, something along those lines

 

[Mudholian]

Originally posted by carb70:
I believe Port were sucked in by the VFL. SNIP

A good summary. Lets be specific about how the AFl "sucked Port in".

Port had made no secret of their intentions to enter the VFL/AFL. Discussions had been going on since the early 80's. But the first club to break rank on the so called "Victor Harbor Accord" was Norwood, not Port, as you have said.

These negotiations were initiated in secret behind the back of the SANFL on June 8 1990 when the board of the Norwood Football Club invited Ian Collins and John Adams to a presentation by the NFC board on the advantages of Norwood being the first SA side in. This is AFTER Norwood had voted - with the Port Rep Dave Boyd - not to pursue the entry of an SA team.

The sucking in part is that the correspondence between the Norwood Football Club and the AFL was leaked to the Port Adelaide Football Club and others in order to do one of two things: 1) force Norwood to declare their intentions OR 2) force Port to respond.

However when this became public, QUOTE "Norwood then RAN SCARED and accused us of being the stooges of the AFL" said Collins. "But they got that all wrong".

Meanwhile Port initiated its own meeting with Schwab, but not until July. Rather than "running scared", the PAFC decided it would go for it.

"The SANFL was caught sitting on its hands" writes Garry Linnell, who documents the full account of this much misrepresented chapter in SA football history in his "Football LTD - The Inside Story of the AFL" pages 347-350.

So my view is this. As in a lot of defining moments in PA culture, the end justifies the means, and the end is to win. We did - in the end.
MH