Injury Polly Farmer Had CTE

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No word on this from the AFL as yet. I wonder if they'll address it or just brush it aside. It's a very serious issue that needs attention, imo.
 

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Max Milburn said:
We'll have to wait until they are dead, unfortunately.
I head this morning that you can only confirm CTE through post mortem.
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Yes, that's correct as I understand it. They have been doing these PMs on American gridiron players for some years and there's a body of pretty alarming results building up; ditto with o/s soccer players where the repetitive heading of the ball at practice may be the problem.
 
BORIS332 said:
No word on this from the AFL as yet. I wonder if they'll address it or just brush it aside. It's a very serious issue that needs attention, imo.
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The AFL will probably tip toe around these sorts of things, given some of the rumoured class action stuff in the offing.

John Barnes is another player who's struggled big time post-football with head injury repercussions
 
Max Milburn said:
We'll have to wait until they are dead, unfortunately.
I head this morning that you can only confirm CTE through post mortem.
Click to expand...

Correct

There's cases of former NFL players who have committed suicide with the brain damage being a contributing factor in their decision and if it's not in their Will they will leave notes requesting their brains be examined for CTE. And because they want their brains examined, in cases of suicide they try to avoid damage to the brain such as would be seen by a gunshot wound - so they may shoot themselves in the chest or elsewhere or find another option so they leave their brains "intact"

Its scary what CTE can do to a person
 
Considering the issues faced by Polly and his family in recent years that were already reported this isn't hugely surprising, but it's still sad to think about.
 
cats_09 said:
Correct

There's cases of former NFL players who have committed suicide with the brain damage being a contributing factor in their decision and if it's not in their Will they will leave notes requesting their brains be examined for CTE. And because they want their brains examined, in cases of suicide they try to avoid damage to the brain such as would be seen by a gunshot wound - so they may shoot themselves in the chest or elsewhere or find another option so they leave their brains "intact"

Its scary what CTE can do to a person
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Junior Seau for one. HOF player took his own life several years ago after being a 12-13 year dominant LB for the Chargers and Partiots.
Was a gun player and very very sad end to his life.

GO Catters
 
Not sure how many others have followed this story from earlier this week about changes to junior soccer in the UK, but it's received a fair amount of criticism, including the argument that children need to be taught correct heading/header techniques from a young age.

But when you read that last line from the below quote - former footballers were 3.5 times more likely to die from brain disease, my question is 'why wouldn't you want to reduce the chance of head trauma, especially in younger children while they are still growing and developing?' I know & understand that heading the ball is part of soccer, but do children under 11 really need to be doing that in either training or during games?

Children aged 11 and under will no longer be taught to head footballs during training in England, Scotland and Northern Ireland.

The new football association guidelines for coaches also puts limits on how much heading older children should do.

It follows Glasgow University research that showed former footballers were three-and-a-half times more likely to die from brain disease.
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www.bbc.com

FA guidelines: Children to no longer head footballs during training

The training guidelines are effective immediately but do not recommend a heading ban during matches.
www.bbc.com www.bbc.com
 
Anyone know what Polly's injury history was like. Did he get on the end of a few hits as a player? Didn't seem like he got knocked around much.
Guys like Selwood should be worried...
 

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pollywaffle said:
Anyone know what Polly's injury history was like. Did he get on the end of a few hits as a player? Didn't seem like he got knocked around much.
Guys like Selwood should be worried...
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He played for a long time in an era when ruck contests were pretty physical, and would have undoubtedly received many head knocks from errant fists, arms, elbows and shoulders. Opponents such as Morrow, Nicholls, McKenzie and Ditterich were no shrinking violets when it came to "accidental done-a-purpose" fists and elbows.
 
So I guess, if we are talking about cumulative biffo as opposed to bigger hits then it may be inevitable that our game's rules will need to undergo much greater transformation and/or players will be compelled to wear more safety gear like in grid iron. More likely too, if lawsuits and big sums of moolah are in the picture.
Watch this space.
 
pollywaffle said:
So I guess, if we are talking about cumulative biffo as opposed to bigger hits then it may be inevitable that our game's rules will need to undergo much greater transformation and/or players will be compelled to wear more safety gear like in grid iron. More likely too, if lawsuits and big sums of moolah are in the picture.
Watch this space.
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There are plenty of reasons why helmets make the problem worse, not better.
The brain sloshes around just as much during heavy contact while wearing them, while giving players a sense of invulnerability.
Helmets might protect the skull, but the brain is the issue here.
 
Max Milburn said:
There are plenty of reasons why helmets make the problem worse, not better.
The brain sloshes around just as much during heavy contact while wearing them, while giving players a sense of invulnerability.
Helmets might protect the skull, but the brain is the issue here.
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No s**t. But those helmets etc are still the best 'protection' people can come up with. In the future we may see some weird combination of 'gel' integrated sport specific headgear in an attempt to 'cushion' impact (we see rudimentary early forms of this in our game already- Brayshaw et al.)
My guess is that it is the rules/penalties/umpiring that will continue to change in the area of player protection towards the 'tiggy touchwood' end of the spectrum.
As I said, a couple of big lawsuits/payouts will change everything.
I think in some ways the game could open up and become more of a spectacle, with skills coming more to the fore, so the prospect doesn't worry me so much. Not keen on the body armour bit though.
 
RegHickeyStand said:
I remember having a run-in with a guy several years back. Real attitude and a smartarse. But friends told me later he had an car accident when he was 25 and was nothing like that prior to the accident. Head injuries can even affect the personality. Strange.
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The callous part of footy doesnt want to think about injuries that do not fix with a few weeks off, traditionally if you could hurt a player to see him not play out the game then you would see it done, no one would to hurt anyone long term but out of commisshion for a couple of hours, Perfect.

Now, we are seeing plenty of injuries do not heal. There is something insidious about head knocks. A sore leg or a back or whatever..its to some degree still the same person... but head injuries changes people. There is something particularly sad look at guys like Ali etc near the end. Plenty of people see it every day , one does not have to have had football knocks for people to have issues like Parkinsons or Dementia , I can hardly think getting whack in the head would be good for you. Accident knocks will happen but the days big hist should just about be done. The history like Picket or Ablett are gone, but even a normal hip and should has to be questioned. Perhaps we have leave some element of physical to that for some other sports like mixed arts or boxing.

Now there would be some who would say , don't change the game or it will be become a weak game, I wonder if we have no choice. Some of this is self inflicted, contributions to these injuries football players drinking and who knows what else but the game has to be responsible for its own contributions.
Denial sounds only like the 7 dwarfs of the Tobacco industry , denying issues it caused.

It appears lot of players have paid the price for making the game what it is. Im not one for mixing social issues with football but this is one area I think the game is duty bound to ensure a safe work environment , "as much as possible". It will never be totally safe, and most accept that but one should aim and strife for as safe as we can get it. Just like F1 drivers do not rely on haybales or what ever to hopefully soften their crashes, they make the tracks safer, made the cars safer..... the game has to look at the trying to keep 95% of the game , if that means certain changes then thats what they will have to look at.

I loved the old era of big hits and crunchs as much as anyone but one has to start to thinking about those hits in a differnt a manor. Once it was just a laugh about driving home full as a goose, no longer. A mindset change on the actions on field must occur. Just what are we barrackng for? Yes hit him into some brain damage? It should be looked down on as irresponsible.

Only those who saw Polly may know , did he get taken out with bumps?. It would not surprise me that his issues relate to normal ruck contests in that era were methods were used to reduce his talent.

I think the game has to be duty bound to take care of its ex players ..and at the same time it has to look at players now. Women are playing the game in higher numbers than era. We could be looking huge issues if changes are not made in the way players respect each other in play.

Personally, the way to change on field behaviour is to punish on field. Dangerious hits that give the other side a shot goal would see all players be hesitant to not take extra care of their fellow players. That would be drastic but it would show a level of intent from administration.
 
I read this yesterday from Emma Grant, a Collingwood AFLW player who was concussed during a pre-season game (round 4 is about to start to give a time perspective) and she is still being monitored by the team - they haven't ruled her out for the season just yet but no certainty to play either. The scariest or saddest thing I found in reading her words was the last sentence, and I wonder if there would be benefit to having more players or athletes describe their symptoms and what they go through after being concussed, because surely playing the next week or winning the next match isn't as important as just "being your old self":

Grant, 30, took to Instagram three weeks ago to describe the concussion she copped in the pre-season game as “unlike any other I have had”.

“This is a different beast,” she wrote.

“I think it’s really important to talk about – it’s not a broken leg, I don’t have a scar for you all to see.

“On the outside I look like a normal person, but on the inside it’s like living in a thick fog. It’s scary.”

She described her main symptoms at the beginning of the month as “headaches, irritability, difficulty concentrating, sleep disturbances and sensitivity to light and noise”.

“I just want to be my old self again,” she wrote.
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Partridge said:
At the same time it's hard to pinpoint definitively. He last played footy over fifty years ago.
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True, and as others correctly pointed out, just ordinary contests back then involved more contact whether above board or just the odd biff to remind you that you were in the game.
Minimal or absent video scrutiny and one umpire...
 
pollywaffle said:
Anyone know what Polly's injury history was like. Did he get on the end of a few hits as a player? Didn't seem like he got knocked around much.
Guys like Selwood should be worried...
Click to expand...

His daughter said in one article that he was never diagnosed with having a concussion, and never left the field cause of a head knock. But she remembered him on numerous occassions being quite sick after games where he had copped head knocks, to the point where he was throwing up because of it. Said she must have seen it at least 10 or more times.

It would never have been reported back then. Just suck it up and get on with it. Unless you were out cold, or bad enough that you were completely out of it.

RegHickeyStand said:
I remember having a run-in with a guy several years back. Real attitude and a smartarse. But friends told me later he had an car accident when he was 25 and was nothing like that prior to the accident. Head injuries can even affect the personality. Strange.
Click to expand...

Was talking to a prison guard in mokbels unit, and she reckons he's completely cooked now. Can't remember normal words, and is extremely quick to get angry and aggressive. Said he was never like that prior to getting his head kicked in.
 
pollywaffle said:
No s**t. But those helmets etc are still the best 'protection' people can come up with. In the future we may see some weird combination of 'gel' integrated sport specific headgear in an attempt to 'cushion' impact (we see rudimentary early forms of this in our game already- Brayshaw et al.)
My guess is that it is the rules/penalties/umpiring that will continue to change in the area of player protection towards the 'tiggy touchwood' end of the spectrum.
As I said, a couple of big lawsuits/payouts will change everything.
I think in some ways the game could open up and become more of a spectacle, with skills coming more to the fore, so the prospect doesn't worry me so much. Not keen on the body armour bit though.
Click to expand...
Helmets are not the best protection for CTE.
They can make it worse.
That was my one and only point.
 
ideas.ted.com

Football helmets don’t protect against concussion — and we’re not sure what does

Biomedical engineer David Camarillo reveals how much scientists still don’t know about concussion and the brain.
ideas.ted.com

www.sportingnews.com

Football helmets are creating more problems than they solve | Sporting News

Football helmets, now developed to protect players from traumatic brain injury, are ironic hazards. SN looks into how a false sense of security with such equipment creates a dangerous dynamic.
www.sportingnews.com www.sportingnews.com
 
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