Our Future Midfield

[conodie05]

Secondly, I hope I'm wrong but McCarthy appears to be heading down a very similar road to many of our other very highly rated young players of the past, eg Stanley, cook, egan and the list goes on. They dominate in cfl and just look out of place in the big league. However I still have hope for him.

The difference between those players and Johnny mac is that Johnny is coming back from injury and had an interrupted pre-season. Have faith in him. He will be a superstar.

 

[didak#4]

What are you, the Borg?!

Games played by McCarthy don't help Reid gain experience. When MacAffer runs down the wing and kicks a clutch goal in a final against Adelaide, it doesn't do anything for Dawes' development.

By the way, Reid played against Melbourne and had triple the possessions of his opponent playing in defence, while keeping his opponent to one goal. Most would consider that a really good game.

Dawes kicking 3 goals in an interstate final, including a mark that would do Johnno Brown's mark-of-the-year proud, would generally be considered a really good game.

You sound very delusional. For years we have talked up our young players only for them to dissappear into the football unknown. Everytime they do somthing good we feel as through they have made it. If Dawes was so dominating he should be in the team, especially seeing as though we are lacking that kind of player. I want them to succeed as much as anyone, but I am only being honest. At this stage they have not shown they are up to the standard. You can harp on a couple positive signs if it makes you feel better. Egan had some positive signs as well.

 

[Old Spice]

You sound very delusional. For years we have talked up our young players only for them to dissappear into the football unknown. Everytime they do somthing good we feel as through they have made it. If Dawes was so dominating he should be in the team, especially seeing as though we are lacking that kind of player. I want them to succeed as much as anyone, but I am only being honest. At this stage they have not shown they are up to the standard. You can harp on a couple positive signs if it makes you feel better. Egan had some positive signs as well.

In his limited opportunities, Cafe Society has done well. The fact that young players are not always selected does not mean they haven't played well or would develop even better with a string of games. I'd say we have youngsters who could hold their own against some of our senior players.

A lot of the older players have enormous credit in the Malthouse vault, or are thought of as solid grafters and given game after game in spite of indifferent form.

 

[The Royal Sampler]

At this stage they have not shown they are up to the standard. You can harp on a couple positive signs if it makes you feel better. Egan had some positive signs as well.

Very few players begin playing AFL at the required standard. You should take out some tapes of Harry O's first season, he was ****ing awful. He did have some of the required tools though, and he is a quality person, prepared to work on his faults.

If every player began their AFL career by dominating, as you say, there'd be no need for recruiting departments or even a rookie draft.

 

[Dundalis]

The difference between those players and Johnny mac is that Johnny is coming back from injury and had an interrupted pre-season. Have faith in him. He will be a superstar.

Sure he will. Just like every other young kid that's come through the club that has shown some miniscule bit of talent. Doesn't take much it seems to excite Pies supporters and get them talking future superstars.

McCarthy will be a solid AFL player at best. At worst he won't be here in 2 years time.

 

[Dundalis]

Very few players begin playing AFL at the required standard. You should take out some tapes of Harry O's first season, he was ****ing awful. He did have some of the required tools though, and he is a quality person, prepared to work on his faults.

If every player began their AFL career by dominating, as you say, there'd be no need for recruiting departments or even a rookie draft.

There is a difference though. Wellingham didn't set the world on fire either, but anyone could see he had genuine ability, great athleticism and some pretty good skills. He just needed to put it together. McCarthy hasn't shown much. He's shown that he is at best, solid in some areas, at worst poor in others. Unlike Wellingham, he hasn't shown he is elite, or of a high standard in anything, like pace, athleticism, skills etc. He's looked solid at best, shite at worst in his AFL games played so far. Even in the VFL from what I've seen, is mostly just solid. If a kid came in and basically did **** all, but showed elite pace, or bullet pin point kicking ability, or awesome hands, then you could say there is potential for something really good here.

 

[The Royal Sampler]

I'd say quite happily that McCarthy has pace perhaps one notch below Wellingham's, and I think he's a better kick. He's better overhead, is taller, probably harder at the ball, and by all reports is more coachable.

There is plenty to work with there.

 

[mattys123]

I'd say quite happily that McCarthy has pace perhaps one notch below Wellingham's, and I think he's a better kick. He's better overhead, is taller, probably harder at the ball, and by all reports is more coachable.

There is plenty to work with there.

It's not secret I'm one of McCarthy's biggest fans, but that's only because I have seen him at his best, being at VFL level early last year.

But J-MAC's problem is injuries, plain and simple, even on Friday night against the saints, he went very hard into a contest, got a corked quad and was basically useless from then on.

You also have to remember he has played 6 of his 9 games against top 4 sides (4 against Saints, 2 against WB), and one other was the final in Adelaide, so he hasn't really had the chance to show what he can do against lesser opposition.

He is still highly rated internally at Collingwood, he just needs a good "fit" run of 5-6 games in a row (at any level) to show his talent.

 

[conodie05]

Sure he will. Just like every other young kid that's come through the club that has shown some miniscule bit of talent. Doesn't take much it seems to excite Pies supporters and get them talking future superstars.

McCarthy will be a solid AFL player at best. At worst he won't be here in 2 years time.

You speak like a Richmond supporter.

 

[3rdMan]

I'd say quite happily that McCarthy has pace perhaps one notch below Wellingham's, and I think he's a better kick. He's better overhead, is taller, probably harder at the ball, and by all reports is more coachable.

There is plenty to work with there.

Best aspect of McCarthy's game, that is unquestionably at an elite level? His toughness. This to me says he will be a long term player for us. He has the mental side of the game down - except maybe for a little over-excitement at times. This is something Wellingham did not, and maybe still doesn't, have.

Other aspects of his game that I think mark his potential: a very good mark (believe he will be elite for his size and position), good pace, good strength, a very good size (189 cm), quite good skills.


Now, take a look at the games that J-Mac plays. Of his 9: 4 times against the Saints, 1 against the Dogs, 3 (maybe more?) finals... He plays the tough games, often with little preparation. He was brought into a final at 18. This tells you what the club thinks of him. And that to me is an important pointer. They do have access to far more information than we do. The other player a McCarthy doubter mentioned, Danny Stanley, definitely never had this level of club faith. He was rarely, and grudgingly played. The only other recent player I could name on a similar level of club faith, would be Brad Dick, and he clearly has potential.

Let's not forget he is only 2 months older than Beams (played better than Dayne on Friday too, who was possibly our worst). The main problem with J-Mac has been injuries. He would have played, I reckon, at least another 20 or so games for us without injuries. He's clearly well thought of at the club. Being so well thought of has been a double-edged sword for him though, as many of his senior games have been acquired without the necessary match fitness base in the reserves. An example in point: played Friday night against one of the league's toughest teams, after recently returning from injury and only playing 2 and a half quarters in the reserves. Was a bit rusty, but definitely provided some important contests for us; an area we usually struggle in against the bigger bodied teams. Another example, is being rushed into a final last year without fully recovering fitness and form after returning from injury.

Some comments I've seen on McCarthy have been very harsh, given his young age and injury troubles. I rate him on a similar level to Beams, though a tougher player, with more pace and a more natural footballer's body. He will be a more inside/outside player and Beams, necessarily, due to build and lack of pace, more inside. But they will both be good, long-term players. Will the be stars? I wouldn't be making such predictions at this stage.

 

[Zahki]

Wellingham has become the prime example to the other young guns pushing for selection. He was on the fringe last year but based on how he's played this year is undoubtably best 22. Put on a tape of the game vs the Bulldogs and say to McCarthy and the others "This is what you need to do to get selected and keep your spot week in week out".

 

[sr36]

I think our midfield is in fantastic shape for the next 5 years at least. Pendlebury and Swan will still be there in 5 years time. Barring injury, if not stars, Beams, Wellingham and sidebottom will be good solid players. I think Macarthy will be good. Daisy will probably move into the midfield. Not to mention a much more speculative group, who are playing VFL, as well as future draftees.

 

[Dundalis]

I'd say quite happily that McCarthy has pace perhaps one notch below Wellingham's, and I think he's a better kick. He's better overhead, is taller, probably harder at the ball, and by all reports is more coachable.

There is plenty to work with there.

Watching him his 'pace' doesn't stand out one iota. So either he is quick and just doesn't use it well in a game situation, or he hasn't shown it at AFL level. I've seen him in a few VFL games also, and his pace looks average to me. Nothing substantial enough to make it stand out as a weapon he can use to hurt opposition. In fact he seems to be a slow thinker on the field, which actually makes him look very slow on occasion.

His kicking looks solid, similar to Wellingham's. From what I've seen he has just as questionable decision making in spotting up targets.

One of the first things that stood out to me when watching Wellingham in his first few games at AFL level was how good a mark he was, and his ability to leap off the ground. McCarthy may be a good mark, but I've seen nothing to show he is better, other than simply being 4cm taller.

McCarthy is a pure inside player from what I've seen, so he'd want to be hard at it.

You speak like a Richmond supporter.

Well I guess they are realistic, they would have to be. I don't mind that.

Best aspect of McCarthy's game, that is unquestionably at an elite level? His toughness. This to me says he will be a long term player for us. He has the mental side of the game down - except maybe for a little over-excitement at times. This is something Wellingham did not, and maybe still doesn't, have.

Other aspects of his game that I think mark his potential: a very good mark (believe he will be elite for his size and position), good pace, good strength, a very good size (189 cm), quite good skills.


Now, take a look at the games that J-Mac plays. Of his 9: 4 times against the Saints, 1 against the Dogs, 3 (maybe more?) finals... He plays the tough games, often with little preparation. He was brought into a final at 18. This tells you what the club thinks of him. And that to me is an important pointer. They do have access to far more information than we do. The other player a McCarthy doubter mentioned, Danny Stanley, definitely never had this level of club faith. He was rarely, and grudgingly played. The only other recent player I could name on a similar level of club faith, would be Brad Dick, and he clearly has potential.

Let's not forget he is only 2 months older than Beams (played better than Dayne on Friday too, who was possibly our worst). The main problem with J-Mac has been injuries. He would have played, I reckon, at least another 20 or so games for us without injuries. He's clearly well thought of at the club. Being so well thought of has been a double-edged sword for him though, as many of his senior games have been acquired without the necessary match fitness base in the reserves. An example in point: played Friday night against one of the league's toughest teams, after recently returning from injury and only playing 2 and a half quarters in the reserves. Was a bit rusty, but definitely provided some important contests for us; an area we usually struggle in against the bigger bodied teams. Another example, is being rushed into a final last year without fully recovering fitness and form after returning from injury.

Some comments I've seen on McCarthy have been very harsh, given his young age and injury troubles. I rate him on a similar level to Beams, though a tougher player, with more pace and a more natural footballer's body. He will be a more inside/outside player and Beams, necessarily, due to build and lack of pace, more inside. But they will both be good, long-term players. Will the be stars? I wouldn't be making such predictions at this stage.

What crap. Beams has proven he is a quality player at AFL level. McCarthy has proven sweet **** all. McCarthy is in no way shape or form on the same level, and I will comfortably say Beams will be a much better player over their respective careers. You can trot out the injury or age line all you want, the proof is in the pudding.