Religion Pell Guilty!

[Strange Cat]

Yeah that. And the 12 other highly improbable events that had to occur concurrently to present the opportunity for the offence to be committed, and that Pell has to know in the moment of the actual occurrence of those improbable events.

You’re a sad sad man if you think you know more than the evidence presented in court that resulted in a conviction.

The fact that the appeal was rejected doesn’t seem to faze you....I don’t know if it’s cost sunk fallacy or if you’re truly that delusional that you can’t accept that Pell is a child rapist

 

[FredLeDeux]

A great day the jury system and for the expertise of Judge Kidd.

Kudos to the brave individual who stood firm not only for himself but his deceased mate and endured days of grilling by the police, the DPP, during committal and the trials. Not to mention months of public kickings from the media and Papist apologists.

Many believe more money and human effort has been devoted to the protection of Pell and the church's brand than any previous legal action. $10m so far was one estimate. Which is why I believe the apologists will continue the 'campaign' and seek leave to appeal to the High Court. Good luck with that.

Much more to come too. One legal firm has 6 solicitors working on civil claims relating to sexual assault. Over 60% of which relate to the moribund outfit known as the Catholic Church.

Musing: Wonder why the lead counsel for Pell was not present for the Court of Appeal judgement.

One thing that I did find interesting was that while Weinberg was equivocal about Pell's guilt or innocence, Ferguson and Maxwell made their opinions perfectly clear

​

Having reviewed the whole of the evidence, two of the judges of the Court of Appeal (Chief Justice Ferguson and Justice Maxwell, President of the Court of Appeal) decided that it was open to the jury to be satisfied beyond reasonable doubt that Cardinal Pell was guilty of the offences charged. In other words, those judges decided that there was nothing about the complainant’s evidence, or about the opportunity evidence, which meant that the jury ‘must have had a doubt’ about the truth of the complainant’s account.They stated that it is not enough that one or more jurors ‘might have had a doubt.’ Rather, the jury ‘must have had a doubt.’​

The Chief Justice and Justice Maxwell stated that they did not experience a doubt.​

 

[FredLeDeux]

Might want to read his actual judgement.

Is it available; have you read it?

In any event, there is no chance whatever that the Summary, agreed on by the 3 judges, misrepresented his position.

 

[skipper kelly]

Is it available;

Yes. A 325 page pdf. I've read Part I. Will tackle Part II when the brain re-engages.

https://www.supremecourt.vic.gov.au/sites/default/files/2019-08/pell_v_the_queen_2019_vsca_186_-_web_2.pdf

 

[TheGreatBarryB]

2 to 1 seems to infer some doubt. Extrapolate that to 12 person jury and that’s 8-4. Is that enough for a conviction? And this is from far more knowledgeable judges.

Couldn’t give a flying **** about Georgie but close enough shouldn’t be good enough. They are courts overseas that use judges that require unanimous decisions

 

[FRUMPY]

This reads as if you after repeatably saying that it couldn't happen, are now saying well yeah it could but it was someone else.

That's how I read it. Apparently Pell couldn't of done it in that spot at that im without someone else seeing it......but maybe it by someone else.....

Makes sense

 

[FredLeDeux]

Yes. A 325 page pdf. I've read Part I. Will tackle Part II when the brain re-engages.

https://www.supremecourt.vic.gov.au/sites/default/files/2019-08/pell_v_the_queen_2019_vsca_186_-_web_2.pdf

What do you think of the plot so far?

 

[Strange Cat]

That's how I read it. Apparently Pell couldn't of done it in that spot at that im without someone else seeing it......but maybe it by someone else.....

Makes sense

Pretty funny when Bruce has stated that the incident was IMPOSSIBLE to have occur

Now it’s could had happen but not by Pell...despite it being IMPOSSIBLE to have occurred

I can’t wait for the next backtrack in an effort to not accept that Pell is a convicted child rapist

 

[AM]

Yeah that. And the 12 other highly improbable events that had to occur concurrently to present the opportunity for the offence to be committed, and that Pell has to know in the moment of the actual occurrence of those improbable events.

Part of Cardinal Pell’s case on the appeal was that there were 13 solid obstacles in the path of a conviction. The Chief Justice and Justice Maxwell rejected all 13.

The robes were an exhibit at the trial and had been available to the jury in the jury room during their deliberation. Having taken advantage of the opportunity to feel the weight of the robes and assess their manoeuvrability as garments, the Chief Justice and Justice Maxwell decided that it was well open to the jury to reject the contention of physical impossibility. The robes were not so heavy nor so immoveable as the evidence of Monsignor Portelli and MrPotter had suggested. The Chief Justice and Justice Maxwell found that the robes were capable of being manoeuvred in a way that might be described as being moved or pulled to one side or pulled apart

 

[FRUMPY]

Pretty funny when Bruce has stated that the incident was IMPOSSIBLE to have occur

Now it’s could had happen but not by Pell...despite it being IMPOSSIBLE to have occurred

I can’t wait for the next backtrack in an effort to not accept that Pell is a convicted child rapist

It was the devil dressed up to look like Pell, would have got away with it if too, it wasn't for those pesky kids

 

[AM]

2 to 1 seems to infer some doubt. Extrapolate that to 12 person jury and that’s 8-4. Is that enough for a conviction? And this is from far more knowledgeable judges.

Couldn’t give a flying **** about Georgie but close enough shouldn’t be good enough. They are courts overseas that use judges that require unanimous decisions

The jury was unanimous.

 

[skipper kelly]

What do you think of the plot so far?

It makes logical sense. Part I is Ferguson and Maxwell. It gives good explanations as to the impossibility defence and why is was reasonable for the jury to reject it. Will be interesting to read what Wienberg has to say about it. It also gives good explanations as to why it was reasonable for the jury to reject the liar and fantasist arguments.

 

[NSWCROW]

Sky News Really Hoping For A Couple Sudanese Teenagers To Punch-On In Melbourne Today

"Come on"

www.betootaadvocate.com

Sky News and Herald Sun reporters have been urged by the lizards that work above them to avoid the Pell case altogether, and instead go down to Sunshine and watch South Sudanese teenagers playing basketball – in a hope a fight might break out.

 

[Sainteric]

They seem to be recognising that the trial and judgment caused pain.

Nothing in there apologising to Pell’s victims and the friends and family of the dead guy.

Moved on without apologising then

 

[TheGreatBarryB]

Some doubt from Weinberg...

Justice Mark Weinberg was the only one to rule in the disgraced Catholic leader’s favour, finding the complainant’s account of his sexual abuse was “entirely implausible and quite unconvincing” and may have even been concocted.

Pell lost his bid for freedom from a six-year jail sentence when his appeal against child sex convictions was dismissed in court this morning.

In reading out the court’s conclusions for rejecting the appeal, Chief Justice Anne Ferguson outlined Justice Weinberg’s reasoning.

While she said she and Justice Chris Maxwell accepted the prosecution’s submission the complainant was a compelling witness and clearly not a liar, Judge Weinberg did not agree.

“In his dissenting judgment, the judge found that at times, the complainant was inclined to embellish aspects of his account,” she told the court this morning.

“He concluded that his evidence contained discrepancies, displayed inadequacies so as to cause him to have a doubt as to the applicant’s guilt.

“He could not exclude as a reasonable possibility that some of what the complainant said was concocted, particularly in relation to the second incident.”

Reason one judge believed Pell

As Cardinal George Pell sat in court surrounded by his supporters, there was at least one man in the room on their side.

www.news.com.au

 

[TheGreatBarryB]

The jury was unanimous.

That’s not what I was asking

 

[Sainteric]

Sky News Really Hoping For A Couple Sudanese Teenagers To Punch-On In Melbourne Today

"Come on"

www.betootaadvocate.com

The left media sources are not usually that we'll researched

 

[AM]

That’s not what I was asking

I know. But it was a straw man argument.

 

[AM]

A a timely reminder of what this brave selfless survivor went through.

 

[Maggie5]

2 to 1 seems to infer some doubt. Extrapolate that to 12 person jury and that’s 8-4. Is that enough for a conviction? And this is from far more knowledgeable judges.

Couldn’t give a flying **** about Georgie but close enough shouldn’t be good enough. They are courts overseas that use judges that require unanimous decisions

Not the Supreme Court of the USA (Highest court in the USA) . All they need is majority (more than half) and their decisions can affects millions.

This is not unusual.

 

[Strange Cat]

A a timely reminder of what this brave selfless survivor went through.

Inb4 Bruce calls them a liar again

 

[Number37]

2 to 1 seems to infer some doubt. Extrapolate that to 12 person jury and that’s 8-4. Is that enough for a conviction? And this is from far more knowledgeable judges.

Couldn’t give a flying **** about Georgie but close enough shouldn’t be good enough. They are courts overseas that use judges that require unanimous decisions

The defence is a load of mainly wishful thinking. There is nothing compelling, at all, in the arguments they presented at appeal.
They've basically had a 2nd crack at a trial and failed again.
Majority judgments are fairly common. If Peddo Pell's team can find holes in the majority decision they can take it to the HC. IMO they have nowhere to go.

 

[AM]

What a supercilious lot these apologists have turned out to be.

 

[chelseacarlton]

Lastly, to all the survivors that so bravely shared in some part their deeply personal and horrific stories with this little community.
I imagine that closure for you will not be found in this judgement, but I’d hope that in someway, that that child inside of you that must have cried in terror and screamed what would have felt like the abyss, has in someway be heard down through the ages and decades and that that little child feels and finds some type of peace with today’s outcome!
Peace to you, your family and friends and to those that may have helped you along the way!
Sincerely yours
cc

 

[Chicago1]

About a half hour after the decision was announced this morning, I checked cnn.com to see if anything had been reported. It had. The headline was in bold letters. I have been checking foxnews.com all day and nothing. I guess it's not as important as Trump's new grandchild's birth or Larry King's new divorce. Who owns foxnews.com?