Discussion Random Discussion

[Moral Decay]

Jesus, the w***er from the army justifying not helping the CFA is a dick. He claims they are leaving it to the “experts”. My nephew is fighting fires in Gippsland and I can tell you, him and his mates who are crewing there are 20 yo apprentices tradies not highly trained experts. My nephews greatest achievement is growing an ironic mullet and finding creative ways to shit his brother, his expertise isn’t in fire management, my sister is a senior CFA leader, she still has limited training but is experienced, they are still often isolated and with out communications. The army has better equipment and training. They should be in helping at the fronts. A lot of them were expecting help.

It's all about who's in charge, 2003 CFA and the Department were at each others throats refusing to communicate, even using different maps with different ie. wrong info on them, CFA wouldn't take orders or fight fires, Incident Controllers going off tap, CFA lost a lot of members in the 2 years after, people came from all over to fight fires and they were kept away from doing exactly that.

One thing for sure the Army wouldn't let civilians order troops around, nor would officers be told what to do. Given the records of inept emergency management, as cruel as this may sound it's probably as much as we can hope for that the Army look after logistics for moving people and trucking/flying/boating emergency supplies.

 

[Yawkey way]

It's all about who's in charge, 2003 CFA and the Department were at each others throats refusing to communicate, even using different maps with different ie. wrong info on them, CFA wouldn't take orders or fight fires, Incident Controllers going off tap, CFA lost a lot of members in the 2 years after, people came from all over to fight fires and they were kept away from doing exactly that.

One thing for sure the Army wouldn't let civilians order troops around, nor would officers be told what to do. Given the records of inept emergency management, as cruel as this may sound it's probably as much as we can hope for that the Army look after logistics for moving people and trucking/flying/boating emergency supplies.

I have to say I think it’s a lousy idea for the regular army for a variety of reasons over and above the functions you’ve already mentioned.

They might consider training and a role for the army reserve but given their limited time and the specialised nature of the training they receive it’s probably not feasible either, plus you run into the same problems you’ve mentioned.

 

[Johnnyrayflamingo]

Geez I'm proud of all these Aussies getting in there and helping with the bushfires in different ways...everyone from the volunteers and firies, now the ADF and other emergency services. Its heartening to see communities and neighbours looking after each other too. Even businesses are donating plenty.

Hopefully the bushfires will help inspire and encourage a new generation of people to join one of these organisations at some point in their life because just as before, the bushfires will always come back. Young and old might want to give more back to others. Its a great feeling and something to look back on later on in life.

 

[Joffaboy]

So I've had some pretty devastating news from near Batemans Bay.

I financially support an animal rescue and sanctuary for orphaned joeys.

The woman hand raises them and then they are released back into the wild.

There are now at least three generations of a mob due to this woman.

At 4.00 am on New Years day a firestorm hit the sanctuary, she had to escape across the river.

The sanctuary and everything she has built has been destroyed.

Out of the many Roos she cared for, they have spotted 5 Roos and a Wallaby. They have got water and a bit of food.

I am pretty upset, have watched these Roo grow from tiny joeys in makeshift pouches to mothers with their own joeys, now most are burnt to death.

I know it isn't human loss thankfully, but it is personal and very sad for me.

 

[gringo2011]

I didn’t see it, was this on the news?.

ABC morning news.

 

[SaintsSeptember]

Pretty stupid the Premier even thinking about getting into an area that they are struggling to get people out of.
Unless he has super mutant powers we don't know about.

 

[Pakenhamsaint]

So I've had some pretty devastating news from near Batemans Bay.

I financially support an animal rescue and sanctuary for orphaned joeys.

The woman hand raises them and then they are released back into the wild.

There are now at least three generations of a mob due to this woman.

At 4.00 am on New Years day a firestorm hit the sanctuary, she had to escape across the river.

The sanctuary and everything she has built has been destroyed.

Out of the many Roos she cared for, they have spotted 5 Roos and a Wallaby. They have got water and a bit of food.

I am pretty upset, have watched these Roo grow from tiny joeys in makeshift pouches to mothers with their own joeys, now most are burnt to death.

I know it isn't human loss thankfully, but it is personal and very sad for me.

That sucks Joff. Been to Batemans a few times. It's a great place.

 

[gringo2011]

Pretty stupid the Premier even thinking about getting into an area that they are struggling to get people out of.
Unless he has super mutant powers we don't know about.

I reckon he's been really good during the fires. Looks like a leader compared to Gladys Beriwhatsgername. I saw nice photo of him with a bunch of Sihks that hand out free food to the homeless who are in Bairnsdale handing out Indian food to keep the troops going, they have the local Indian restaurant open cooking there. They went up from Melbourne to help early on. Good when communities from all walks of life pull together.

 

[gringo2011]

Geez, I wonder who you vote for.

Lol.

I'm not a fan of any party, I think he has been a good premier though. Seems to get things done and his leadership in this fire disaster has been very good. I think Morrison has been terrible though so maybe I am just biased.

 

[gringo2011]

Sure, sure...I'm sure the Gringo is being totally impartial here.

I really struggle to rate politicians from either side these days. He seems to be doing the right things when it counts and spending on overdue infrastructure when the economy is lagging. It fits with my beliefs I guess. I like to think I dislike politicians from both sides generally though. Most offer nothing that a cardboard cutout couldn't manage.

 

[CursingFijian]

So I've had some pretty devastating news from near Batemans Bay.

I financially support an animal rescue and sanctuary for orphaned joeys.

The woman hand raises them and then they are released back into the wild.

There are now at least three generations of a mob due to this woman.

At 4.00 am on New Years day a firestorm hit the sanctuary, she had to escape across the river.

The sanctuary and everything she has built has been destroyed.

Out of the many Roos she cared for, they have spotted 5 Roos and a Wallaby. They have got water and a bit of food.

I am pretty upset, have watched these Roo grow from tiny joeys in makeshift pouches to mothers with their own joeys, now most are burnt to death.

I know it isn't human loss thankfully, but it is personal and very sad for me.

Sorry to hear that Joff. my mother lived in Mumbulla our that way for a while and we celebrated her 70th birthday in Cobargo a few years back with family and friends and they’re doing it hard down there too. My heart lurches when I think of the community there.

Keep your head up mate. If the sanctuary is going to try and rebuild, maybe I could chip in a little via yourself? Keep me posted.

 

[Drake Huggins]

Imagine unironically calling someone a ... I am too foolish to read the site rules and thinking that's even a good insult let alone an argument hahaha.

OK doomer.

 

[bergholt]

So what’s the consensus on here - does climate change have anything to do with these fires or not?

 

[Yawkey way]

So what’s the consensus on here - does climate change have anything to do with these fires or not?

Australia has a long history of severe bushfires so it would be easy to say this is a pretty typical event.

However if you look at the record temperatures, drought conditions and the record warm temperatures above Antartica leading to sudden stratospheric warming then it’s hard to argue that climate change isn’t a contributing factor imo.

Australia should be doing everything we can to help solve the problem and that includes pushing for a plan that treats everyone equally including China and India.

 

[pebblesofsand]

So what’s the consensus on here - does climate change have anything to do with these fires or not?

Well this article pretty much explains the relative positions of people.

Local man pretty sure he knows more about climate than NASA, David Attenborough, the UN, CSIRO, the Bureau of Meteorology, the IPCC, and 97 percent of people who study this for a living

"These fires are totally normal!"

chaser.com.au

 

[MUFKilda]

So I've had some pretty devastating news from near Batemans Bay.

I financially support an animal rescue and sanctuary for orphaned joeys.

The woman hand raises them and then they are released back into the wild.

There are now at least three generations of a mob due to this woman.

At 4.00 am on New Years day a firestorm hit the sanctuary, she had to escape across the river.

The sanctuary and everything she has built has been destroyed.

Out of the many Roos she cared for, they have spotted 5 Roos and a Wallaby. They have got water and a bit of food.

I am pretty upset, have watched these Roo grow from tiny joeys in makeshift pouches to mothers with their own joeys, now most are burnt to death.

I know it isn't human loss thankfully, but it is personal and very sad for me.

It's devastating, mate. All that work and care destroyed; just one tragic story amongst many. It's a great thing you do in supporting the sanctuary, and let's hope it can be re-built and can continue its magnificent work.

 

[MUFKilda]

Our news today had footage of that clown you call a prime minister being heckled whilst visiting an area damaged by fire. Some good old Aussie straight talking in evidence, and the woman with a goat on a leash is going full Bogan

 

[pebblesofsand]

So what’s the consensus on here - does climate change have anything to do with these fires or not?

I've used to patiently try and explain why I thought that climate change was a factor, but now I've found this strategy is much much better for my head.

 

[Yawkey way]

Our news today had footage of that clown you call a prime minister being heckled whilst visiting an area damaged by fire. Some good old Aussie straight talking in evidence, and the woman with a goat on a leash is going full Bogan

It’s pretty sad and misdirected imo, people are understandably at breaking point but I’d say never go full bogan it doesn’t play well to a large portion of the population.

 

[gringo2011]

So what’s the consensus on here - does climate change have anything to do with these fires or not?

It's hotter and drier so 100%. I think even the people who don't believe it's man made know it's happening. Well anyone with eyes. We have property in Gippsland and relatives with farms right across Gippsland. I'm in my 40s and have been going there all my life. The micro climate has changed from temperate rain forrest where we are to dry bushland and most in the last 15 years where it's accelerated obviously. The farmers have had constant droughts for the last 15 or so years, these are farms on prime river flats that were lush even in summer. They have to borrow money for feed most years and all have at least one person working a job to pay for the farm to operate.

I think we will see these events most summers now and it will be harder to insure in the country. Massive bushfires are now reasonably common. My family used to talk about the huge fire in the 1920s where some of my relatives died fighting it. It was not topped until Ash Wednesday and then Black Saturday, now we have Catastrophic December and January. Just anecdotally they seem to be getting more frequent. Amazing that there is so much area of Australia under threat. Everywhere from Hobart to the WA goldfields.

 

[gringo2011]

It’s pretty sad and misdirected imo, people are understandably at breaking point but I’d say never go full bogan it doesn’t play well to a large portion of the population.

It's the last thing you need, having pollies doing photo ops while their life is in tatters. The CFA hate it when they come out because they set up to look commanding and take up time from people who are trying to actually do something. It's a bit of damned if you do damned if you don't really.

 

[Yawkey way]

How about a temporary levy, call it the disaster relief levy/climate change fund or similar.

Use the cash to purchase equipment, employ some of the soon to be out of work loggers to cut firebreaks etc. Set the levy at 1% and quarantine half of it for R and D into clean energy etc.

 

[pebblesofsand]

It's hotter and drier so 100%. I think even the people who don't believe it's man made know it's happening. Well anyone with eyes. We have property in Gippsland and relatives with farms right across Gippsland. I'm in my 40s and have been going there all my life. The micro climate has changed from temperate rain forrest where we are to dry bushland and most in the last 15 years where it's accelerated obviously. The farmers have had constant droughts for the last 15 or so years, these are farms on prime river flats that were lush even in summer. They have to borrow money for feed most years and all have at least one person working a job to pay for the farm to operate.

I think we will see these events most summers now and it will be harder to insure in the country. Massive bushfires are now reasonably common. My family used to talk about the huge fire in the 1920s where some of my relatives died fighting it. It was not topped until Ash Wednesday and then Black Saturday, now we have Catastrophic December and January. Just anecdotally they seem to be getting more frequent. Amazing that there is so much area of Australia under threat. Everywhere from Hobart to the WA goldfields.

"Just anecdotally they seem to be getting more frequent."

Its not just anecdotally. All the research shows that the FFDI ( Forest Fire Danger Index) is steadily increasing across Australia and has been doing so for the last 50 years since they've used the Index. The FFDI assesses the chances of a fire starting, then looks at how fast it might spread, its intensity etc and takes into account things like temp, humidity, wind speed and drought situations.

The increase has a twofold impact - increase in the frequency and intensity of bushfires and a reduction in the "window" to carry out "controlled" burning.

The increased rate of spread is the most serious problem for authorities because it just makes forward planning a nightmare especially in relation to public safety. It used to be that you'd use 5 to 6 KM per hour as a base rate for a bad fire and plan and inform people around that.

Black Friday blew that thinking out the window because the saw rates of spread in Victoria in excess of 20KM per hour. At that pace you simply can't identify the fire front and then effectively communicate a emergency warning to towns in its path. Hence the horrendous death toll and the jump to now when we get seemingly very early evacuation notices.

The other thing about the FFDI is that 50 and above was rare and actually "extreme" - now unfortunately its routinely occurring every year.

 

[MUFKilda]

It’s pretty sad and misdirected imo, people are understandably at breaking point but I’d say never go full bogan it doesn’t play well to a large portion of the population.

"The PM is coming to town. I'm heading along to tell him what I think. **** it, and I'm taking a goat on a leash so he'll really get the message".

 

[Pakenhamsaint]

It’s pretty sad and misdirected imo, people are understandably at breaking point but I’d say never go full bogan it doesn’t play well to a large portion of the population.

At least we can go up to our PM and tell him to stick it. Try doing that in the US.