List Mgmt. Our Midfield

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I can see alot of excitement from you guys here and understandably so after the last 5 years of pain and total frustration experienced by most blues supporters including my mate which i see 1st hand every week so the nest 3-4 years will be really exciting for your club.

How ever i can also see major issue's with carlton that will be really hard to ignore and thats keeping the talented kids together if they all turn out like whats been mentioned in this thread.

Most of these boys are going to be given decent contract's and extentions in the next 2 -3 years but the age demographic of the players being mentioned is extremely close 18-22 and will all be getting near the free agency window about the same time effectively every year you guys will have 1,2,3 players that will be chased by north melbourne :rolleyes: or another club and even if you dont have to match you will need to get close. Lets just fast foward 5 years where do you see the players pay scales

Think you guys are going to need a bigger cap
Not all the players will be superstars. One or two might take the league by storm. I'm more hoping that we've had enough hits in the draft that we're competing for a top 4 spot over a period of 5-6 years.

It's also rare to see top end talent from a Victorian club go to another Victorian club for a bit of extra money. If the players like the club, they'll generally stay for a bit less.

Players that tend to move are either fringe players looking for opportunity or those wanting to go home.

Our cap shouldn't be an issue unless we start trading for too many overpriced players coming to CFC for a pay cheque.

Just look at Collingwood. They made space for Beams. This is whilst having players like Daniel Wells sitting on the sidelines.

And don't forget the Tigers creating $1mil cap space for Lynch.
 

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I can see alot of excitement from you guys here and understandably so after the last 5 years of pain and total frustration experienced by most blues supporters including my mate which i see 1st hand every week so the nest 3-4 years will be really exciting for your club.

How ever i can also see major issue's with carlton that will be really hard to ignore and thats keeping the talented kids together if they all turn out like whats been mentioned in this thread.

Most of these boys are going to be given decent contract's and extentions in the next 2 -3 years but the age demographic of the players being mentioned is extremely close 18-22 and will all be getting near the free agency window about the same time effectively every year you guys will have 1,2,3 players that will be chased by north melbourne :rolleyes: or another club and even if you dont have to match you will need to get close. Lets just fast foward 5 years where do you see the players pay scales

Think you guys are going to need a bigger cap
Think we are relying on all the Silvagni's to play for peanuts to ensure the list stays together.

Seriously tho,some of these hyped young guns will just play a role and be paid accordingly. We just dont know who is who yet (gun or role player).
 

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Not all the players will be superstars. One or two might take the league by storm. I'm more hoping that we've had enough hits in the draft that we're competing for a top 4 spot over a period of 5-6 years.

It's also rare to see top end talent from a Victorian club go to another Victorian club for a bit of extra money. If the players like the club, they'll generally stay for a bit less.

Players that tend to move are either fringe players looking for opportunity or those wanting to go home.

Our cap shouldn't be an issue unless we start trading for too many overpriced players coming to CFC for a pay cheque.

Just look at Collingwood. They made space for Beams. This is whilst having players like Daniel Wells sitting on the sidelines.

And don't forget the Tigers creating $1mil cap space for Lynch.
The Tigers are an interesting case where we have 4 top player + Lynch but the unique situation is the age of these players like Rance,Riewoldt & Cotchin being 28+ and tied to long term deals as what we call 'discount' rated due to their age's and standing at the club being Capt,Vice

Think it would have been very different had they have been 24/25 and coming into free agency along with Martin

Tigers pretty much have 6 players getting high'ish salaries then a gap to the rest and alot of very cheap workman , Carlton look to have 10-12 at this rate in 5 years

1 x $1.2 mil
1 x $900k
1 x $800k
3 x $700k

GWS are now experiencing the issue's where players are getting big offers, I agree that players take less to stay as martin was offered $1.5 and stayed for $1.2 but when there is more than 20% difference it will get really tight.

Would be an interesting idea for a thread , What will theese players become and how much would they demand
 

katmanblue

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I can see alot of excitement from you guys here and understandably so after the last 5 years of pain and total frustration experienced by most blues supporters including my mate which i see 1st hand every week so the nest 3-4 years will be really exciting for your club.

How ever i can also see major issue's with carlton that will be really hard to ignore and thats keeping the talented kids together if they all turn out like whats been mentioned in this thread.

Most of these boys are going to be given decent contract's and extentions in the next 2 -3 years but the age demographic of the players being mentioned is extremely close 18-22 and will all be getting near the free agency window about the same time effectively every year you guys will have 1,2,3 players that will be chased by north melbourne :rolleyes: or another club and even if you dont have to match you will need to get close. Lets just fast foward 5 years where do you see the players pay scales

Think you guys are going to need a bigger cap
Good thing it'll be bigger by then. Gil will be working on it furiously, like any good fluffer would.

On [device_name] using BigFooty.com mobile app
 

Soapy V

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I can see alot of excitement from you guys here and understandably so after the last 5 years of pain and total frustration experienced by most blues supporters including my mate which i see 1st hand every week so the nest 3-4 years will be really exciting for your club.

How ever i can also see major issue's with carlton that will be really hard to ignore and thats keeping the talented kids together if they all turn out like whats been mentioned in this thread.

Most of these boys are going to be given decent contract's and extentions in the next 2 -3 years but the age demographic of the players being mentioned is extremely close 18-22 and will all be getting near the free agency window about the same time effectively every year you guys will have 1,2,3 players that will be chased by north melbourne :rolleyes: or another club and even if you dont have to match you will need to get close. Lets just fast foward 5 years where do you see the players pay scales

Think you guys are going to need a bigger cap
If that’s our biggest concern I’m not worried
 
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I can see alot of excitement from you guys here and understandably so after the last 5 years of pain and total frustration experienced by most blues supporters including my mate which i see 1st hand every week so the nest 3-4 years will be really exciting for your club.

How ever i can also see major issue's with carlton that will be really hard to ignore and thats keeping the talented kids together if they all turn out like whats been mentioned in this thread.

Most of these boys are going to be given decent contract's and extentions in the next 2 -3 years but the age demographic of the players being mentioned is extremely close 18-22 and will all be getting near the free agency window about the same time effectively every year you guys will have 1,2,3 players that will be chased by north melbourne :rolleyes: or another club and even if you dont have to match you will need to get close. Lets just fast foward 5 years where do you see the players pay scales

Think you guys are going to need a bigger cap
This is exactly what GWS did. They got extra first round picks every year maybe even 2 at a time for their players and they continually topped up and filled gaps with top 10 picks. Think Kelly, Taranto, etc. I don’t have a problem with that. The difference between Carlton and GWS is Melbourne. We won’t have the go home problem despite picking up numerous WA kids. GWS get to maintain their top 4-6 on the ladder every year despite losing players to other clubs every year but they get paid handsomely. Seems eeeily similar at Carlton. Oh wait a minute. We have the same list manager who built the initial list at GWS. started tall, then grabbed heaps of midfielders. Contract issues ballooned only after SOS left. I think he’s a very good manager of the contract situations and I think we won’t have many if not any that request to move on for better money. Considering we haven’t really spent our excess funds on Shiel, Rockliff etc over the previous years we still are paying under the cap. There’s plenty to go around. I think it’ll be blend of GWS/Hawthorn in 2-3 years. Except we will do it 4 years in a row. 😎
 

Blue__Balls

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The Tigers are an interesting case where we have 4 top player + Lynch but the unique situation is the age of these players like Rance,Riewoldt & Cotchin being 28+ and tied to long term deals as what we call 'discount' rated due to their age's and standing at the club being Capt,Vice

Think it would have been very different had they have been 24/25 and coming into free agency along with Martin

Tigers pretty much have 6 players getting high'ish salaries then a gap to the rest and alot of very cheap workman , Carlton look to have 10-12 at this rate in 5 years

1 x $1.2 mil
1 x $900k
1 x $800k
3 x $700k

GWS are now experiencing the issue's where players are getting big offers, I agree that players take less to stay as martin was offered $1.5 and stayed for $1.2 but when there is more than 20% difference it will get really tight.

Would be an interesting idea for a thread , What will theese players become and how much would they demand
In 5 years, if we haven't completely cocked something up, we should be in prime position for a premiership, hopefully looking at getting most of our guys their second. History shows that very good players in premiership-contention sides don't jump ship to lower ranked teams for a little extra money. They're more likely to sign a short (ie. 2 year) deal with their existing club, chase the success, and then reassess again while they still command a significant salary.

I don't doubt that some of our guys will move clubs down the line. But I expect that will be the exception, not the rule, and is more likely to feature players down the pecking order, or those being played out of position by necessity. They're the players we're most likely to be able to replace, especially given over the next 5 years we'll probably see another 25 new faces through the club at a minimum. It's not like the current group are it, and if we can't convince every single one to stay beyond 2023 then we fall apart - we'll be adding layers of depth below this group, kids who learn from an elite senior group, and who are better prepared to step up when it's their turn than what we've had in the past.

Everyone loves to point at successful clubs and their amazing depth. The reality is that a stronger senior list begets a stronger reserves group. Being shit makes it very difficult to develop as effectively, which is why we've seen a horrible downward spiral at Gold Coast, and I suspect we'll see at St Kilda over the next few years. We made a ballsy and extremely risky choice to strip the list back and battle through a number of horrendous years, knowing that if we kept the group together we'd be able to turn the corner eventually. Once we turn that corner, player attrition becomes more manageable.
 
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This is exactly what GWS did. They got extra first round picks every year maybe even 2 at a time for their players and they continually topped up and filled gaps with top 10 picks. Think Kelly, Taranto, etc. I don’t have a problem with that. The difference between Carlton and GWS is Melbourne. We won’t have the go home problem despite picking up numerous WA kids. GWS get to maintain their top 4-6 on the ladder every year despite losing players to other clubs every year but they get paid handsomely. Seems eeeily similar at Carlton. Oh wait a minute. We have the same list manager who built the initial list at GWS. started tall, then grabbed heaps of midfielders. Contract issues ballooned only after SOS left. I think he’s a very good manager of the contract situations and I think we won’t have many if not any that request to move on for better money. Considering we haven’t really spent our excess funds on Shiel, Rockliff etc over the previous years we still are paying under the cap. There’s plenty to go around. I think it’ll be blend of GWS/Hawthorn in 2-3 years. Except we will do it 4 years in a row. 😎
Over the last four drafts (same as our rebuild) GWS have taken picks 2,5,7,11,11,13,14,14,16,20,22,24,27,28 and 34 to the draft. They maybe losing some as they go but they still have some of the best youth in the league while contending every year.
Getting to be in their position is an absolute dream case scenario especially considering we have a huge advantage of being based in Melbourne over them.

Although Hawthorn and Geelong lost their best players that only happens because they were ridiculously strong. Worrying about our salary cap atm is crazy, the only time it’ll be a problem is when we get close or to our goal and if we lose a player than so be it.
 

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The Tigers are an interesting case where we have 4 top player + Lynch but the unique situation is the age of these players like Rance,Riewoldt & Cotchin being 28+ and tied to long term deals as what we call 'discount' rated due to their age's and standing at the club being Capt,Vice

Think it would have been very different had they have been 24/25 and coming into free agency along with Martin

Tigers pretty much have 6 players getting high'ish salaries then a gap to the rest and alot of very cheap workman , Carlton look to have 10-12 at this rate in 5 years

1 x $1.2 mil
1 x $900k
1 x $800k
3 x $700k

GWS are now experiencing the issue's where players are getting big offers, I agree that players take less to stay as martin was offered $1.5 and stayed for $1.2 but when there is more than 20% difference it will get really tight.

Would be an interesting idea for a thread , What will theese players become and how much would they demand
Pleasing to see a opposition supporter aware of the talent we have accumulated. Will certainly become an issue, but one we can manage for the
most part. A number already have front ended arrangements to mitigate our outlay over the next few seasons. To a degree we need to rely on their
integrity , not to jump ship after a virtual handshake deal.

I don't expect a massive attrition rate, but in about 5 years, we may in fact embrace a player a year looking for that big payday. If we have the success
that a group like this projects, we are looking at sustained success and therefore late draft picks. Trading for top end picks is the ideal way to prolong
our cycle at the pointy end of the competition. It has been a sport to ridicule Carlton and others in recent years. In our case plenty of the pain has been
self inflicted, but multiple compromised drafts then the abominable gifting of no.1 to * as they rightly languished with player suspension, has served to
keep most in the bottom area of the ladder where they are. We are staring at a dynasty, that will survive beyond a decade with prudent management.

Richmond have a far different model with a number of "stars" on big bickies, being supported by a high number of quality, lesser profiled, but very
dedicated and disciplined players. It took a while, but Hardwick and co. happened on a successful model which will stand them in great stead for a couple
of years, but will be unsustainable without some spectacular drafting and trading, when you have little expendable high end collateral.

Being closer to the end than the beginning of the rebuild, I had been a little perplexed why we have stocked up on quality player identification and management staff. Silvagni, Agresta, Brodie and others, under former list manager, Lloyd. Simply, we need to call on every resource available to manage this growing list of talent.
 
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I can see alot of excitement from you guys here and understandably so after the last 5 years of pain and total frustration experienced by most blues supporters including my mate which i see 1st hand every week so the nest 3-4 years will be really exciting for your club.

How ever i can also see major issue's with carlton that will be really hard to ignore and thats keeping the talented kids together if they all turn out like whats been mentioned in this thread.

Most of these boys are going to be given decent contract's and extentions in the next 2 -3 years but the age demographic of the players being mentioned is extremely close 18-22 and will all be getting near the free agency window about the same time effectively every year you guys will have 1,2,3 players that will be chased by north melbourne :rolleyes: or another club and even if you dont have to match you will need to get close. Lets just fast foward 5 years where do you see the players pay scales

Think you guys are going to need a bigger cap

We have a huge 'war chest'.

Now where have I heard that before :think:
 
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The Tigers are an interesting case where we have 4 top player + Lynch but the unique situation is the age of these players like Rance,Riewoldt & Cotchin being 28+ and tied to long term deals as what we call 'discount' rated due to their age's and standing at the club being Capt,Vice

Think it would have been very different had they have been 24/25 and coming into free agency along with Martin

Tigers pretty much have 6 players getting high'ish salaries then a gap to the rest and alot of very cheap workman , Carlton look to have 10-12 at this rate in 5 years

1 x $1.2 mil
1 x $900k
1 x $800k
3 x $700k

GWS are now experiencing the issue's where players are getting big offers, I agree that players take less to stay as martin was offered $1.5 and stayed for $1.2 but when there is more than 20% difference it will get really tight.

Would be an interesting idea for a thread , What will theese players become and how much would they demand
We'll be opening up a fair bit of cap space when Lobbe, Casboult and Thomas eventually retire. So we've got avenues for cap relief if required.

Following such retirements, we could then front end more contracts which should alleviate problems down the line.
 

HARKER

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Carlton knew it had to improve its midfield depth and did so in the off-season by recruiting Will Setterfield, Sam Walsh and Liam Stocker. But the onball group remains light on A-Grade quality, mature talent and depth. Patrick Cripps is obviously a jet, while Marc Murphy and Ed Curnow are proven campaigners, but a lot of the heavy lifting still falls on some pretty young shoulders. Zac Fisher, Matthew Kennedy and Paddy Dow have shown plenty, but still need time to develop. It looks like a strong midfield in the making, with the right building blocks in place, but for now it remains one with plenty of potential and that's it.

B: Nic Newman, Jacob Weitering, Lachie Plowman
HB: Lochie O'Brien, Caleb Marchbank, Kade Simpson
C: Ed Curnow, Will Setterfield, Marc Murphy
HF:
Sam Petrevski-Seton, Charlie Curnow, Paddy Dow
F: Mitch McGovern, Harry McKay, Alex Fasolo
FOLL: Matthew Kreuzer, Patrick Cripps, Zac Fisher
I/C: Matthew Kennedy
, Tom Williamson, Dale Thomas, Sam Walsh

Defender depth: Sam Docherty*, Angus Schumacher, Harrison Macreadie, Hugh Goddard, Ben Silvagni, Liam Jones

Forward depth: Jack Silvagni, Tom De Koning, Jarrod Garlett, Cam Polson, Patrick Kerr, Levi Casboult, Kym LeBois, Matt Owies, Finbar O'Dwyer, Tom Bugg, Jarrod Pickett*

Midfield depth: Darcy Lang, David Cuningham, Liam Stocker

Ruck depth: Matthew Lobbe, Andrew Phillips



Whilst we're excited about our midfield, it seems outsiders may not be so much.
Ranked here as having a better midfield over only Gold Coast. :)



http://www.afl.com.au/news/2019-01-12/who-has-the-best-onballers-we-rank-every-club






*Mod edit: Link added
 
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17. CARLTON
Carlton knew it had to improve its midfield depth and did so in the off-season by recruiting Will Setterfield, Sam Walsh and Liam Stocker. But the onball group remains light on A-Grade quality, mature talent and depth. Patrick Cripps is obviously a jet, while Marc Murphy and Ed Curnow are proven campaigners, but a lot of the heavy lifting still falls on some pretty young shoulders. Zac Fisher, Matthew Kennedy and Paddy Dow have shown plenty, but still need time to develop. It looks like a strong midfield in the making, with the right building blocks in place, but for now it remains one with plenty of potential and that's it.

B: Nic Newman, Jacob Weitering, Lachie Plowman
HB: Lochie O'Brien, Caleb Marchbank, Kade Simpson
C: Ed Curnow, Will Setterfield, Marc Murphy
HF:
Sam Petrevski-Seton, Charlie Curnow, Paddy Dow
F: Mitch McGovern, Harry McKay, Alex Fasolo
FOLL: Matthew Kreuzer, Patrick Cripps, Zac Fisher
I/C: Matthew Kennedy
, Tom Williamson, Dale Thomas, Sam Walsh

Defender depth: Sam Docherty*, Angus Schumacher, Harrison Macreadie, Hugh Goddard, Ben Silvagni, Liam Jones

Forward depth: Jack Silvagni, Tom De Koning, Jarrod Garlett, Cam Polson, Patrick Kerr, Levi Casboult, Kym LeBois, Matt Owies, Finbar O'Dwyer, Tom Bugg, Jarrod Pickett*

Midfield depth: Darcy Lang, David Cuningham, Liam Stocker

Ruck depth: Matthew Lobbe, Andrew Phillips

Whilst we're excited about our midfield, it seems outsiders may not be so much.
Ranked here as having a better midfield over only Gold Coast. :)
What a shock
 

Jabba73

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17. CARLTON
Carlton knew it had to improve its midfield depth and did so in the off-season by recruiting Will Setterfield, Sam Walsh and Liam Stocker. But the onball group remains light on A-Grade quality, mature talent and depth. Patrick Cripps is obviously a jet, while Marc Murphy and Ed Curnow are proven campaigners, but a lot of the heavy lifting still falls on some pretty young shoulders. Zac Fisher, Matthew Kennedy and Paddy Dow have shown plenty, but still need time to develop. It looks like a strong midfield in the making, with the right building blocks in place, but for now it remains one with plenty of potential and that's it.

B: Nic Newman, Jacob Weitering, Lachie Plowman
HB: Lochie O'Brien, Caleb Marchbank, Kade Simpson
C: Ed Curnow, Will Setterfield, Marc Murphy
HF:
Sam Petrevski-Seton, Charlie Curnow, Paddy Dow
F: Mitch McGovern, Harry McKay, Alex Fasolo
FOLL: Matthew Kreuzer, Patrick Cripps, Zac Fisher
I/C: Matthew Kennedy
, Tom Williamson, Dale Thomas, Sam Walsh

Defender depth: Sam Docherty*, Angus Schumacher, Harrison Macreadie, Hugh Goddard, Ben Silvagni, Liam Jones

Forward depth: Jack Silvagni, Tom De Koning, Jarrod Garlett, Cam Polson, Patrick Kerr, Levi Casboult, Kym LeBois, Matt Owies, Finbar O'Dwyer, Tom Bugg, Jarrod Pickett*

Midfield depth: Darcy Lang, David Cuningham, Liam Stocker

Ruck depth: Matthew Lobbe, Andrew Phillips

Whilst we're excited about our midfield, it seems outsiders may not be so much.
Ranked here as having a better midfield over only Gold Coast. :)
Meh, it will take casual observers in the media another two seasons to work it out. They only jump on players as ‘the next big thing’ after their breakout season has ended.

None of what is written is surprising, and the analysis is not far off the mark. They don’t look at potential like we do, they only look at results, hence the lag between reality and reporting.
 
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17. CARLTON
Carlton knew it had to improve its midfield depth and did so in the off-season by recruiting Will Setterfield, Sam Walsh and Liam Stocker. But the onball group remains light on A-Grade quality, mature talent and depth. Patrick Cripps is obviously a jet, while Marc Murphy and Ed Curnow are proven campaigners, but a lot of the heavy lifting still falls on some pretty young shoulders. Zac Fisher, Matthew Kennedy and Paddy Dow have shown plenty, but still need time to develop. It looks like a strong midfield in the making, with the right building blocks in place, but for now it remains one with plenty of potential and that's it.

B: Nic Newman, Jacob Weitering, Lachie Plowman
HB: Lochie O'Brien, Caleb Marchbank, Kade Simpson
C: Ed Curnow, Will Setterfield, Marc Murphy
HF:
Sam Petrevski-Seton, Charlie Curnow, Paddy Dow
F: Mitch McGovern, Harry McKay, Alex Fasolo
FOLL: Matthew Kreuzer, Patrick Cripps, Zac Fisher
I/C: Matthew Kennedy
, Tom Williamson, Dale Thomas, Sam Walsh

Defender depth: Sam Docherty*, Angus Schumacher, Harrison Macreadie, Hugh Goddard, Ben Silvagni, Liam Jones

Forward depth: Jack Silvagni, Tom De Koning, Jarrod Garlett, Cam Polson, Patrick Kerr, Levi Casboult, Kym LeBois, Matt Owies, Finbar O'Dwyer, Tom Bugg, Jarrod Pickett*

Midfield depth: Darcy Lang, David Cuningham, Liam Stocker

Ruck depth: Matthew Lobbe, Andrew Phillips

Whilst we're excited about our midfield, it seems outsiders may not be so much.
Ranked here as having a better midfield over only Gold Coast. :)
Anyone who rates St Kilda as having a better midfield on the basis of trading in a cooked Hanneberry is not to be taken seriously. Nonsense on stilts.

With Mitchell out for the season and O'meara having trouble staying out there consistently we may even overtake Hawthorn's midfield this year. Not seeing strong cases for Geelong or North either from that article.

In summary, AFL staff writers are idiots.
 

AceAndy

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17. CARLTON
Carlton knew it had to improve its midfield depth and did so in the off-season by recruiting Will Setterfield, Sam Walsh and Liam Stocker. But the onball group remains light on A-Grade quality, mature talent and depth. Patrick Cripps is obviously a jet, while Marc Murphy and Ed Curnow are proven campaigners, but a lot of the heavy lifting still falls on some pretty young shoulders. Zac Fisher, Matthew Kennedy and Paddy Dow have shown plenty, but still need time to develop. It looks like a strong midfield in the making, with the right building blocks in place, but for now it remains one with plenty of potential and that's it.

B: Nic Newman, Jacob Weitering, Lachie Plowman
HB: Lochie O'Brien, Caleb Marchbank, Kade Simpson
C: Ed Curnow, Will Setterfield, Marc Murphy
HF:
Sam Petrevski-Seton, Charlie Curnow, Paddy Dow
F: Mitch McGovern, Harry McKay, Alex Fasolo
FOLL: Matthew Kreuzer, Patrick Cripps, Zac Fisher
I/C: Matthew Kennedy
, Tom Williamson, Dale Thomas, Sam Walsh

Defender depth: Sam Docherty*, Angus Schumacher, Harrison Macreadie, Hugh Goddard, Ben Silvagni, Liam Jones

Forward depth: Jack Silvagni, Tom De Koning, Jarrod Garlett, Cam Polson, Patrick Kerr, Levi Casboult, Kym LeBois, Matt Owies, Finbar O'Dwyer, Tom Bugg, Jarrod Pickett*

Midfield depth: Darcy Lang, David Cuningham, Liam Stocker

Ruck depth: Matthew Lobbe, Andrew Phillips

Whilst we're excited about our midfield, it seems outsiders may not be so much.
Ranked here as having a better midfield over only Gold Coast. :)
Reasonable summation of where the midfield is at , i'd like to think we would be a little higher than 17th but perhaps i am being a tad optimistic.
 
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Meh, it will take casual observers in the media another two seasons to work it out. They only jump on players as ‘the next big thing’ after their breakout season has ended.

None of what is written is surprising, and the analysis is not far off the mark. They don’t look at potential like we do, they only look at results, hence the lag between reality and reporting.
Unless of course they're Essendon. :drunk: Carlton's young midfielders (understandably) need time to develop. But Essendon's (Parish, McGrath) are (apparently) ready to make their mark. Never mind that McGrath hasn't actually played midfield at AFL level yet (and only rarely did at junior level). Myers also got a mention as 'most improved' (which is kind of like 'best clubman'). Then they've got the scintillating extra depth of Dylan Clarke and Kobe Mutch. Other clubs would be terrified!

According to that series of afl.com articles, Essendon has the 4th best forward line, the 4th best defence and the 7th best midfield. Anyone else think there might be a few Essendon supporter nuffies among the writers?
 

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Vixens
Carlton will not get any credit for their midfield until they actually start knocking over other quality midfield units. That's how the media works. They only really report what has happened and then predict more of it to happen. Dermie is probably the only one that regularly sticks his neck out.
Dermis has been keen on what we are building for a while now, definitely ahead of the pack when it comes to predictions.
 
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