News Navy inquiry

[KnaveyBlue]

This is a new low for footy journalism, but not because it has a crack at my team.

For two journalists to write out questions for a coach and then answer it themselves goes against everything journalism is about. Even though it's largely an opinion piece, it's still arrogant and disrespectful.

They either value their own opinion so highly that they didn't feel the need to question Ratts, or they were too lazy to write an article with decent structure so they just held a Q&A with themselves.

If they want to slag a team off surely the least they can do is put together an article in a proper and cohesive format?

A mock interview is just a slap in the face for readers who expect a decent standard in articles. What next, dot points?

 

[Sir CJ]

Carlton haters or not, I think they have some very valid points in this article, the part that sickened me is that they don't believe Judd is a top 10 player......you put half of those guys in this Carl side in place of Judd, they would have next to no impact

There is no doubt this team is soft, because Judd aside, who do you ever see put their body on the line and crash packs? Sadly enough, the only guy who does do it occasionally but prob not enough is Mitch Robinson, a second year player. Judd can only do so much and it's disappointing nobody else follows his lead

It will be interesting to see if we are active at the trade table at the end of year, because there are some concerns about our spine, I still feel we need a powerful stopping backman who can hold their position, because the likes of Jammo and Bower aren't big or strong enough, In terms of the fwd line Hendo is a work in progress and will become a good player eventually, but I still think we are one power forward short, we obviously recruited McLean for his inside ability to help out Judd but being the injury prone player he is he can't get on the park, another inside midefielder would be awesome, but you can't satisfy all your needs in trade week at years end

 

[Blue Bawls]

I stayed away from the forums after Sunday's debacle simply because I couldn't think of any way to shoot down the inevitable detractors and feared I would become one myself. Fact is, I'm running out of positives and even Ratts' amazing confidence trick in the media conference hasn't bolstered my dismay at our current form.

So, having read and reread this article, I have to agree with it. Every damning word.

And I'll defend its authors because they are columnists and their opinion, whether we agree with it or not, is what they get paid for. The difference between what they write and what everyone in here writes is they have access to coaching staff, club heirarchy and the players, are privvy to the opinions of those people, have years of experience writing about this sport, and are neutral observers, making them far more qualified to judge than us one-eyed "supporters".

Their assessment of Judd and Gibbs is spot on. I would go further to say that Judd's disposal has been worryingly sliding off the scale all year. Where are those precision kicks, or those handballs that seemed to find impossible targets while he was being gang tackled that hallmarked his game last year? Maybe he is struggling with a groin injury? He definitely looks restricted when he kicks.

Gibbs is maybe played out of position at half back, but what's the alternative? We need class down there. Again the assessment of his performance is right. As with the rest of the team, he showed plenty in those exciting games against St Kilda and Geelong, but not a whole lot when the chips are down. Murphy as well, and Kruezer wasn't exactly polling Brownlow votes before he was injured. These are our best three after Judd.

We have failed to get any great value out of our more recent recruits. We had high hopes for Warnock, but he's struggling for form after his long injury layoff, and now McLean is out, and just when we started to get something out of Johnson, he winds up on the injury list. O'Keefe an LTI when he might have stepped up to relieve Gibbs at half-back... let's face it, we're shit out of luck in this department.

The only thing this article lacks is a solution. But that also seems to be what the whole club is searching for. Otherwise, they're not saying anything that everyone else here hasn't been at least thinking.

 

[Quazza]

Judds biggest weakness is he doesn't seem to be able to win the ball in space like Goodes, Hodge, Ablett, Swann etc everything is in close or contested.

The absolute guns need to win ball in the open as well as in close.

the only times this year I've seen him get the ball inreal space, is when Mclean has played

 

[Bluebear]

Pfft......Goodes has 3 good games, and Judd has a couple of off ones and we have to re-invent the wheel.

I suppose without a "plague" of hammies being ripped off the bone they can't crap on about capping rotations............new flavour of the month.

 

[Warsaw]

And we're 8th.

 

[Silvagnis]

Judds biggest weakness is he doesn't seem to be able to win the ball in space like Goodes, Hodge, Ablett, Swann etc everything is in close or contested.

The absolute guns need to win ball in the open as well as in close.

Who kicked a goal on the run from 55 against the Dogs?

Or received the ball from Grigg and set up a goal against the Lions?

Even Bradley would have struggled to run out games if he didn't have Ratten, Brown, Hanna, Campo, Kouta, etc. giving him a spell.

Judd can't do it all by himself.

Everone of your posts is consistently poor or a shot at Carlton.

So, having read and reread this article, I have to agree with it. Every damning word. .

So you agree with the comment that Kreuzer isn't a loss because he's had a poor year?

Dangerfield gets called a superstar and the potential best player in the game because he kept chasing a ball against the Cats.

Yet we see that every week from Kreuzer.

We've missed Kreuzer's intensity since he blew out his knee.

 

[dumb]

i don't know... these lists are pretty irrelevant. as long as he's playing good footy and he does what we know can do who cares whether or not he justifies his position in an arbitrary top 10 to the media.

on that note, i think it's pretty much business as usual, but his disposal is lacking at times...

 

[Sublime]

Who kicked a goal on the run from 55 against the Dogs?

Or received the ball from Grigg and set up a goal against the Lions?

Even Bradley would have struggled to run out games if he didn't have Ratten, Brown, Hanna, Campo, Kouta, etc. giving him a spell.

Judd can't do it all by himself.

Everone of your posts is consistently poor or a shot at Carlton.

I thought it was a fair enough (if little bit harsh) assessment. Judd isn't getting out in the open as much as last year, but also thats not to say he doesn't do it anymore at all. Whether he just isn't getting the help he was last year or what i don't know, but i'd see that as being the reason.

Too many time he's the one with a couple of guys hanging off him trying to extract the ball. It would be bloody draining doing this 5-10 times a match. He needs other people to get first hands on the ball for him, to help.

 

[Malifice]

How bad is the recruiting?

SINCE picking up Judd in 2007 for Josh Kennedy and pick No.3,

Judd + Army for Masten, Kennedy and Notte?

Win.

as well as Cain Ackland (bomb)

PSD. Who else was available that we should have taken, and thats still going around.

Picked him up to fill a short term hole while we recuited Hammer, Warnock and Kruezer and Jacobs.

and Cameron Cloke (bomb)

PSD. Who else was available that we should have taken?

Picked him up to fill a short term hole while we recuited Hammer, Warnock and Kruezer and Jacobs then ****ed him off to Port Adelaide.

they have nabbed Darren Pfeiffer in the '08 pre-season (bomb),

PSD. Who else was available that we should have taken?

Had potential and was clearly worth a second chance.

elevated rookie Michael Jamison (struggling)

Rookie that looks the goods.

and traded drafts picks 24, 56 and 68 for Robert Warnock (bust).

Bit tough to pick on an bloke thats been out injured.

At the start of '09, the Blues took Chris Johnson in the pre-season (three games this year),

PSD.

Again.

He was pretty decent this year before being injured.

they traded pick 11 for Brock McLean (injured)

Picking on bloke thats been out injured.

Again.

and traded in Lachie Henderson (devleoping) in the Fevola deal.

Lucas and Hendo for Fevola?

Win.

What a ****ing rubbish article.

Of the 'bad' recruiting he singles out 4 PSD picks (3 used to fill temporary gaps and one used to have another look at a talented kid), the Judd and Fevola trades (both wins) and singles out Jamison as a 'bad' rookie choice (????).

Completely misses big wins with Jacobs, Betts, Gartlett, Joseph (all Rookies), Army and Robbo both handy players at pick 40 odd, and our 1st rounders Lucas and Yarran who both look the goods.

 

[Blue Bawls]

So you agree with the comment that Kreuzer isn't a loss because he's had a poor year?

This is the exact quote: "Losing Matthew Kreuzer didn't help, but the youngster wasn't having a great year."

So yes, I agree with that. Compared to last season, he wasn't having as much impact, possibly because he was getting more closely checked, but his endeavour is never questioned.

Dangerfield gets called a superstar and the potential best player in the game because he kept chasing a ball against the Cats.

Yet we see that every week from Kreuzer.

We've missed Kreuzer's intensity since he blew out his knee.

Yes, Kruezer's intensity is missed, and embarrassingly his injury has exposed a lack of intensity from the team pretty much ever since.

 

[The Exorcist]

What Kruz adds - and it's becoming more apparent given our mids are struggling at the moment in this department - was the "bash & crash" which helped Judd.

Kruz's great strength was to rove his own taps, and with his big body - even if he didn't get the ball - he at least cleared a path for another Carlton player, such as Judd, to get the ball or get free

 

[dc king]

Have to agree with the article... Judd just isnt that good anymore. I constantly see things he does and think yeh he would have pulled that off back when he was at WC. He turns the ball over... handpasses to no one... and his accuracy at goal is poor also. And he cant shake a tag to save himself.

 

[Malifice]

Have to agree with the article... Judd just isnt that good anymore. I constantly see things he does and think yeh he would have pulled that off back when he was at WC. He turns the ball over... handpasses to no one... and his accuracy at goal is poor also. And he cant shake a tag to save himself.

A little hard when he has three blokes hanging off him 24/7.

 

[The Exorcist]

A little hard when he has three blokes hanging off him 24/7.

Mal, a few weeks back I thought your posts were off the boil, obtuse, lacking the logic we've come to expect and exhibiting the undercurrents of a man lacking direction in his mid-thirties, but you're definitely back on song now

 

[Stamos]

What Kruz adds - and it's becoming more apparent given our mids are struggling at the moment in this department - was the "bash & crash" which helped Judd.

Kruz's great strength was to rove his own taps, and with his big body - even if he didn't get the ball - he at least cleared a path for another Carlton player, such as Judd, to get the ball or get free

This. Spot on.

 

[Malifice]

Mal, a few weeks back I thought your posts were off the boil, obtuse, lacking the logic we've come to expect and exhibiting the undercurrents of a man lacking direction in his mid-thirties, but you're definitely back on song now

I was spending too much time on the SRP boards.

Im better now.

Been watching the Shawshank redemption recently by the way?

 

[CFC16]

Judd + Army for Masten, Kennedy and Notte?

Win.



PSD. Who else was available that we should have taken, and thats still going around.

Picked him up to fill a short term hole while we recuited Hammer, Warnock and Kruezer and Jacobs.



PSD. Who else was available that we should have taken?

Picked him up to fill a short term hole while we recuited Hammer, Warnock and Kruezer and Jacobs then ****ed him off to Port Adelaide.



PSD. Who else was available that we should have taken?

Had potential and was clearly worth a second chance.



Rookie that looks the goods.



Bit tough to pick on an bloke thats been out injured.



PSD.

Again.

He was pretty decent this year before being injured.



Picking on bloke thats been out injured.

Again.



Lucas and Hendo for Fevola?

Win.

What a ****ing rubbish article.

Of the 'bad' recruiting he singles out 4 PSD picks (3 used to fill temporary gaps and one used to have another look at a talented kid), the Judd and Fevola trades (both wins) and singles out Jamison as a 'bad' rookie choice (????).

Completely misses big wins with Jacobs, Betts, Gartlett, Joseph (all Rookies), Army and Robbo both handy players at pick 40 odd, and our 1st rounders Lucas and Yarran who both look the goods.

Judd + Army for Masten, Kennedy and Notte?

Carlton would not have drafted Masten and Notte with picks 3 and 20

 

[CFC16]

The facts are Carlton never build a list the right way. Always the quick fix. Keep trading valuable draft picks.

 

[mac25]

I stayed away from the forums after Sunday's debacle simply because I couldn't think of any way to shoot down the inevitable detractors and feared I would become one myself. Fact is, I'm running out of positives and even Ratts' amazing confidence trick in the media conference hasn't bolstered my dismay at our current form.

So, having read and reread this article, I have to agree with it. Every damning word.

And I'll defend its authors because they are columnists and their opinion, whether we agree with it or not, is what they get paid for. The difference between what they write and what everyone in here writes is they have access to coaching staff, club heirarchy and the players, are privvy to the opinions of those people, have years of experience writing about this sport, and are neutral observers, making them far more qualified to judge than us one-eyed "supporters".

Their assessment of Judd and Gibbs is spot on. I would go further to say that Judd's disposal has been worryingly sliding off the scale all year. Where are those precision kicks, or those handballs that seemed to find impossible targets while he was being gang tackled that hallmarked his game last year? Maybe he is struggling with a groin injury? He definitely looks restricted when he kicks.

Gibbs is maybe played out of position at half back, but what's the alternative? We need class down there. Again the assessment of his performance is right. As with the rest of the team, he showed plenty in those exciting games against St Kilda and Geelong, but not a whole lot when the chips are down. Murphy as well, and Kruezer wasn't exactly polling Brownlow votes before he was injured. These are our best three after Judd.

We have failed to get any great value out of our more recent recruits. We had high hopes for Warnock, but he's struggling for form after his long injury layoff, and now McLean is out, and just when we started to get something out of Johnson, he winds up on the injury list. O'Keefe an LTI when he might have stepped up to relieve Gibbs at half-back... let's face it, we're shit out of luck in this department.

The only thing this article lacks is a solution. But that also seems to be what the whole club is searching for. Otherwise, they're not saying anything that everyone else here hasn't been at least thinking.

This post is clearly the most accurate analysis of the article, MOST of the points in the article are fairly close to the mark, only points that may be disputed is overly harsh on Judd, clearly he is lacking support that Gibbs & Murphy were expected to step up and provide, and to some extent recruiting, as the pre-season draft the probability of gaining anyone of valve in this draft is very small.

However identifying a list deficiency and selecting the right player are two different things and clearly both Warnock & Mclean are very questionable trades.

The most glaring concern highlighted is our spine, right now it is average at best and will need significant improvement for us to go forward.

 

[Pratt = Premiers]

Read the article and couldn't believe what i was reading, don't think i've ever seen an article so harsh on an entire side, let alone a side that still occupies a position in the top 8.
First thought was Ratten/Kernahan have gone to Sheehan and said we want this, this and this put in there, you add the rest.

Anyway, getting back to the article, one point i totally agree with and think it needs to be addressed asap is the softness across the entire group. When was the last time you saw a Carlton play physically intimidate an opposition player. And Waite getting cheap shots doesn't count.
We seriously lack a Chapman, Bartel, Hodge, Selwood and so on, someone who will hit a pack hard and come out the otherside with the footy.
Judd is tough, but that is it. Murphy showed signs last year, started hitting packs hard, but haven't seen it this year. Gibbs isn't that sort of player and don't expect him to be doing that. Simpson goes in hard, but he is a lightweight, just bounces off blokes. Only other player that really puts his head down is Mitch Robinson, but i think that is his only asset and he'll struggle as an AFL footballer becuase of it.

anyway, terrible article, but inbetween the rubbish there are a couple of good points.

 

[Sir CJ]

One thing that has struck me and really disappointed me is how easily opposition teams have isolated our defenders one out, it has been way too easy for guys like Armfield and Joseph to be beaten in one on one contests in te fwd line with plenty space around in case the ball goes to ground, making it easier for the fwd to recover the ball than the defender, Rats needs to look at the defensive game plans of the better teams to learn how to zone effectively

 

[Malifice]

The facts are Carlton never build a list the right way. Always the quick fix. Keep trading valuable draft picks.

Mclean, Judd, Warnock, Scotland.

4 players traded for picks.

2 of them have worked out fine, the other two have been injured.

 

[Barwick17]

From a neutral perspective -

* Harsh on Judd and Kruezer (2 absolute goers who put everything in). Kruezer down on last year but still worth his weight

* Spine spot on (small forwards surprisingly worked for a while, not anymore)

* Spot on with Simpson, very important

* Identified game plan/softness around pack deficientcies (hope pies still have after being towelled up many times by judd, murphy and co until recently)

* Drafting harsh on PSD pick BUT many have excused Warnock and McLean due to injury but both were injury prone when recruited, with Brock rarely fully fit for Demons and Warnock spending stints out as well so I think giving high draft picks for injury prone players is a risk that hasn't paid off (McLean especially atm).

An honest opinion (and yes the pies have skeletons in their closet too which i will happily admit in a relevant thread)

 

[Broadside]

* Drafting harsh on PSD pick BUT many have excused Warnock and McLean due to injury but both were injury prone when recruited, with Brock rarely fully fit for Demons and Warnock spending stints out as well so I think giving high draft picks for injury prone players is a risk that hasn't paid off (McLean especially atm).

An honest opinion (and yes the pies have skeletons in their closet too which i will happily admit in a relevant thread)

I thought the article was harsh - especially on Judd - but overall fair. They are playing like a very soft team who believed their own hype. We have seen articles in the past year or two (remember the new Fab Four article about our midfield) that pumped up their tyres and then they bomb out against teams they should have beaten. So a rocket will be good for them....after all, based on interviews (whereby all manner of excuses are made for them) Ratten won't give it to them.

If McLean can get his body right he could yet be a great trade, for the inside mid job he can perform, and to block for Judd - that would make Judd more effective too. But at this stage he looks very injury prone and we knew this when we gave Melbourne a number 12 draft pick.

Melbourne looks more likely to win a flag in the next 3-4 years than we do - they have the right mix of smalls and talls, and most importantly, hard nuts. Who have we got that could put fear into the opposition? Every team needs a couple of these guys. Maybe Robbo in a year or two. But right now.....soft team.

If we don't make the 8 I expect a move on Ratten. Too much of an old boys club at the moment, they need an outsider who tells it like it is. High draft picks and natural talent isn't enough. You need work ethic, good tactics and hardness at the ball.