September 30, 2000 - Stadium Australia - Spain v Cameroon - 104,098
May 25, 2006 - MCG - Australia v Greece - 95,103
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TAS Looks like Tassie are serious.
- Thread starter tess
- Start date
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September 30, 2000 - Stadium Australia - Spain v Cameroon - 104,098
May 25, 2006 - MCG - Australia v Greece - 95,103
Next.
Some supporters of Aussie Rules really do make us all look like xenophobic idiots. 
As for Tasmania, I am on their bandwagon
As for Tasmania, I am on their bandwagon
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auspicious
Rookie
If the Tassie government is going to give $15m a year, they did another $15m for other revenues, they will be better than most of the poor Victoria. Then, the argument is bs that Tassie cant support a team.
More teams equals more games and Monday night footy maybe possible with extra cash for tv rights.
More teams equals more games and Monday night footy maybe possible with extra cash for tv rights.
I don't know where rotto's figure of $15m came from. That is a 5 yearly figure for sponsoring Hawthorn, and would likely not be continued if Tassie had its own team.
Sometimes I don't know things. It happens. But when that happens, I don't just make numbers up. Whenever Tasmania is mentioned, people seem to to go for this "make numbers up" or "make statements based on no research at all".
In April Saul Eslake stated that Tasmania has a gross state product of $21 billion.
http://www.news.com.au/mercury/story/0,22884,23488141-13222,00.html
Then last Thursday our treasurer handed down the state budget for 2008-09 - $4 billion of it.
http://www.news.com.au/mercury/story/0,22884,23852762-921,00.html
And on Saturday it was announced the AFL bid team was in "advanced negotiations" with a major sponsor, so the Govt would not be funding the team anyway.
http://www.realfooty.com.au/news/news/tasmania-bid-picks-up-steam/2008/06/13/1213321624840.html
It only takes a little bit of googling!
^ I like you, Chuq. We need more posters like you around here
As for Hawkk, looks like another Hawthorn supporter has been caught making things up on the expansion board.
As for Hawkk, looks like another Hawthorn supporter has been caught making things up on the expansion board.
The first game was played between two foreign countries (highlighted for those battlers who think that Spain and Cameroon are new outer suburbs of Australian cities). This was an Olympic final so the big attendance was expected considering many people just go to see the big event.
The second game was a friendly (i.e. practice match) between Australia and Greece. 95k to a practice match.
- May 10, 2006
- 1,990
- 5
- AFL Club
- Essendon
Of course Tassie are serious, and that is why this current bid will go a lot further than previous attempts, as not only are we resting on the ol' 'we deserve it' mentality, but we are actually committing up-front funds to prove that we can not only support but administer this team successfully.
All we need now is for the Tassie football public to stop being so cynical and unite under the 'spirit of the Map'. Events like those on the weekend can only help:
http://www.news.com.au/mercury/story/0,22884,23869939-3462,00.html
http://www.news.com.au/mercury/story/0,22884,23866720-3462,00.html
All we need now is for the Tassie football public to stop being so cynical and unite under the 'spirit of the Map'. Events like those on the weekend can only help:
http://www.news.com.au/mercury/story/0,22884,23869939-3462,00.html
http://www.news.com.au/mercury/story/0,22884,23866720-3462,00.html
MadBomberfan
Senior List
Saul Eslake is half-right. Vlad is only contemptuous of Tasmania.
I suspect that the only thking he will be interested inmaybe, is using the Tasmanian bid as a threatening tool/bargaining chip/big stick to beat on the GC or WS to get wha he wants.
"If you don't do <insert subject of threat>, we'll start talking to Tasmania. They're keen to join the AFL".
Hopefully the team will put a case on the table that simply cannot be ignored.
I suspect that the only thking he will be interested inmaybe, is using the Tasmanian bid as a threatening tool/bargaining chip/big stick to beat on the GC or WS to get wha he wants.
"If you don't do <insert subject of threat>, we'll start talking to Tasmania. They're keen to join the AFL".
Hopefully the team will put a case on the table that simply cannot be ignored.
And when the government changes, or actually starts spending on health, education, etc, what happens? And where has the govt said anything about giving $15m a year? Even Lennon; whose one specialty was serving special interest with big ticket stunts; never said that.
It has to be able to survive without govt money, and then if the govt of the day chips in, well and good. But Tas can't even put together a bid without the government leading the way (and that in a desperate attempt to appease the Mercury; who actually started this push yet again; for a week or two).
And it has to be able to survive with under 2% of national GDP (comparing state product to national product isn't necessarily a proper copmparison, and domestic product is not necessarily a sign of money available; but based on the reaily available figures and not being an economist, its the best I can do), less than 2.5% of national population with about 1% in any single population catchment (Hobart and immediate surrounds is just over 210k, perhaps 230k if the whole of Derwent Valley and Huon Valley and Channel are added), no interest from TV networks as it is only the less valuable on-sell and they do not broadcast directly into the markets (Tasmania can not be treated as one market due to the north-south divide; which is less than it used to be, but still very real), minimal corporate box sales due to hardly having anyone worth bribing with corporate entertainment and the few that do exist being spread across the state (the boxes would sell, but at greatly reduced rates).
And all that in the state that is always first into, and last out economic problems, largely because it doesn't have a major city to act as a "wealth magnet"; where the ABS forecasts having with minimal (and possibly negative) population growth in the next 20 years - and which adds nothing to the footy support base as everyone already has a team.
In the short term Tas would be better than WS; in 30 years time with similar amoounts of funding from the AFL Tas would be still making losses while WS could be breaking even and should have added numerous new fans to the game.
In ternms of history and "deserving" a side, no contest, Tas wins hands down. In terms of winning new people to Australian Football, and eventual return on investment (and these appear to be the criteria for new clubs) Tas isn't even a starter in the race.
That said, the AFL appears to be seriously under-estimating the costs of getting WS and GC viable. "Not much change from $100m" may well be more like "more than $1b over 20 to 30 years".
The Queensland government don't want a Gold Coast team and are doing every thing to block it. The Tasmanian government does want an AFL team and is doing everything to get one. The answer would seem to be obvious - let Tassie in now and defer the Gold Coast for 5 years until the Gabba deal has run out. By then a Victorian team will want to relocate and everyone will be happy!
Well said. The two regions have similar populations. One region has no competition and a supportive government, the other region has competition from two other football codes and has a hostile government. It's crazy to put the Gold Coast in over Tasmania. Imagine spending $ 200 million on a new stadium and then being happy with crowds of 15,000. The Queensland government would sit there laughing at the AFL. Not only does it contribute to the Queensland economy, it even does its job of building stadiums.
In Tassie, the AFL wouldn't need to spend anything and would probably get crowds of 25,000.
As for AFL fans on the Gold Coast, they will keep watching AFL even without a local team. Very few will convert to league. Look at Ron Clark. His been there and resisted the urge to become a rugby league man.
100% correct, couldn't have put it better.
The Queensland Government are quite happy to have an afl team, they just don't want to pay for it.
They also want to recoup what they spent on the Gabba re-development, and make the AFL abide by the conditions that they agreed to, so that the re-development money was spent.
As highlighted in Littlejohns post above, romance says put a team in Tassie, but business reality says Gold Coast and West Sydney.
Tasmania has a lot of economic potential. It is not harnessing that potential because its a backwater inhabited by too many people who believe that the future lies with tourism, and want their kids to grow up to be toilet cleaners or hospitality workers.
That kind of thinking has prevailed because its isolated from the mainland. An AFL team could really change that. You would be getting more exposure to sensible thinking and a more diverse range of industries would develop.
If Tasmania could just get to a critical mass, it would be able to provide the kind of economic and social diversity that would attract people to live there. It really is a beautiful place.
Aside from the economic potential, Tasmania would offer value in terms of image. You can't assess everything in terms of the bottom line. An extra state in the AFL would build the codes national creditials. In the northern states, the national creditials, rightly or wrongly, just aren't very strong.
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Sadly, I don't think thats true. In the same way that Australia's smartest and best business people move overseas, (brain drain) for opportunities, so must Tasmanias as there is no decent opportunities.
While I am completely making up these figures, there must be (conservatively) 10 times more business opportunities in Melbourne, than Tassie, More again in Sydney, and 10 times more again in London and New York.
Its economic reality. Ask yourself if you know of anyone who has ever been asked to move to Tasmania for work?
It is an issue of critical mass. Once a city reaches a certain size, it can produce all these other industries that churn the cash around. Some estimates have put that population at 500,000.
Just think of what Tassie has going for it
1) Water - cleanest water in Australia, which is the reason why it makes the best beer.
2) Some of the best wine growing regions in Australia
3) An abundance of renewable electricity
4) Clean coastal areas with cool ocean currents that hold more oxygen. Great for aquaculture.
5)Safe, clean, stable with a good environment. If it got a desirable culture, property developers would make a killing and people would move there from all over the world.
Unfortunately, Tassie has a very undesirable culture of people who fear and oppose change so it keeps producing politicians like Bob Brown and Brian Harradine. Few around the world would willingly move to be around such people, and no business in their right mind would relocate to Tassie with such politicians being in control. If you get some change and a more diverse range of people, Tassie's assets could be harnessed very quickly and its economic prospects wouldn't be comparable to the Solomon Islands.
That disintegrated quickly...
It's a bit rough to be calling Tasmanians backwards when states like Qld produce Pauline Hanson and Joh, and the mainland provided the majority clout that saw John Howard stay in office for 11 years...Green politics could be called all sorts of things (even "insane" at times), but it could never be accused of backwardness...in world terms, being green is a fairly progressive attitude, and outside Europe, only Tasmania has had a green govt...it's not conservatism that drives Tassie, it's our greater vulnerability to being hijacked by outsiders and extremists...pretty easy to be a nature lover when you stand in one of those forests, and all it took was a few Euros with canoes and cameras to get it all rolling...
What mainlanders always miss the point of is Tasmania's demographic uniqueness. More than half the state live 200km+ from the capital. The size of a big city suburb, and yet it's a fully fledged state. The population alone throws up all sorts of quirks, and without going into the whole story, let's just say that when a small segment of the population lobbies for something, it might translate to a handful of people making noise - that same percentage in Sydney is thousands, enough to make a petition or bid to parliament that gets on the news and gets things done. Homosexuality was finally legalised only recently, but you can put that down to these types of numbers as activists rather than phobia of the population...
None of these simplistic rationalisations work, althought the general point that we'd struggle to keep a team up is right...conclusion is correct, but it's cooincidental to your working out...
It's a bit rough to be calling Tasmanians backwards when states like Qld produce Pauline Hanson and Joh, and the mainland provided the majority clout that saw John Howard stay in office for 11 years...Green politics could be called all sorts of things (even "insane" at times), but it could never be accused of backwardness...in world terms, being green is a fairly progressive attitude, and outside Europe, only Tasmania has had a green govt...it's not conservatism that drives Tassie, it's our greater vulnerability to being hijacked by outsiders and extremists...pretty easy to be a nature lover when you stand in one of those forests, and all it took was a few Euros with canoes and cameras to get it all rolling...
What mainlanders always miss the point of is Tasmania's demographic uniqueness. More than half the state live 200km+ from the capital. The size of a big city suburb, and yet it's a fully fledged state. The population alone throws up all sorts of quirks, and without going into the whole story, let's just say that when a small segment of the population lobbies for something, it might translate to a handful of people making noise - that same percentage in Sydney is thousands, enough to make a petition or bid to parliament that gets on the news and gets things done. Homosexuality was finally legalised only recently, but you can put that down to these types of numbers as activists rather than phobia of the population...
None of these simplistic rationalisations work, althought the general point that we'd struggle to keep a team up is right...conclusion is correct, but it's cooincidental to your working out...
Already taken advantage of by two small breweries. Who then send their profits out of Tasmania
For what? Pre-chilled wine?. Not trying to be rude, but again a small boutique industry
Enough to supply Tasmania now, but not much more without environmental damage of more dams.
Unfortunately, Tassie has a very undesirable culture of people who fear and oppose change so it keeps producing politicians like Bob Brown and Brian Harradine. Few around the world would willingly move to be around such people, and no business in their right mind would relocate to Tassie with such politicians being in control. If you get some change and a more diverse range of people, Tassie's assets could be harnessed very quickly and its economic prospects wouldn't be comparable to the Solomon Islands.
I admire your positivity but...
My mum is Tasmanian, and I have spent plenty of time there. Enough to know that I don't want to live there, and that most of my relatives who do live there don't want to either.
Having said that. If Tasmania did get an AFL team at least it would be a passionately supported club rather than the soulless franchises that we are about to see created in NSW and Queensland
Of course Tasmania is backwards. The people fear change and its politicians are famous for opposing everything. So much so, the Tasmanians that want a bit of diversity and progress in their lives move to the mainland.
What is this Green progress that you are talking about? I can't see much progress in a society that makes people want to leave it. Now, you can criticise Queensland if you want, but people from south and around the world want to move there. That says something.
Tasmania is just the classic example of isolated communities not having enough exposure to diversity. Getting an AFL team down there would help immensely.
For the beer, what about world export? You don't just need to sell to Tasmanians. The wine regions are very good as is most fresh produce. You can do a lot of value adding there. Indeed wine itself is a small industry but it a very useful industry for building a regions reputation. Countries like France benefit from the romantic, environment, culture, tradition and historic associations of their wine industries and these helps other cultural industries.
Your key sentence here is "I have spent plenty of time there. Enough to know that I don't want to live there, and that most of my relatives who do live there don't want to either."
Tasmania is a beautiful place. It just has a backwards culture and few employment opportunities outside of growing potatoes or cleaning toilets for tourists.