Our Forward line

[go_the_dockers]

This is how I see our forward line depth

Contested Marks
Fyfe - should only play forward occasionally

Good 1v1 players
Fyfe- should only play forward occasionally

Crumbing forwards
Walters - who plays a lot through the midfield
Matera - who plays a lot through the midfield
Ballas - Father time has not been kind

Top end pace
Grey - Has a number of other limitations

I am not sure how to make a forward line with the individual pieces we have. McCarthy and Kersten and both average 1v1 and struggle to take contested marks. Apeness is injured, and Taberner struggles when manned up against anyone taller than 190cm's.

We have no players in our forward line with top end pace and good skills.

We have no players other than Fyfe he can take a mark consistently. The only way our forward line is going to function at all is to have our midfield on top and delivering the ball lace out.

Ideally we need to add two quick forwards with a good skills, plus one KPP who can jump and take a mark.

 

[theGav56]

I am not really expecting us to have an ideal forward line this coming season. We will be unconventional, and if, as you say, it is not strong in contested 1 on 1 players then we need to fashion an alternative.

Firstly, in your list Bennell is a conspicuous omission, and so is Cox. Secondly I don't think Matera plays so much in the midfield, although he would go through there (assuming we get him).

Clearly there are some options available, but anyway you look at it our forward line is a work in progress.

Bennell McCarthy Matera
Walters Cox Taberner

That line up has potential. The key for me is getting them to train together and build some kind of understanding about how to function as a unit. I think that is more important than the individual components.

 

[go_the_dockers]

I am not really expecting us to have an ideal forward line this coming season. We will be unconventional, and if, as you say, it is not strong in contested 1 on 1 players then we need to fashion an alternative.

Firstly, in your list Bennell is a conspicuous omission, and so is Cox. Secondly I don't think Matera plays so much in the midfield, although he would go through there (assuming we get him).

Clearly there are some options available, but anyway you look at it our forward line is a work in progress.

Bennell McCarthy Matera
Walters Cox Taberner

That line up has potential. The key for me is getting them to train together and build some kind of understanding about how to function as a unit. I think that is more important than the individual components.

Cox has potential, although I am not sure if that should be forward or back.

Taberner is a bust and he should have been delisted.

I still feel we are missing some top end pace through the forward line. If you added someone like a Rioli in there with Bennell and Walters playing through the midfield it would look a lot better to me.

Hopefully Taberner will be replaced shortly with someone who can jump and take a mark.

 

[Admiral Byng]

We have no players in our forward line with top end pace and good skills.

We have no players other than Fyfe he can take a mark consistently. The only way our forward line is going to function at all is to have our midfield on top and delivering the ball lace out.

Ideally we need to add two quick forwards with a good skills, plus one KPP who can jump and take a mark.

This is one way.

The other is to have the mids role as setting up shots at goal rather than delivering the ball to the forwards. i.e. let the mids take a long range ping from the edge of 50 as the default option rather than kick it to the so called "hot spot". I would rather see our mids play on and run the ball up to 50 and have a ping on the run than bomb it long to a pack 10-20m out, which seems to be the default option. It is not the highest percentage strategy going around but it think it would be better than the long bomb, which I reckon works about 1 in 10 attempts for us.

I want to see the Hill lads kick goals on the run from 50 instead of plopping it up to a lone Freo jumper in a nest of defenders.

 

[go_the_dockers]

This is one way.

The other is to have the mids role as setting up shots at goal rather than delivering the ball to the forwards. i.e. let the mids take a long range ping from the edge of 50 as the default option rather than kick it to the so called "hot spot". I would rather see our mids play on and run the ball up to 50 and have a ping on the run than bomb it long to a pack 10-20m out, which seems to be the default option. It is not the highest percentage strategy going around but it think it would be better than the long bomb, which I reckon works about 1 in 10 attempts for us.

I want to see the Hill lads kick goals on the run from 50 instead of plopping it up to a lone Freo jumper in a nest of defenders.

Agree, this would also stretch the defense which would give the forwards more space.

 

[Unique Name]

Hopefully Taberner will be replaced shortly with someone who can jump and take a mark.

LOL

 

[Wally Walpamur]

is the laughing stock of the AFL and looks to still be a steaming pile of poo going into 2018...

 

[Admiral Byng]

Agree, this would also stretch the defense which would give the forwards more space.

Kinda getting them in two minds - does the spare man in defence go back and defend the goal square or does he go to help the contest against the forwards.

Not that it will work every time or that we should do it every time, but we need to mix it up more. We go long to the "hot spot" so predictably that every team has a set structure to counter it. We tend only to score from fast breaks when we can beat the defensive line back to goal. If the defence have time to set up they can usually nullify our scoring.

 

[Dump Truck]

Taberner is a bust and he should have been delisted.

Hopefully Taberner will be replaced shortly with someone who can jump and take a mark.

You want him to replace himself... with himself?

 

[Unique Name]

is the laughing stock of the AFL and looks to still be a steaming pile of poo going into 2018...

Stringer was the Doggies leading goalscorer for the last 3 seasons. The talent in their forward line is worse than ours now.

At least we can say Bennell, Walters and Matera are all good/very good. Our talls-med/talls are where we struggle.

 

[MrDanggazz]

What is mundy like as a forward? Wouldnt hurt for him to spend more time down there as the midfield will be looking top knotch with neale fyfe bennel and darcy.

 

[FreoMonocle]

Ideally we need to add two quick forwards with a good skills, plus one KPP who can jump and take a mark.

Taberner struggles when manned up against anyone taller than 190cm's

Taberner is a bust and he should have been delisted.

Methinks your bias is clouding your perception.

Taberner is the leading contested marker (by average per game) for 2017, he has drawn the #1 defender when played - so those contested marks are against people taller than 190cm.

It appears unlikely that we get Hogan this year, no skinny 18 year old will better him - so the talk of delist doesn't make sense. Might as well face the facts, he is our best KPF until we draft/recruit someone better or someone like Cox/Apeness proves better and it's not likely that we have that better player in 2018.

2017 AFL League Contested Marks Per Game Leaders (Minimum 5 Games Played)
Rank Player Team Games Contested Marks for Last Game Average
1 Matthew Taberner Fremantle 8 4 v Essendon, Round 23 2.75
2 Charlie Dixon Port Adelaide 23 3 v West Coast, Elimination Final 2.57
3 Cale Hooker Essendon 20 4 v Gold Coast, Round 22 2.55
4 Jeremy McGovern West Coast 24 4 v GWS, Semi Final 2.54
5 Levi Casboult Carlton 22 2 v Sydney, Round 23 2.36

 

[valkorum]

I want to see the Hill lads kick goals on the run from 50 instead of plopping it up to a lone Freo jumper in a nest of defenders.

THIS THIS THIS

I have been yelling at SHill for years to do this more. Bennell will do it, so hopefully SHill starts following suit and young BHill as well.

 

[go_the_dockers]

Methinks your bias is clouding your perception.

Taberner is the leading contested marker (by average per game) for 2017, he has drawn the #1 defender when played - so those contested marks are against people taller than 190cm.

It appears unlikely that we get Hogan this year, no skinny 18 year old will better him - so the talk of delist doesn't make sense. Might as well face the facts, he is our best KPF until we draft/recruit someone better or someone like Cox/Apeness proves better and it's not likely that we have that better player in 2018.

2017 AFL League Contested Marks Per Game Leaders (Minimum 5 Games Played)
Rank Player Team Games Contested Marks for Last Game Average
1 Matthew Taberner Fremantle 8 4 v Essendon, Round 23 2.75
2 Charlie Dixon Port Adelaide 23 3 v West Coast, Elimination Final 2.57
3 Cale Hooker Essendon 20 4 v Gold Coast, Round 22 2.55
4 Jeremy McGovern West Coast 24 4 v GWS, Semi Final 2.54
5 Levi Casboult Carlton 22 2 v Sydney, Round 23 2.36

Stats are overrated.

He did have a good day against Essendon, but he could not back it up against other teams.

My memory his contested marks are normally 1v1 against the 3rd tall. He normally does not get the best defender.

 

[Rion]

Accept we aren't going to have a conventionally operating forward line and try to play it like WB/Richmond. Play only one ruck and one of Tabs/Cox. Surround him with guys like McCarthy, Bennell, Walters, Matera, Langdon, Weller and whoever we take at pick 5.

 

[FreoMonocle]

Stats are overrated.

He did have a good day against Essendon, but he could not back it up against other teams.

My memory his contested marks are normally 1v1 against the 3rd tall. He normally does not get the best defender.

I'll pay you the best defender as it is ambiguous and I'm not going back to the games to workout the various matchups, but my memory is that he tended to take the fullback, not the 3rd tall.

As for stats, contested marking was something you brought up - mentioning all of Fyfe, Kersten and McCarthy re: contested marks, so they aren't overrated to you as you specifically brought it up as worthy of considerations for 2018's forward line. The stats for these are not over rated, they are exactly rated - it is exactly the average amount of contested marks that was paid and he showed that he is good at it - now. Something he has clearly worked on and improved as he was awful at it before, he has plenty of deficiencies but this aint one of them.

 

[wayToGo_]

I've been extremely critical of our forward line for the past few months but am going to provide some (semi)positivity...

Assuming we get Wilson and Matera it shouldn't be as bad as it was this year. Wilson means we can push Weller forward. Matera means when Walters is playing midfield we aren't robbing Peter to pay Paul as much. Bennell playing more than 2 games, Walters and Langdon coming back from injury, McCarthy having far better fitness. If all goes well our forward line should have plenty of pace and skills. Crozier wasn't terrible at half forward (for a half back) but losing him won't make any difference to our forward line. Also think we are in a position where a Fogarty/Stephenson could slot in straight away, so that's a good thing.

Our forward line's improvement/success will rely heavily on working as a unit (still not sure who provides the leadership that seemed to be missing in 2017 though?) and Tabs continuing to improve in that primary KPF role and/or Ape getting his body right finally. I don't think we'll have the AFL's worst forward line in 2018 so that will be an improvement overall. Agree with others that mids, fwds and half backs should all have licence to take a shot if within range.

 

[Unique Name]

Perhaps the biggest question that will shape our Round 1 forward line is do we play both Sandi and Darcy.

 

[mightymouse75]

Is s**t

 

[wayToGo_]

Perhaps the biggest question that will shape our Round 1 forward line is do we play both Sandi and Darcy.

Can you play more than one of Darcy, Tabs, Ape in our forward line at the same time?

Makes it too slow and lumbering imo.

 

[DaveLister]

Potting Taberner's marking? is it 2015 again?

 

[valkorum]

Perhaps the biggest question that will shape our Round 1 forward line is do we play both Sandi and Darcy.

Yes, you have to so you can develop Darcy. But there will be times where you just play Sandi and other times where you just play Darcy... But he needs a combination of both so we don't hinder his development.

 

[Freomaniac]

Can you play more than one of Darcy, Tabs, Ape in our forward line at the same time?

Makes it too slow and lumbering imo.

Probably not. You could rotate them.

Saying that. People say that our tall forward cupboard is bare. I don't know if you can play both tabs and Ape in the forward 50.

 

[Unique Name]

Can you play more than one of Darcy, Tabs, Ape in our forward line at the same time?

Makes it too slow and lumbering imo.

Depends on how hard the rest of your team are capable on working. For 90% of the season Adelaide had a relatively tall forward line and they killed it. Also depends on McCarthy's fitness. He needs to get back some of that pace we saw when he was playing at GWS.

I'd still back in the traditional setup, two talls one of which rucks surrounded by 4 smalls/mediums.

Talls (2x)
Tabs, Ape, Darcy, Cox

Medium Talls (1x)
McCarthy, Kersten

Smalls (3x)(+1 rotating off the bench)
Walters, Matera, Bennell, Weller, Ballas, Grey


Walters - Cox - Bennell
Matera - Tabs - McCarthy
+ Weller

 

[Scatter]

I think we will have a lot of improvement in 2018:

Bennell McCarthy Walters
Matera Tabs Kersten

Cox & Apeness as next talls
Ballas & Grey as next smalls

Fyfe, Mundy, Neale, Weller to rest forward at times.
Potential #5 pick to slot in.

Only concern from my view is forward pressure.