Owners

[jd2010]

Well I don't agree with that. Anyone can call out bad behaviour even if they aren't perfect in every way. The biggest changes start with the smallest steps.

I think people should get their own house in order before pointing fingers elsewhere.

 

[Zidane98]

But where is the calling out for the Chileans and Argentinian's who have had their land illegally stolen from them for Joe Lewis to have a ranch built and a place for his yacht to dock? Because he is from the East End everyone turns a blind eye? Even if he doesn't want to be considered a Brit for tax purposes.

Same goes with Roman and his links to Putin. I think they get/got a lot less (none in most cases) heat because they eat what we eat and dress how we dress.

I think you'd find there would be quite some outcry if Lewis was PM and proceeded to have taxpayer owned government businesses funding Spurs.



Roman & Chelsea got shitloads of heat in the early years.

 

[jd2010]

I think you'd find there would be quite some outcry if Lewis was PM and proceeded to have taxpayer owned government businesses funding Spurs.



Roman & Chelsea got shitloads of heat in the early years.

Lewis doesn't believe in tax and asked for the taxpayer to fund the clubs staff bill during COVID. Thankfully it took Spurs own support to call it out for that to be reversed. But everything else he continues to do in regards to avoiding British tax and stealing land in Patagonia is largely unspoken.

Bet if his name was Yousef not Joseph and an Emirati and not from the East End it would be spoken about in the British papers.

 

[Zidane98]

Lewis doesn't believe in tax and asked for the taxpayer to fund the clubs staff bill during COVID. Thankfully it took Spurs own support to call it out for that to be reversed. But everything else he continues to do in regards to avoiding British tax and stealing land in Patagonia is largely unspoken.

Bet if his name was Yousef not Joseph and an Emirati and not from the East End it would be spoken about in the British papers.

There name has nothing to do with it. If Joe Lewis was using his position in the UK government to fund his own club in a sports washing exercise there would actually be a far bigger outcry than there is against the current state owned clubs who do the same thing.

 

[Art Vandelay_]

Spent years trying to tell me Lewis puts none of his money in the club, now trying to compare to sportswashers.

Lewis is far from perfect but would rather him over a blank cheque ownership structure that’s ruining football. Roman started this but now UEFA and The FA can’t put the genie back in the bottle.

 

[SM]

I think people should get their own house in order before pointing fingers elsewhere.

Pretty much completely disagree. That'd be like saying because Hull's owners are campaigners I can't criticise another club's owners, as if I have any bearing on the way my club is run.

 

[jd2010]

There name has nothing to do with it. If Joe Lewis was using his position in the UK government to fund his own club in a sports washing exercise there would actually be a far bigger outcry than there is against the current state owned clubs who do the same thing.

Could definitely argue that Lewis is using his position of power (best mates with George Soros who has the dodgy Argentinan PM in his pocket) to steal land and sportswash the tax evasion and land stealing that he is doing in South America with his ranch. Said ranch hosts over 10k Isreali soliders every summer. No mention of it.

No mention that it was stolen from indigenous communities. Blood was shed over stolen lands but where was the outcry? Local leaders have gone missing or bodies found dead in the lake during the dispute. No mention.

It's because he isn't brown and is "one of us" that he is never called out by the UK media.

 

[jd2010]

Pretty much completely disagree. That'd be like saying because Hull's owners are campaigners I can't criticise another club's owners, as if I have any bearing on the way my club is run.

See above. Many Spurs fans don't even care to think or know about the blood on Lewis' hands yet cry foul when someone else comes in with the same thing. Like I said more than happy for people to call out the human rights abuse when they know that their owners are squeaky clean or at least only a little bit dodgy. But for Spurs fans its a bit rich having knowledge of what our owners has and is currently doing.

 

[Zidane98]

Could definitely argue that Lewis is using his position of power (best mates with George Soros) to steal land and sportswash the tax evasion and land stealing that he is doing in South America with his ranch. Said ranch hosts over 10k Isreali soliders every summer. No mention of it.

No mention that it was stolen from indigenous communities. Blood was shed over stolen lands but where was the outcry? Local leaders have gone missing or bodies found dead in the lake during the dispute. No mention.

It's because he isn't brown and is "one of us" that he is never called out by the UK media.

There is no argument that Joe Lewis is using ENIC for sports washing even though he is a prick.


You would have an argument if the president of Argentina bought ENIC and all of a sudden Argentinian taxpayer funded businesses popped up to fund Spurs.

 

[jd2010]

There is no argument that Joe Lewis is using ENIC for sports washing even though he is a prick.


You would have an argument if the president of Argentina bought ENIC and all of a sudden Argentinian taxpayer funded businesses popped up to fund Spurs.

Forgive me if I'm wrong, but sportswashing doesn't only relate to governments does it? Isn't it for any group or individual to boost their public image while undertaking questionable acts?

 

[SM]

See above. Many Spurs fans don't even care to think or know about the blood on Lewis' hands yet cry foul when someone else comes in with the same thing. Like I said more than happy for people to call out the human rights abuse when they know that their owners are squeaky clean or at least only a little bit dodgy. But for Spurs fans its a bit rich having knowledge of what our owners has and is currently doing.

That's very different from saying "You can't criticise another club unless yours is perfect".

 

[jd2010]

That's very different from saying "You can't criticise another club unless yours is perfect".

Yeah that's fair. My point is more directed to 40% of Spurs fans jumping up and down about Newcastle's owners but barely even knowing about what their owner, who is far from perfect is doing and has done in the past.

 

[Zidane98]

Forgive me if I'm wrong, but sportswashing doesn't only relate to governments does it? Isn't it for any group or individual to boost their public image while undertaking questionable acts?

Joe Lewis is spending bugger all on Spurs and isn't going about using his contacts in Argentina to organise commercial revenue so yeah it's not a case of sports washing. He clearly isn't chasing a better image of himself, if anything he tries to remain as anonymous as possible in the background.

Sportswashing - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Only two individuals on that list involved in sports washing are an Irish gang boss and another middle eastern royal.

 

[jd2010]

isn't going about using his contacts in Argentina to organise commercial revenue

Debatable. He commercialised a 5-1 semi final win against our rivals I doubt he doesn't charge the Israeli govt. something for their summer retreat.

Regardless of what he has or hasn't put into Spurs simply owning us helps with this (from your link) "While at the individual or corporate level sportswashing is used to cover up and direct away attention from said person's or company's vices, crimes, or scandals"

 

[Zidane98]

Debatable. He commercialised a 5-1 semi final win against our rivals I doubt he doesn't charge the Israeli govt. something for their summer retreat.

Regardless of what he has or hasn't put into Spurs simply owning us helps with this (from your link) "While at the individual or corporate level sportswashing is used to cover up and direct away attention from said person's or company's vices, crimes, or scandals"

Hes not the public face of Spurs or is using the club to boost his own image. Thats why he isnt on the sportswaahing list.


He would be if all of a sudden he started spending a fortune on Spurs in exchange for exposure of his companies.

 

[jd2010]

Hes not the public face of Spurs or is using the club to boost his own image. Thats why he isnt on the sportswaahing list.


He would be if all of a sudden he started spending a fortune on Spurs in exchange for exposure of his companies.

Spending doesn't dictate sportswashing. Simply owning us helps his image and diverts away from crimes and scandals.

Owning us and regardless that he spend nothing immediately means people think of Spurs owner when they hear the Joe Lewis billionaire and not tax evading, indigenous land stealer

 

[Zidane98]

Spending doesn't dictate sportswashing. Simply owning us helps his image and diverts away from crimes and scandals.

Owning us and regardless that he spend nothing immediately means people think of Spurs owner when they hear the Joe Lewis billionaire and not tax evading, indigenous land stealer

Image does dictate sports washing and it's very clear that Joe Lewis' ownership of Spurs has nothing to do with boosting of his own personal image. That's abundantly clear when even his own club's fanbase aren't fans of him and he isn't using the club to promote his own business interests or national interests. Clearly not sports washing.


There's a reason why fans of state backed clubs simply won't hear a bad word about their owners and there's a reason why Joe Lewis has a poor rep amongst the Spurs fanbase.

 

[jd2010]

Image does dictate sports washing and it's very clear that Joe Lewis' ownership of Spurs has nothing to do with boosting of his own personal image. That's abundantly clear when even his own club's fanbase aren't fans of him and he isn't using the club to promote his own business interests or national interests. Clearly not sports washing.


There's a reason why fans of state backed clubs simply won't hear a bad word about their owners and there's a reason why Joe Lewis has a poor rep amongst the Spurs fanbase.

You linked a wikipedia page that says this "at the individual or corporate level sportswashing is used to cover up and direct away attention from said person's or company's vices, crimes, or scandals"

How can you say owning Spurs doesn't help cover up and direct away attention from said person's or company's vices, crimes, or scandals?

I bet 99.9% of people on here had never heard about his Patagonia stolen land crimes of 2020 before now. Probably 90% of Spurs fans would know nothing of it. I'd say its been covered up and attention has been diverted away very well by Lewis and the Tavistock Group through ENIC owning a PL club.

He has a bad name amongst Spurs fans for nothing criminal. Just putting profits ahead of glory is why the majority dislike him. Most wouldn't have the faintest idea just how evil he is.

 

[Zidane98]

You linked a wikipedia page that says this "at the individual or corporate level sportswashing is used to cover up and direct away attention from said person's or company's vices, crimes, or scandals"

How can you say owning Spurs doesn't help cover up and direct away attention from said person's or company's vices, crimes, or scandals?

I bet 99.9% of people on here had never heard about his Patagonia stolen land crimes of 2020 before now. Probably 90% of Spurs fans would know nothing of it. I'd say its been covered up and attention has been diverted away very well by Lewis and the Tavistock Group through ENIC owning a PL club.

Because his ownership of the club isn't being used to boost a) his own image or b) the image of his businesses / corporation / or state. Clearly he doesn't fit that criteria at all. Even his own fanbase have a negative view of him.


Contrast that to the fanbases of Newcastle (waving Saudi flags and dressing up like Saudi Arabians) and the fanbases of City / PSG who won't here a bad word said about their ownership from Abu Dhabi / Qatar. The fact that so many Spurs fans are disillusioned with Spurs ownership is further proof of ENIC not being a sports washing project.

 

[LeverPuller]

It'd be close, we have a few portables from what I've read.

Sounds like we might be trying to upgrade though.

West Ham submits fresh proposal to build new training building

West Ham United has submitted an application to build a new training facility at the club's Rush Green site.

www.romfordrecorder.co.uk

Newcastle players still do their ice baths in wheelie bins like it’s the 90s at Junction Oval. Steveley has already suggested it’ll be a demo and rebuild

 

[moomba]

City / PSG who won't here a bad word said about their ownership from Abu Dhabi / Qatar.

PMSL. I better lift my game if I'm not supposed to be hearing a bad word about our ownership. A cursory glance at 90% of your posts would show I'm not doing a very good job of it.

 

[jd2010]

Because his ownership of the club isn't being used to boost a) his own image or b) the image of his businesses / corporation / or state. Clearly he doesn't fit that criteria at all. Even his own fanbase have a negative view of him.


Contrast that to the fanbases of Newcastle (waving Saudi flags and dressing up like Saudi Arabians) and the fanbases of City / PSG who won't here a bad word said about their ownership from Abu Dhabi / Qatar. The fact that so many Spurs fans are disillusioned with Spurs ownership is further proof of ENIC not being a sports washing project.

Sportswashing as per the article's definition is not about boosting his personal image, it's about diverting attention away from his business scandals and crimes.

Doesn't matter that the majority of Spurs fans don't like him. In fact it shows just how powerful sportswashing is. Even being unliked for lack of care for on field success still allows you to divert attention away from what else he is doing.

 

[Zidane98]

Sportswashing as per the article's definition is not about boosting his personal image, it's about diverting attention away from his business scandals and crimes.

Doesn't matter that the majority of Spurs fans don't like him. In fact it shows just how powerful sportswashing is. Even being unliked for lack of care for on field success still allows you to divert attention away from what else he is doing.

Looking at his history Lewis was doing what he was doing a long time before Spurs / ENIC came about and will be doing the same things long after he sells Spurs.


He's actually doing the opposite of sports washing. Doesn't give a shit about fan sentiment or his image. Only driven by running a profitable asset with increasing equity.


To divert attention away you have to have something else positive to focus on. Joe Lewis is the anti sports washer.


If he goes into sports washing mode by spending copious amounts of his personal fortune and uses his companies to add commercial revenue to the club then he becomes a sports washer and that would actually see Spurs right at the top of the football food chain. That would be the best way to distract away from what he is doing.

 

[Art Vandelay_]

For 20 pages all and sundry denounced this takeover as being bad for football.

JD enters, as someone open to this type of ownership led trophy success, and we have a spate of ‘what about this’ going on.

football needs less owners with unlimited spending, not more. Football needs to encourage sustainability not encourage recklessness.

 

[jd2010]

Looking at his history Lewis was doing what he was doing a long time before Spurs / ENIC came about and will be doing the same things long after he sells Spurs.


He's actually doing the opposite of sports washing. Doesn't give a sh*t about fan sentiment or his image. Only driven by running a profitable asset with increasing equity.


To divert attention away you have to have something else positive to focus on. Joe Lewis is the anti sports washer.


If he goes into sports washing mode by spending copious amounts of his personal fortune and uses his companies to add commercial revenue to the club then he becomes a sports washer and that would actually see Spurs right at the top of the football food chain. That would be the best way to distract away from what he is doing.

Again, using the article YOU provided the link on "individual or corporate level sportswashing is used to cover up and direct away attention from said person's or company's vices, crimes, or scandals"

Joe Lewis' stolen land in Patagonia from 2019 to now is not well known partially because he has the Argentinian govt. in his pocket and that is largely due to the notoriety that comes with him owning golf courses and Tottenham Hotspur. Regardless of if he is doing a fantastic job as owner on the field, the facts remain that he is a PL owning billionaire with famous friends and golf courses. And because of that he can get away with what he is doing over there.

If the diversion away from said person's vices, crimes, or scandals isn't sportswashing whatever that is Joe Lewis is doing it. I'm only going off the definition in the link you sent as I wasn't sure if the term was only for governments and could be used for what Lewis is doing.