List Mgmt. List Management Thread

[spenze]

Small sample I know, but off a wing, Cook played well on the weekend, great user of the ball and composed when he had it in hand. I'd persist with him in that role for a few games to se if he can grab the opportunity. So maybe he and Fritch could still be in the same side if that was something the club was considring

Maybe but what I was responding to was the view that Fritsch offers nothing that Cook couldn't do. For me it is insane that we are still talking about his potential of what he could do and based on that we shouldn't bring in proven talent with runs on the board if we could afford it.

I'd like nothing more than Cook to make it and his game on the weekend was much better than I had seen before from him, he was playing a role you'd want (link between mid and forward as he does have very good footskills unlike, say a Murphy)but you wouldn't put him above a guy who ran riot in a GF and kicked 6 goals.

 

[Scorpus]

See I wonder if Walker even fits in this forward line atm and Fritsch isn’t half the player he is.

They are also not comparable.

One of the advantages of playing Tex is he’s really good up the ground, and can use his kicking on either side to set up plays that 95% of players can’t. Fritsch doesn’t do that at all. He works best when he plays deep forward.

Our other two talls are great up the ground. I don't see the problem with a Tex replacement being a deep marking forward

 

[Soggy2112]

Our other two talls are great up the ground. I don't see the problem with a Tex replacement being a deep marking forward

You don’t see an issue with adding in a forward who needs heaps of supply for his style of game to work, in to a forward line that’s already stacked with talent and is working well?

As I keep saying, if Tex goes, his replacement in the side does not need to be a big goalkicker, they just need to be someone that can fit in to the system and do a role. Any of Cook, Taylor, Pedlar, Nankervis, Dowling etc could be that.

I mentioned Cook because we saw on the weekend before he was concussed that he can fit in and be a positive impact on the side, even with limited touches. I seriously doubt that Fritsch would.

 

[Scorpus]

You don’t see an issue with adding in a forward who needs heaps of supply for his style of game to work, in to a forward line that’s already stacked with talent and is working well?

As I keep saying, if Tex goes, his replacement in the side does not need to be a big goalkicker, they just need to be someone that can fit in to the system and do a role. Any of Cook, Taylor, Pedlar, Nankervis, Dowling etc could be that.

I mentioned Cook because we saw on the weekend before he was concussed that he can fit in and be a positive impact on the side, even with limited touches. I seriously doubt that Fritsch would.

I think we have a forward system good enough to get the ball to Fritsch for 40+ goals a season

I don't think any of the players you listed are 40+ goal forwards.

We've seen what happens when we replace Walker with a role player forward like Burgess. They have very poor output because they aren't that good

 

[Soggy2112]

Maybe but what I was responding to was the view that Fritsch offers nothing that Cook couldn't do. For me it is insane that we are still talking about his potential of what he could do and based on that we shouldn't bring in proven talent with runs on the board if we could afford it.

I'd like nothing more than Cook to make it and his game on the weekend was much better than I had seen before from him, he was playing a role you'd want (link between mid and forward as he does have very good footskills unlike, say a Murphy)but you wouldn't put him above a guy who ran riot in a GF and kicked 6 goals.

I did not say that Cook would be as good as Fritsch.

What I said was that what Fritsch would offer in our side, if we were to hypothetically get him, is not any more than what I think Cook could offer.

Fritsch is a good player, but he needs to be deep forward, and he needs a lot of supply for his game to work. That would mean taking supply and space away from TT, Fog, Rach, Izak and even Dawson.

In this hypothetical where we go for Fritsch, it’d require him to reinvent himself completely to find room in our forward line, I just don’t see what the benefit would be when we have good options on the sidelines that would be significantly cheaper.

It’s not just about the player, it’s about how they fit into a specific team.

 

[fossilllCrow]

I know Zac Bailey

33

Zac Bailey

Age

26

Ht

181cm

Wt

84kg

Pos.

M/F

Career

Season

Last 5

D

12.7

3star

K

6.9

3star

HB

5.9

4star

M

3.0

3star

T

2.2

4star

CL

0.9

3star

D

12.9

3star

K

7.3

3star

HB

5.6

3star

M

3.9

4star

T

2.4

3star

CL

0.7

3star

D

13.4

4star

K

6.6

3star

HB

6.8

5star

M

3.2

4star

T

2.8

5star

CL

0.6

3star

has been spoken about but today there was an article about his mother suffering a stroke. Absolutely terrible for her of course. But that would be a huge reason to move back to SA surely!

 

[hugecannon]

I did not say that Cook would be as good as Fritsch.

What I said was that what Fritsch would offer in our side, if we were to hypothetically get him, is not any more than what I think Cook could offer.

Fritsch is a good player, but he needs to be deep forward, and he needs a lot of supply for his game to work. That would mean taking supply and space away from TT, Fog, Rach, Izak and even Dawson.

In this hypothetical where we go for Fritsch, it’d require him to reinvent himself completely to find room in our forward line, I just don’t see what the benefit would be when we have good options on the sidelines that would be significantly cheaper.

It’s not just about the player, it’s about how they fit into a specific team.

Also the fact that Melbourne have dropped him and are potentially looking to let him go given how inconsistent their forward line is warning signs for me.

He isn’t the same player he was 3-4 years ago.

 

[Soggy2112]

I think we have a forward system good enough to get the ball to Fritsch for 40+ goals a season

I don't think any of the players you listed are 40+ goal forwards.

We've seen what happens when we replace Walker with a role player forward like Burgess. They have very poor output because they aren't that good

Players don’t exist in a vacuum though. For Fritsch to kick his 40+ we would need to take opportunities away from TT, Fog, Rachele, Rankine and Dawson, because Fritsch is a ball hungry player. They would kick less.

I don’t know why you’re mentioning Burgess. Not once did I suggest him. He is a slow, marking type. I am saying that if we played one of our mobile, skilled, medium sized types, such as Cook, Pedlar or Taylor that they would complement our current forwards so much better. These are players who have all made solid contributions and not gotten in our star forwards way when they have played. Crucially, they would also cost us significantly less than Fritsch.

 

[Kane McGoodwin]

NWM, Georgia’s, Rozee, Butters, JHF. If you can’t build a premiership around that you may as well give up.

Gets pretty thin after that though.

 

[Soggy2112]

Gets pretty thin after that though.

Players 16-23 being decent quality is just as important as your stars a lot of the time.

 

[Kane McGoodwin]

ROB gets a lot hitout to advantage but a lot them go the opposition instead, more so than any other Ruck in the comp.

This confirms what I have often said, that whilst ROB wins plenty of taps, many don't actually advantage our midfielders.

Would be interesting to see split over past month as feeks like its been better connection.

 

[Mr MysteryGuest]

Exactly where did this person source these statistics and their validity? I'd be very interested if there is a site that goes into this much detail if it exists.

I posted a follow up in the thread but if you into the Twitter replies you’ll see her explanation

 

[Mutineer]

So 2

I posted a follow up in the thread but if you into the Twitter replies you’ll see her explanation

I don't know who this person is but she hardly has Champion Data like credibility I wouldn'tr have thought.

 

[spenze]

Gets pretty thin after that though.

No it doesn't, it has Rioli, no way in the world is he thin

 

[Sizzlepack]

So 2

I don't know who this person is but she hardly has Champion Data like credibility I wouldn'tr have thought.

Emlyn's work is pretty much as good as it gets outside of clubland. He gets his data from the FitzRoy R data package: https://cran.r-project.org/web/packages/fitzRoy/index.html

Which itself uses AFL stats.

 

[Mutineer]

Emlyn's work is pretty much as good as it gets outside of clubland. He gets his data from the FitzRoy R data package: https://cran.r-project.org/web/packages/fitzRoy/index.html

Which itself uses AFL stats.

Can't see where any of those links have anything even close to Champion data's credibility or where that links to the stats they posted.

 

[Sizzlepack]

Can't see where any of those links have anything even close to Champion data's credibility or where that links to the stats they posted.

What stats do you think CD uses? He's using a statistical programming language to analyse AFL stats. The data is what it is, and I'm not sure on what basis you're disputing it (and I'm not sure you do either).

 

[bmac84]

Dawson would work well in the Tex role (third forward) given his leg and marking power, and probably also prolongs his career a bit. Just need Draper (or others) to step up so we don't lose too much from our midfield.

 

[Mutineer]

What stats do you think CD uses? He's using a statistical programming language to analyse AFL stats. The data is what it is, and I'm not sure on what basis you're disputing it (and I'm not sure you do either).

Then show me where the links on that post link to stats for "sharks"....maybe I'm missing something if so you show how.

Champion Data actually have teams of statisticians physically at all AFL games and most State Leagues I believe?.

 

[Pea Nut]

NWM, Georgia’s, Rozee, Butters, JHF. If you can’t build a premiership around that you may as well give up.

The Carlton model of loading up on top end talent and using scraps across the rest of the ground has shown time and again not to work.

 

[Sizzlepack]

Then show me where the links on that post link to stats for "sharks"....maybe I'm missing something if so you show how.

Champion Data actually have teams of statisticians physically at all AFL games and most State Leagues I believe?.

Think the full post will probably explain it, if you've not seen it already: https://thisweekinfootball.com/twif/round-19-2025/#shark-week

 

[Kane McGoodwin]

Dawson would work well in the Tex role (third forward) given his leg and marking power, and probably also prolongs his career a bit. Just need Draper (or others) to step up so we don't lose too much from our midfield.

He could finish his career playing up forward like Roo.

 

[Kane McGoodwin]

The Carlton model of loading up on top end talent and using scraps across the rest of the ground has shown time and again not to work.

& Trading in average players on inflated salaries.

 

[conVINCEd]

Can we steal Ashton Moir from the mess at Carlton?

Josh Gabelic reported this week he was close to signing an extension but I’d love to bring him home - is currently out of contract in two months.

 

[Mutineer]