Game Day Match simulation v GWS

[wolftone57]

For all the.
"Don't read too much into it. Its only a preseason/practice game"

Thats BS IMO.

The best swans seasons have always started with decent Feb/March hit outs before season proper.

In 2016 the Giants flogged us at Drummoyne Oval. I was there that day and we were woeful. The only consolation was seeing Tom Papley play and I knew then we had a potential star.

 

[RUNVS]

But we've got 4 AA midfielders in the team, which makes it bloody hard if you don't play another position.

Yes, and you know what that amazing midfield achieved in 2024

Centre clearances - 9th
Stoppage clearances - 12th

 

[caesar88]

My three main questions from yesterday:

1. Why did we not play Hamling? He had a decent showing in the All Stars game the week before. We recruited him for key defender depth. It was a meaningless trial game. Why not just give him a go?

2. At the other end, the set-up inside 50 looked good. Two talls, a medium (including Heeney when Hayward was off it seemed), and a bunch of smalls. But will we stick with it if McLean is fit, or will we go three talls again?

3. Why did we give Grundy so much ruck time over Ladhams? Maybe just my opinion but I'm not convinced there's as much of a chasm between these two as many think. Ladhams looks way more mobile, and we seemed to only look potent in clearances when he was in there.

 

[Dubai Quacker]

My three main questions from yesterday:

1. Why did we not play Hamling? He had a decent showing in the All Stars game the week before. We recruited him for key defender depth. It was a meaningless trial game. Why not just give him a go?

2. At the other end, the set-up inside 50 looked good. Two talls, a medium (including Heeney when Hayward was off it seemed), and a bunch of smalls. But will we stick with it if McLean is fit, or will we go three talls again?

3. Why did we give Grundy so much ruck time over Ladhams? Maybe just my opinion but I'm not convinced there's as much of a chasm between these two as many think. Ladhams looks way more mobile, and we seemed to only look potent in clearances when he was in there.

1. If we weren’t going to play him in defence last year, his papers are stamped.

2. We’ll go 3 talls.

3. Grundy is overrated, Ladhams underrated.

 

[caesar88]

1. If we weren’t going to play him in defence last year, his papers are stamped.

2. We’ll go 3 talls.

3. Grundy is overrated, Ladhams underrated.

I just don't get why Hamling's papers would be stamped though. He's an option. Not saying he's in my best 22 or I'm a huge fan or anything, but he's still an option we could look at and consider using. And a decent option, too. He's played on great players, he's played in big games before, he's been part of elite defensive groups. That's just not someone we should be not bothering with, especially at a time when we're trialling one of our key defenders of the last five years as a forward.

 

[SSwans2011]

Yes, and you know what that amazing midfield achieved in 2024

Centre clearances - 9th
Stoppage clearances - 12th

Stoppage clearances are definitely a problem. Brisbane were 1st in this stat last year.

However, they were also 10th in centre clearances.

Collingwood were 14th in centre clearances and 8th in stoppage clearances in 2023.

Geelong were 6th and 10th in 2022.

It's not the be all and end all, and I don't think we need to completely overhaul our midfield set-up to fix it. Gulden to the wing and Warner spending more time at half forward are already big improvements, and I still think the latter has plenty to offer in the midfield, as shown yesterday.

Our main 3 at CBAs being Mills, Heeney and Rowbottom is a great start.

 

[Adnico26Parker]

I just don't get why Hamling's papers would be stamped though. He's an option. Not saying he's in my best 22 or I'm a huge fan or anything, but he's still an option we could look at and consider using. And a decent option, too. He's played on great players, he's played in big games before, he's been part of elite defensive groups. That's just not someone we should be not bothering with, especially at a time when we're trialling one of our key defenders of the last five years as a forward.

I'd pick Hamling over Francis every day

 

[BloodySwan]

Too much is being said about Gus, not enough is being said about Campbell as a forward.

4 goals and he had some brilliant craft work. There was a great goal where he ran directly underneath Amartey, waiting for him to drop the mark. Straight away, snap across the body and goal. You could swear Campbell has been a small forward for years.

If he plays like that all season, he'll easily get 35-45 goals

 

[Punts]

Too much is being said about Gus, not enough is being said about Campbell as a forward.

4 goals and he had some brilliant craft work. There was a great goal where he ran directly underneath Amartey, waiting for him to drop the mark. Straight away, snap across the body and goal. You could swear Campbell has been a small forward for years.

If he plays like that all season, he'll easily get 35-45 goals

This is not bagging

But I have heard the breakout game before with him and he goes missing the next week.

Again I hope he is consistent but we have seen this before with him

Ok he hasn’t been played much of hf but I remember games he has

 

[The King!]

Yes, and you know what that amazing midfield achieved in 2024

Centre clearances - 9th
Stoppage clearances - 12th

Yep and what did Angus do in the reserves midfield

 

[The King!]

This is not bagging

But I have heard the breakout game before with him and he goes missing the next week.

Again I hope he is consistent but we have seen this before with him

Ok he hasn’t been played much of hf but I remember games he has

Plus he was pick 5, rightly or wrongly you expect something, Stephens and Campbell…. Not great returns for us there so far.

 

[The King!]

I'd pick Hamling over Francis every day

Francis isn’t a defenders arseh*le imo, been behind the goals live twice now and he can’t read the play and his opponent at the same time, you can see it unfolding his opponent will get the ball.

He can play forward or if desperately hit by injury be a second man up in defence imo

 

[Bloods86]

This is not bagging

But I have heard the breakout game before with him and he goes missing the next week.

Again I hope he is consistent but we have seen this before with him

Ok he hasn’t been played much of hf but I remember games he has

I think he's been given consecutive games forward once before. Late 2021 in his debut year. He had a game mostly there against the Bombers last year (2.1, 3 tackles inside 50, league best averages 2) and then went back to being thrown around.

 

[JackHiscoxWasFast]

My two cents on Sheldrick...

I see both sides of the debate (he should be in vs there's no place for him)

What I don't get is why we talk about Sheldrick as though he's a known entity. Do we actually know Sheldrick is going to be better than any of our current mids in any capacity?

"He's a contested bull who wins clearances."

Based on what? The fact he did it as a junior and has racked up numbers in the VFL?

Going on junior form's not helpful. Heeney & Mills were both seen as top 3 prospects in their draft year, and arguably the best inside mids in their U18s year. Do we think that reverence was built on mediocre contested & clearance work? Doubtful. Rowbottom had the second-most clearances of anyone in his entire draft year at U18s level. I'd put any of these guys' junior performances up against Sheldrick's every day of the week, yet these are the guys many now seem to think aren't good enough. How do we know Sheldrick won't follow the exact same trajectory then?

Going on reserves form doesn't exactly tell the whole story either. Heeney & Mills were arguably having more impact as bottom-agers playing for the Swans NEAFL side in their junior years than Sheldrick has had in the VFL the last few seasons. And Rowbottom's reserves tenure, though brief, blows them all out of the park. He was getting 30+ and multiple goals for fun, and led the entire competition's MVP award at the time he was promoted to the senior side.

And that's all before you get to what they've all done at senior level. Sheldrick had four nice games in the middle of 2023 where he provided some nice support in the midfield with his clearance work. Meanwhile Heeney just had one of the great Swans seasons of all time at the feet of Grundy, Mills was the best two-way midfielder in the competition in 2022, and in the same year, Rowbottom's clearance work got us into a grand final.

So on Sheldrick's exposed form vs what our current mids' form at those same levels, I've actually seen nothing to suggest Sheldrick is, or will be, better than any of our current mids.

Does this mean Sheldrick can't be any good or AS good as our current mids? Absolutely not. He'll need the chance to prove and work at that.

But he was given the chance to prove that yesterday and, IMO, he didn't fully take it. Was he bad? Not at all. Was he good? Maybe? Was he as good in the midfield as Heeney or Rowbottom or Warner? No. And I think those guys were only in second gear. So he then spent time forward, because that's where he'll have to spend portions if in the senior side. He was more anonymous there, and not as effective as Warner Jr. and Adams who are vying for forward spots. So am I picking Sheldrick over these guys if I'm the coach? Probably not.

Ultimately it just feels like there's a lot of angst over someone who A) is yet to show any discernible point of improvement on our current players, and B) didn't even fully take the chance given to him yesterday.

Good post.

Do you think Mills 2024/25 is better than Sheldrick ? I don’t. Lots of Mills commentary is yesterday’s hero stuff.

Why does Mills get a walk up start ? Based on form and injury history, if he was a racehorse, he’d be long odds or probably scratched. Now he has a foot injury / needs to be managed. Not his fault, but what next ?

We don’t have anyone coming through with the promise of Sheldrick. His promise is the missing link in the midfield IMO. He’s 6th fastest in the sprint and we should test out what he can achieve with a gun team and a decent coach around him - things he didn’t have last year.

If he doesn’t perform, he goes to the 2’s.

I like fast tacklers.

 

[JackHiscoxWasFast]

Yep and what did Angus do in the reserves midfield

More than Mills did.

 

[The King!]

Good post.

Do you think Mills 2024/25 is better than Sheldrick ? I don’t. Lots of Mills commentary is yesterday’s hero stuff.

Why does Mills get a walk up start ? Based on form and injury history, if he was a racehorse, he’d be long odds or probably scratched. Now he has a foot injury / needs to be managed. Not his fault, but what next ?

We don’t have anyone coming through with the promise of Sheldrick. His promise is the missing link in the midfield IMO. He’s 6th fastest in the sprint and we should test out what he can achieve with a gun team and a decent coach around him - things he didn’t have last year.

If he doesn’t perform, he goes to the 2’s.

I like fast tacklers.

Sheldrick barely got on the park last year. Only played VFL and went past the club captain?

 

[JackHiscoxWasFast]

Sheldrick barely got on the park last year. Only played VFL and went past the club captain?

I know. It’s just we don’t have anyone like him. Mills 2025 is like Mike Tyson 2025.

 

[The King!]

More than Mills did.

Mills doesn’t play VFL remember.

 

[The King!]

I know. It’s just we don’t have anyone like him. Mills 2025 is like Mike Tyson 2025.

Big call.

Can’t say I am not worried about his durability recently. Ask me mid year

 

[JackHiscoxWasFast]

Mills doesn’t play.

agree

 

[JackHiscoxWasFast]

Big call.

Can’t say I am not worried about his durability recently. Ask me mid year

Yeah I know, signs aren’t good. You’re an athlete, you know we ain’t seeing 2022 Mills ever again. Bonz -as the board fitness guru, can we ask for your pov.

 

[Jimbo OZ]

Too much is being said about Gus, not enough is being said about Campbell as a forward.

4 goals and he had some brilliant craft work. There was a great goal where he ran directly underneath Amartey, waiting for him to drop the mark. Straight away, snap across the body and goal. You could swear Campbell has been a small forward for years.

If he plays like that all season, he'll easily get 35-45 goals

I like a lot of people have been crying out for Campbell to play forward for a long time. He think he’ll be a weapon as a high half forward.

 

[caesar88]

Good post.

Do you think Mills 2024/25 is better than Sheldrick ? I don’t. Lots of Mills commentary is yesterday’s hero stuff.

Why does Mills get a walk up start ? Based on form and injury history, if he was a racehorse, he’d be long odds or probably scratched. Now he has a foot injury / needs to be managed. Not his fault, but what next ?

We don’t have anyone coming through with the promise of Sheldrick. His promise is the missing link in the midfield IMO. He’s 6th fastest in the sprint and we should test out what he can achieve with a gun team and a decent coach around him - things he didn’t have last year.

If he doesn’t perform, he goes to the 2’s.

I like fast tacklers.

Mills gets a walk up start (if fit) because he is the captain and one of our best players. Sheldrick is a relative nobody who needs to prove that he is a somebody.

 

[Slingshot Footy]

My three main questions from yesterday:

1. Why did we not play Hamling? He had a decent showing in the All Stars game the week before. We recruited him for key defender depth. It was a meaningless trial game. Why not just give him a go?

2. At the other end, the set-up inside 50 looked good. Two talls, a medium (including Heeney when Hayward was off it seemed), and a bunch of smalls. But will we stick with it if McLean is fit, or will we go three talls again?

3. Why did we give Grundy so much ruck time over Ladhams? Maybe just my opinion but I'm not convinced there's as much of a chasm between these two as many think. Ladhams looks way more mobile, and we seemed to only look potent in clearances when he was in there.

Our club does funny things sometimes.

Consistency is king but experimentation breeds innovation and the preseason is the perfect platform to do just that.

Hamling must be incredibly frustrated signing up for two years not to get an opportunity to even audition his talents in the backline.

There is very little that Aaron Francis has done to convince me he is ahead of any defender on our list. Harsh maybe but all he does is increase my blood pressure.

 

[Ticky009]