My thoughts on us

[davey_magik]

After today, I think I have been brought back down to earth. I've overrated our side before when we've got on a roll but I think now at 5-4 I can make an honest assessment of our side, its strengths and flaws and how far we can go. Feel free to agree or disagree.

I'll start with the strengths-

Goalkicking options- I really believe in this area we are in the best in the comp. In Neitz, Robbo, Yze, Davey, Green and Bruce we have 5 players who are capable of kicking 4+ in a game. Dunn should eventually step into this category as well, and the only real weakness is since Neita isn't the player he once was we lack a very good key forward. Hopefully Dunn or an unknown can become this.

Runners- I think this is the most underrated part of our side. I know we were outran today but there isn't a team in the comp that can outrun WCE at Subi. When we are up and going, we have done it to teams with the speed of the Bulldogs. Players like Bruce and McLean run all day long.

Footskills- Ironic isn't it? Last year we were fantastic at this, but very soft when getting the hard ball. This year is the opposite. This is the main reason I still think we aren't near our best this year, as it seems we have traded our skills for some guts and determination, but skills don't disappear.

Tackling- The most improved part of our game. I didn't see the game today so I might be shooting myself in the foot with this one, but from what I have seen we are the best tackling team in the comp. Even players like Bruce and Green are laying some great tackles.

Abundance of matchwinners- Pickett, Davey, Yze, Bruce, Robbo. All of these players can turn a game in a matter of minutes. Unfortunately, most of them can be shut down with a hard tag.

Flaws-

Heavy reliance on Chooka and Junior- As it has been said before, these are the only two players in our side (Sylvia doesn't count as he is injured) that consistently can get a clearance. If they are shut down we really struggle. Luckily today they both played well otherwise we would have been smashed out of the middle.

Fragile backline- When we have our best backline in, they aren't world beaters but they are decent and won't get smashed that often. However if one of Rivers/Carroll/Whelan went down, I can honestly say we'd be ed. Nicho has FINALLY been pushed out of the side (Always had a soft spot for him and he gives his all but he isn't an AFL standard defender let alone player) but would come straight back in if Rivers or Carroll went down. It would mean instant bags. And I shudder to think what would happen if Whelan wasn't playing some weeks when we play sides that have players like Milne and Farmer in them (i.e Freo at the MCG 2005).

Caught in the middle with age of players- Our biggest flaw. For years we have been stuck in a 'rebuilding' process. This means whilst we had Neitz in his prime at FF in the early 00's, we lacked a decent FB and CHB and ever since Schwarz left we have lacked a CHF. Now we have Neitz who is past his best, the CHF conundrum which I will talk about later and Carroll who is playing very good footy at FB and Rivers who is still young but very good at CHB and will get even better. However we are lacking a really good, matchwinning key forward now. Dunn 'could' become this but he is still 4-5 years off that.

A good CHF who presents AND kicks goals- Miller presents, but he doesn't kick enough goals. And now ND is playing him down back, although he may go forward this week FINALLY since I would say Ferguson could come in. But his development has been set back half a year because of his time down back. Dunn looks really good but is very young, so I'm not expecting him to hold it down for a while. Is it just me or has anyone else noticed this year we have stagnated a lot around CHF since Miller hasn't been presenting and we have gone wide a lot?

So all in all I think we are a top 4 side at best if we play at our best this year and everything would have to go right if we won the flag. I reckon we'll finish 5th.

PS Sorry about the long post.

 

[cats2rise]

After today, I think I have been brought back down to earth.

Thats what our school is hoping Just kidding mate. I'll go back and read it now

 

[cats2rise]

Fair assumption there coming from an outsider. I have not yet seen a melbourne team that can keep up the intensity to go for a whole year. Hopefulyl for you guys, you had your bad patch at the start of the year and from now on you drop the odd game here and there.

I think Miller is instructed to play up the ground. If he plays deep, you miss him being the link man 70m out. If he pushes forward, he will take the grab, turn around and bomb it long (if there are nos hort options). It is not helped that he is being pushed down back at the moment, but overall I think he isnt a goal kicking CHF. More of a target to kick to while coming out of defence.

It is well known that your backline is not as strong as most, but the good thing is that you can match up well on tall forwardlines and short forward lines (ie you can play Nicho if you wanted to.)

Game breakers. This is what Geelong lacks (excpet GAJ is coming along very nicely ) You do have a few that can do this, but like Davey_Magik said, you can also be shut down very quickly. Davey will learn as he gets older about tagging etc, and Robbo.. well Robbo is Robbo. When he is firing, who can stop him?

I think Melbourne should be aiming for top 4, but do not be to dissapointed if you fall short. I think the public perception of Melbourne is still the inconsistant team of a few years ago. Hopefully you guys and girls can over come this and bring the flag back to Victoria

 

[Marns]

Footskills- Ironic isn't it? Last year we were fantastic at this, but very soft when getting the hard ball. This year is the opposite. This is the main reason I still think we aren't near our best this year, as it seems we have traded our skills for some guts and determination, but skills don't disappear.

Flaws-

Caught in the middle with age of players- Our biggest flaw. For years we have been stuck in a 'rebuilding' process. This means whilst we had Neitz in his prime at FF in the early 00's, we lacked a decent FB and CHB and ever since Schwarz left we have lacked a CHF. Now we have Neitz who is past his best, the CHF conundrum which I will talk about later and Carroll who is playing very good footy at FB and Rivers who is still young but very good at CHB and will get even better. However we are lacking a really good, matchwinning key forward now. Dunn 'could' become this but he is still 4-5 years off that.

A good CHF who presents AND kicks goals- Miller presents, but he doesn't kick enough goals. And now ND is playing him down back, although he may go forward this week FINALLY since I would say Ferguson could come in. But his development has been set back half a year because of his time down back. Dunn looks really good but is very young, so I'm not expecting him to hold it down for a while. Is it just me or has anyone else noticed this year we have stagnated a lot around CHF since Miller hasn't been presenting and we have gone wide a lot?

So all in all I think we are a top 4 side at best if we play at our best this year and everything would have to go right if we won the flag. I reckon we'll finish 5th.

PS Sorry about the long post.

Good post, d_m.

Just going back to the top of the quote, I think you're right about the footskills. Today this problem was highlighted, ESPECIALLY going forward. Kickouts, kicks inside 50 were pretty poor today. I think a lot of the bad kicks into the forward 50 had something to do with Miller not being there for part. It's hard to pinpoint your kicks all the time, and having Millsy at CHF gives the players some room to not be perfect in their kicking because he has a good set of hands.

I'm not sure if the age of our players is a neccessarily bad thing. I think we have a good mix of old and young guys in the side. Sure Neitz is old and his output is nothing like it once was, but his leadership is invaluable, and the older guys in the side like White and Yze still go alright, whilst also providing that leadership for the younger guys like Bartram, Domain (work that one out, all you Seinfeld fans ) and Dunn.

I think the fact that Miller isn't a big goalkicker when he goes up forward is not a particularly bad thing. Sure it'd be very handy if he could kick around 3 goals most games, but like you said in your positives, we have a very good forwardline anyway, I think Miller is great as a big leading forward further up the ground. If he was a FF, then it'd obviously be a problem, but because he plays so far up the ground (WHEN HE ACTUALLY GETS A GO AT CHF ), it's not too big an issue.

And I think you're right, top 4 if everything goes to plan, but let's not get too far ahead of ourselves just yet. We do remember what has happened the last two years.

Hopefully you guys and girls can over come this and bring the flag back to Victoria

I wouldn't be writing yourselves off too quickly now...

 

[JuveRule]

Domain (work that one out, all you Seinfeld fans )

I like it, like it a lot. Master of his domain definitely, but what happened to the red hair??

 

[AllStar7]

It's all about the clearances.
Melbourne - McLean and Junior = 0 clearances

We did good for three quarters, but the cream always rises to the top, while the team who can't win the clearances gets shat on.

Also Daniher had another brain explosion today when he decided to leave Dunn on the bench for three quarters, move Miller to CHF leaving Staker on Bell and then proceeded to let Wirrupunda run around on his own.

It was a decent performance, certainly better than I expected.
I just wish, for once in our miserable existance, that we could get a complete team together. You know, good forward line (check), solid defence (nearly), gun midfield (2 more ball winners short).

How's that "Judd is coming home" rumour coming along?

 

[HighRoller]

It's all about the clearances.
Melbourne - McLean and Junior = 0 clearances

We did good for three quarters, but the cream always rises to the top, while the team who can't win the clearances gets shat on.

Also Daniher had another brain explosion today when he decided to leave Dunn on the bench for three quarters, move Miller to CHF leaving Staker on Bell and then proceeded to let Wirrupunda run around on his own.

It was a decent performance, certainly better than I expected.
I just wish, for once in our miserable existance, that we could get a complete team together. You know, good forward line (check), solid defence (nearly), gun midfield (2 more ball winners short).

How's that "Judd is coming home" rumour coming along?

I hear ya buddy!

I watched the most part of todays game and we were fantastic at the start but soon Subi gets you. It was almost like you could see how hard everyone has to run up there just by the grimace on their faces when they get a chance to take a break.

WC is aa super fit side and guys like Cousins, Judd and Kerr are unbeleivably fit. I think thats why guys like Byron were a bit quiet today and i wouldnt worry to much about the loss.

As long as we can come back to Melbourne now and show St Kilda the Demons of the past month we will be fine!

I still have high hopes for this year and i think if today we played at the G we would have taken them.

 

[Canna7]

I think the signs this year have been more promising than in 2004-05. We are playing tough, committed football this year whereas in previous season we weren't. Our tackling is sensational, we are controlling the clearances, our desperation is very good and the players really seem to be playing for each other. Even in the West Coast game, we may have lost but we battled hard for most of the day and really put the challenge up to them. I thiought we pressured themwell for most of the day and attacked them ferociously.

Our backline has actually been our strength this year. Carroll is almost in All-Australian form, seriously he has been that reliable. Rivers is a star, almost go as far as saying he is the most valuable player in the team. Whelan does the job every week and sets the tone with his rugby-style tackles. Ferguson will return which should free Miller up. Bell is doing well and Johnson had a good game yesterday.

The forward line has loads of talent and goalkicking power and the midfield is still a quick and capable group, with some added toughness and clearance ability (McLean and McDonald).

Overall, I am optimistic about the way we are going. We should make the finals and we will put up a good fight.

 

[goDees22]

Danger game this week imo. Saints are missing Hayes, Hamill and Kosi and on form and paper we should probably win, but it really will be a test of how far we have come as a football club

 

[Klyntonius]

I think that's a pretty fair assessment. I would also think that Bruce would be up there in winning clearances for us (without looking at the stats). I think the other thing that is a MAJOR question mark in the flaws category should be our mental toughness. After the first 6 rounds last year I was marvelling at how hard we made opposition teams work to get a kick. Then we dropped off markedly in our workrate in defence and resorted to shootouts before we finally couldn't even be bothered working hard in attack so I am still 6-8 weeks away from being convinced that this area has improved.

I think that we have a nice balance in our team at the moment and I think that we have more depth now with the emergence of some youngsters knocking on the door of the senior side and I would love to see genuine competition for positions within our club. We have the potential to be anything. Hopefully we can realise the maximum of that potential.

Finally, iirc, Miller was initially talked about as being a future FF to replace Neitz. Does anyone see this as a possible option. He would obviously need to improve his goal kicking skills but he does present well on a lead.

 

[Canna7]

He does present well and his set shots aren't that bad. Could be an option, but clearly we can't keep throwing him in different positions because he is lacking form and confidence.

He will have 2 matches off for suspension, then the weeks break, so hopefully when he returns we will have Ferguson back which means Miller can play up forward and he will hopefully be a bit refreshed.

 

[cats2rise]

I wouldn't be writing yourselves off too quickly now...

Geelong needs a top 4 spot IMO to make finals. Can still make finals, and hopefully will be in cracking form by then.. but i don't hold my hopes that high!

 

[chapmanmagic35]

Geelong needs a top 4 spot IMO to make finals. Can still make finals, and hopefully will be in cracking form by then.. but i don't hold my hopes that high!

Haha...did you mean to say "Geelong needs a top 4 spot IMO to make finals" or "Geelong needs a top 4 spot to have a chnace at the flag"? Last time I checked, making the top 8 gave you a birth in the finals, not top 4!

Haha, I'm just mucking round with ya C2R!

Seeing as Top 4 is nearly out of the equation, we need to push hard to scrounge up enough games to make the 8 and avoid travelling interstate during Week 1. We have the potential to be the most dangerous side outside of the top 4.

And the Dees....if they can knock off the Saints this week, the top 4 is a real possibility....

 

[Canna7]

Adelaide and West Coast are Top 4 certainties.

You would expect Sydney and Collingwood to be contenders as well.

St Kilda isn't playing well and has injury troubles,but could still be knocking on the door by Round 22.

The Bulldogs have been absolutely depleted so for and will be happy to just make the eight.

So pretty much we will be competing with Sydney, Collingwood and St. Kilda fr the fnal two spots in the four.

 

[goDees22]

Collingwood won't make top 4. Had an unbelievable run with injuries, and have peaked too early, clubs like Sydney, Adelaide, West Coast, Geelong, St.Kilda, and even us have room for improvement, they do not