Midfield Set Up...

[kainokaino]

Some of our midfield line up's at centre bounces over the last few weeks have been very strange, clearly it is one of the reasons our first quarters have been terrible. Jackson is going to be in most centre clearances because he is pretty much the general in there, tells the other midfielders where to stand etc.

But we should see Cotch, Martin and Foley in there with him way more often. Also play Deledio in there with Cotchin/Martin/Foley. Pretty common sense to play your best midfielders in there together. We started the game with Edwards, Conca and Jacko in the middle ... please explain.

I understand we started Martin in the forward line to throw off the opposition about whether to get the tagger to follow him or not, but surely you need to have one of Cotch/Martin/Foley in the guts at all times.

I would love to see Deledio, Cotchin and Martin start in the guts together against Essendon.

 

[_RT_]

Its quite simple really, its all about finding out about those beneath Cotchin Martin & Foley can bring to the table. Better off finding out now when expectations aren't that high that trying to find out when we're trying to win enough games to make finals.

 

[BILC]

The weekends game was big for us, and one we should have won really

And we start with Jackson, Conca and Edwards in the middle?
No wonder we friggin start so badly, Eade would have been licking his lips

 

[TOOs_Finest]

The weekends game was big for us, and one we should have won really

And we start with Jackson, Conca and Edwards in the middle?
No wonder we friggin start so badly, Eade would have been licking his lips

Depends whether or not you consider this year still to be predominantly development or not I guess.

 

[Delids]

Depends whether or not you consider this year still to be predominantly development or not I guess.

I am not sure how that is develoment?
Completely our muscled
I thought Grigg could of gone in their on occassions especially on Boyd
Edward and Conca can not be in the centre at the same time
We need our best clearances players in the middle from the start
Martin Cotchin are a must then either throw in Lids, Jackson or foley

 

[TOOs_Finest]

I am not sure how that is develoment?
Completely our muscled
I thought Grigg could of gone in their on occassions especially on Boyd
Edward and Conca can not be in the centre at the same time
We need our best clearances players in the middle from the start
Martin Cotchin are a must then either throw in Lids, Jackson or foley

I don't suspect any of us know the ins and outs of the match committee's decisions and strategies, whether it be aimed at development or winning.

If I remember correctly, we had the first I50, and the first real shot at goal, so who knows. But to think the coaching staff don't have reasons for doing what they do is naive. Granted that they don't always get it right, but people quickly forget that they are still learning almost as much as the players at this point. It's a pretty inexperienced coaching group really.

 

[The Rusty Trombone]

I don't suspect any of us know the ins and outs of the match committee's decisions and strategies, whether it be aimed at development or winning.

If I remember correctly, we had the first I50, and the first real shot at goal, so who knows. But to think the coaching staff don't have reasons for doing what they do is naive. Granted that they don't always get it right, but people quickly forget that they are still learning almost as much as the players at this point. It's a pretty inexperienced coaching group really.

I agree with this but the biggest factor is development. All game they stuck to their guns with kids in the guts. I think they are doing the right thing. Nearly everyone on our list under 189 cms will be exposed to the centre bounce by years end much the same as every high school student will have a lap top. This coaching staff are well on track.

I look forward to the time when they have had a look at the whole list and really pin their ears back.

 

[Spluff]

I don't have an issue with the personnel at most bounces, but our set ups are often terrible. We let players waltz out of stoppages completely untouched, which should never happen. Unpressured clearances absolutely kill you.

 

[_RT_]

I am not sure how that is develoment?
Completely our muscled
I thought Grigg could of gone in their on occassions especially on Boyd
Edward and Conca can not be in the centre at the same time
We need our best clearances players in the middle from the start
Martin Cotchin are a must then either throw in Lids, Jackson or foley

The problem is we can't run with those guys for 120 minutes every week. We need support around them and the only way we're going to find out who can step up and do the job is to play them there.

Ideally we don't want to have our first rotation being Cotchin Martin & Foley, what we want is to have say Cotchin Jackson & Conca, then have Martin Deledio & Edwards rotate through, then say Tuck Grigg & Foley and so on. That way we're able to keep the pressure up at all times.

Sure it might suck now because we get beaten in the middle but this year has never really been about winning week after week. Its been about building towards 2012, when the club expects to start challenging for finals.

 

[criticize]

i made a post about this in the post amtch thread bout 30 mins before you created this topic, i find it strange i know that alot of players get rotated through the middle, but with richmonds history of slow starts i think its pretty important to get your best players involved in the game early.

i mean delid did not touch the ball in the first 20 minutes, foley hardly got near it after starting on the bench, same thing happened last week and it was only fremantles lack of finishing that meant you werent trailing by about 5 goals that match also.

get the best players involved in the game for your best chance of winning, so they can make an impact and then get the rotations going, vice versa is clearly not working and a very strange way move from the coaching staff.

 

[Dr Awkward]

Yeah I agree, get Martin, Cotchin, Deledio, Foley, Jackson, Tuck rotating through there. I don't think players should necessarily 'develop' by getting smashed in clearances, put them in the centre when they are ready, and if they are not then at least put two other good players in with them.

 

[telsor]

The problem is we can't run with those guys for 120 minutes every week. We need support around them and the only way we're going to find out who can step up and do the job is to play them there.

Ideally we don't want to have our first rotation being Cotchin Martin & Foley, what we want is to have say Cotchin Jackson & Conca, then have Martin Deledio & Edwards rotate through, then say Tuck Grigg & Foley and so on. That way we're able to keep the pressure up at all times.

Sure it might suck now because we get beaten in the middle but this year has never really been about winning week after week. Its been about building towards 2012, when the club expects to start challenging for finals.

This.


You need 8-10 players rotating through the midfield. When you consider form/injuries, that means you want at least 10-15 who are capable and have the experience to do it, at all times, even better if they can do it at crunch times like the opening bounce as it gives us tactical options.

We currently have 6 who are upto the task (Cotchin, Martin, Foley, Lids, Jackson, Tuck).

So we have a bunch of players who will, occasionally, play in the guts, including during some big games...Some the coaching staff will decide shouldn't play there any more, some will play more often, but until we try them, we wont know. Eventually, hopefully, we'll develop that depth in the rotations.

 

[nut]

Foley started on the bench, Martin forward. Poor coaching considering our poor starts..

Then when we tried to salvage the game Cotch was in at every centre bounce along with Jackson.

 

[Punt_Road_Roar]

Jackson, Cotchin & Foley to start.

Rotating Martin, Deledio, Conca, Grigg

With Essendon's outs Watson and Hocking, they arent as big bodied. Jackson to tag Essendon next best midfielder. Cotchin is in career best form he needs to start. Foley should start as Essendon are light on and we need to win clearances especially early.

 

[SleepingGiant]

How long does it take you guys to frigging understand? We are better off development-wise by putting the handbreak on and fast tracking the development of our bottom tier midfielders. We are taking no shortcuts this year by trying to overachieve and make potentially top 6 when are aren't there yet to be able to back it up consistantly.

Anyway I have a feeling Hardwick will go all guns blazing into this game. Home game for the members, big occasion, no handbreaks this week I dont think.

 

[TigerTank]

At that first bounce we should have our best clearance player.

Our best clearance player is Shane Tuck.

 

[The Goon]

How long does it take you guys to frigging understand? We are better off development-wise by putting the handbreak on and fast tracking the development of our bottom tier midfielders. We are taking no shortcuts this year by trying to overachieve and make potentially top 6 when are aren't there yet to be able to back it up consistantly.

Anyway I have a feeling Hardwick will go all guns blazing into this game. Home game for the members, big occasion, no handbreaks this week I dont think.

Yeah, but why not start with our A grade midfield, and then rotate through the kids as the game settles into it's rhythm? Hopefully addresses the poor starts and give the kids some confidence and leeway to work with when they're in the centre of it.

 

[kainokaino]

I hope we play Tuck this week, surely we will if he is 100%
I'm confused as to why Grigg has spent a lot less time in the midfield over the last few weeks, we should have the midfield set out into groups.

Always have at least one of; Tuck, Jackson or Grigg in there.
Always have at least one of; Foley, Cotchin, Deledio or Martin.
If that makes sense.

 

[_RT_]

Yeah, but why not start with our A grade midfield, and then rotate through the kids as the game settles into it's rhythm? Hopefully addresses the poor starts and give the kids some confidence and leeway to work with when they're in the centre of it.

Because this year is more about development than winning enough games to make finals. So far we've found that guys like Conca Edwards & Nahas can be called upon to take a stint in the middle. With experience these guys will be better and will give us more options.

Imagine how great it would be in the next couple of years to start with say Conca Jackson & Nahas in the centre and at worse breakeven with the opposition and then be able to turn to Cotchin Martin & Foley half way through a quarter when the opposition are a little tired and these guys are fresh.

 

[theflea]

i think it also comes down to ruck effectiveness. we are poor in taps to our advantage, so we always trying to shark it of their rucks. i think also early we were giving frees to their mids so they have stood of and thats hurting as well. rucks are the key!!!

 

[Cathal Brugha]

Because this year is more about development than winning enough games to make finals. So far we've found that guys like Conca Edwards & Nahas can be called upon to take a stint in the middle. With experience these guys will be better and will give us more options.

Imagine how great it would be in the next couple of years to start with say Conca Jackson & Nahas in the centre and at worse breakeven with the opposition and then be able to turn to Cotchin Martin & Foley half way through a quarter when the opposition are a little tired and these guys are fresh.

In no field of endeavour do you throw inexperienced 'staff' into a pressured situation such as the start of a football game, or a test against the Brits or in an attempt to close an intricate business deal. Bring them in when the blowtorch has been removed and a slow burn is occurring but never throw them into the fire!

 

[_RT_]

In no field of endeavour do you throw inexperienced 'staff' into a pressured situation such as the start of a football game, or a test against the Brits or in an attempt to close an intricate business deal. Bring them in when the blowtorch has been removed and a slow burn is occurring but never throw them into the fire!

We're not trying to close an intricate business deal, we're trying to develop a list of footballers as fast as possible and we've been doing that since Hardwick came on board.

Imagine if we had of taken your path, Martin would still be sitting on a HFF/FP getting 6-10 touches a week for a month before being sent back to Coburg. While players like Astbury Nason Webberley Conca Batchelor Helbig & Dea probably would still be waiting for their debuts.

 

[Bazzar]

Anyway I have a feeling Hardwick will go all guns blazing into this game. Home game for the members, big occasion, no handbreaks this week I dont think.

Not to mention the club launching the new 3 game membership, and this game was a feature of that. Coincidence or perfect timing.

 

[criticize]

no one is saying do not play them in the middle they are saying dont start them their,

bringing them in after 15 minutes wont hinder their development at all...

will starting with your best players in the guts help them to get involved in the game (which they have not been in previous weeks), and make your team more competitive in the opening quaters (which has been a major issue).....maybe

the notion you guys are arguing about development is a non issue.

 

[Cathal Brugha]

We're not trying to close an intricate business deal, we're trying to develop a list of footballers as fast as possible and we've been doing that since Hardwick came on board.

Imagine if we had of taken your path, Martin would still be sitting on a HFF/FP getting 6-10 touches a week for a month before being sent back to Coburg. While players like Astbury Nason Webberley Conca Batchelor Helbig & Dea probably would still be waiting for their debuts.

You are either disingenuous or stupid. Read what I said and this time try hard to understand it. I sense from your reaction that you have never been a mentor.