Discussion Random Discussion

[gringo2011]

it reminds me a bit like that lamb ad from years ago where the mum ask the girl asian do they cook lamb like this where you are from and she replys "from Ballarat"....

a couple years ago i went for a job interview with a company when part way through the interview the guy interviewing me commented how good my english was .... i responded "i would bloody well hope so as ite the only language i speak" ...
there is no cookie cutter aussie ... we come in all shapes and sizes in all kinds of colours and religious beliefs ... some people just find it hard to grasp that

Yeah, you get Chinese looking farmers around Bendigo who speak with a strong Aussie drawl and people ask them where they are from. Their ancestors came in the 1850s. It's interesting around Shepparton now, they have had a big muslim influx because the town was dying. Old school Aussies have integrated very well because they realise they have a new lease on life with people repopulating them. In another generation they will all be as Aussie as the rest of them.

 

[st_trav_ofWA]

You don't like macmum bitching about immigrants.
She doesn't like immigrants bitching about aspects of australia.

You're happy for people to bitch about stuff as long as its stuff you agree with.

MacMum is welcome to bitch about anything they want but if its a dumb arse comment i will call it a dumb arse comment ... im all for peoples right to bitch about anything but inturn its my right to bitch about your bitching if i think your bitching is against my personal views just as much as its your right to bitch if my views dont match yours ... im not advocating that you either agree with me or you bugger off to where you came from ..

 

[st_trav_ofWA]

Yeah, you get Chinese looking farmers around Bendigo who speak with a strong Aussie drawl and people ask them where they are from. Their ancestors came in the 1850s. It's interesting around Shepparton now, they have had a big muslim influx because the town was dying. Old school Aussies have integrated very well because they realise they have a new lease on life with people repopulating them. In another generation they will all be as Aussie as the rest of them.

i have often wondered how some of these small rural towns that were dying would benefit from the migrants and refugees ... i know a little town here in WA that has a population of 600 people 10 years ago it had 1600 but as the kids grew up they made their move to the big smoke.. this town used to have two pubs a Cafe a restaraunt a library and a decent supermarket now days there is only one pub and its only is just hanging on... the supermarket is closed 3 days of the week the restaraunt is long gone and the Cafe is now run not for profit by the local ladys group.. imagine 300 odd refugee familys in this comunity sure they would be on welfare (like they would be in the city) but instead of being in city slums where they are packed in ontop of each other they could join a community the money coming to the familys would be spent in that community and that would stimulate the ecconomy in that community suddenly the library is back in action the supermarket has customers and eventually (hopefully) employees .. with a welcoming community it could be fantastic for everyone concerned ..

 

[gringo2011]

Has anyone eaten at Gazi ?

No, friends like it though.

 

[Mowman]

No, friends like it though.

Thank you kind Sir

 

[gringo2011]

Thank you kind Sir

I can't remember what exactly was said but I think they said good but a bit expensive for a pretty casual sort of meal. Good drinking spot though so that's the main thing. Greek is pretty good cuisine no mater what though. Stalactites is cleaned up and pretty good value if you like greek but want cheaper.

 

[VDS66]

OK so my reply was in the context her comment was a bit pat on the head for the good little immigrant who knows his place.

I may well be wrong, but that's how it came across.

Then again, I honestly believe it accurately sums up the posters view on the subject... Which I disagree with.

And although I was born here, it's not my country. I am merely a custodian for the next generation.

 

[sunny3193]

So.
Wet day today, huh.

 

[Mowman]

So.
Wet day today, huh.

Sure was, no lawns mowed today

 

[luca77]

The same thing that gives you the right to disagree with them. We are a free country. Same thing that allows churches to demand that people live by their laws even if no one else wants to live by them any more.

Nuclear energy by the way is more expensive, dangerous and leaves spent fuel that ends to be stored for huge amounts of time. It's terrible, I was in Japan when they had the Fukushima disaster. That is a long term problem for the whole world because Japan wanted a stable energy source.

Where in Japan were you Gringo? That earthquake was a doozy huh? I was having a bath after snowboarding and before going to work. Ran outside in just my snowboard jacket and boots, cos I didn't want to be found naked under the rubble. My neighbour was laughing at me, going "Not used to the bigger earthquakes, huh?". Nobody was laughing once we turned on the TV and saw what was happening on the east coast though. The quake the next morning felt just as big to us because it was nearby. Yeah the nuclear power. It seems a necessity, but...building those things in places where tsunamis have hit before, or on fault lines or in range of missiles from NK. Probably not a good idea. Japan can check all 3 of those boxes unfortunately.

 

[triggering bro]

Human history is littered with atrocities, across all cultures, across all continents & countries & absolutely no one is absolve from blame at one point or another in each of their respective history.

The white man that inhabited Australia were cruel & committed war crimes to the local indigenous people, the Australian aboriginals were cruel & *uncivilised toward one another & the invaders, the sunnies & Shias have been at war committing atrocities against one another since the death of Muhammad, the Brit’s have invaded & been invaded since whenever, Syria continues, Israel & Palestine continues, etc, etc.

With evolution comes recognition of values, standards, change & learnings of right & wrong. Thats why war crimes are no longer tolerated even know they were once the norm across all countries in a less civilised era & it’s why Australian aboriginals can no longer commit rape, incest & murder when it was their culture & right in some communities to do so before they were invaded (unfortunately rape & incest is still a huge issue in many communities).

*Who gives us the right to tell other cultures what’s right & wrong & uncivilised? It’s a human conscious decision created largely from emotion on what we distinguish to be right & wrong which comes through the evolution of humans holistically. This is evolution, keep up, or face the consequences of artificial selection.

The human race has a cruel history & even know we are largely a lot more civilised it continues in many parts of the globe. Australians, white, Brown, yellow, etc, are extremely lucky in comparison to the majority of the rest of the world. Yet we find ways to continue to whinge & create drama when we don’t know drama.

The question is, how long do we continue to dwell on mistakes of those before us? I feel a line in the sand needs to be drawn & we move the feck on however no doubt I’ll be accused of being incredibly racist for wishing that.

While the government & sectors of the community make something an issue....it remains an issue....forever....& only for the purpose of continuing to create divide, cos that’s what it mainly achieves & maintains.

Politics...yuck.

 

[gringo2011]

Where in Japan were you Gringo? That earthquake was a doozy huh? I was having a bath after snowboarding and before going to work. Ran outside in just my snowboard jacket and boots, cos I didn't want to be found naked under the rubble. My neighbour was laughing at me, going "Not used to the bigger earthquakes, huh?". Nobody was laughing once we turned on the TV and saw what was happening on the east coast though. The quake the next morning felt just as big to us because it was nearby. Yeah the nuclear power. It seems a necessity, but...building those things in places where tsunamis have hit before, or on fault lines or in range of missiles from NK. Probably not a good idea. Japan can check all 3 of those boxes unfortunately.

I think we were in Kyoto at the time. I can't actually remember now, there were a few quakes on that trip but not having any idea of what was going on on the news I didn't watch it so didn't realise anything had happened for a few days. The biggest quake we felt was in Tokyo where the whole hotel was shaking quite a lot. No one even slowed down for it. It must have been pretty soft by local standards. There was some food supply issues but we didn't really understand what to avoid.

On another trip I stayed on the Izu peninsula, that was scary because the guy who's hotel we stayed at told us they have regular Tsunamis and if there was a big one just to run like **** up the hill. I don't know if he was having a laugh but he said monthly Tsunamis happen there. They have tsunamis but shit surf poor bastards.

 

[austinnn]

i have often wondered how some of these small rural towns that were dying would benefit from the migrants and refugees ... i know a little town here in WA that has a population of 600 people 10 years ago it had 1600 but as the kids grew up they made their move to the big smoke.. this town used to have two pubs a Cafe a restaraunt a library and a decent supermarket now days there is only one pub and its only is just hanging on... the supermarket is closed 3 days of the week the restaraunt is long gone and the Cafe is now run not for profit by the local ladys group.. imagine 300 odd refugee familys in this comunity sure they would be on welfare (like they would be in the city) but instead of being in city slums where they are packed in ontop of each other they could join a community the money coming to the familys would be spent in that community and that would stimulate the ecconomy in that community suddenly the library is back in action the supermarket has customers and eventually (hopefully) employees .. with a welcoming community it could be fantastic for everyone concerned ..

I've wondered the same thing. I'm pretty sure I saw a report on Aussie TV years ago about a town that turned itself around economically with a huge influx of immigration from a specific country, I can't remember where. The town's sons and daughters had moved to the big city and it was dying but the migrant families breathed new life into the place and so on.

Loads of places ripe for this type of change now. Many Aussie kids don't like living in tiny isolated hamlets with very little interest culturally, but for anyone fleeing persecution on wartorn countries or dictatorships and misery, these towns are exactly what they want, and nowhere with unrestricted internet access is truly isolated now. Win-win.

 

[SaintsSeptember]

*Who gives us the right to tell other cultures what’s right & wrong & uncivilised? It’s a human conscious decision created largely from emotion on what we distinguish to be right & wrong which comes through the evolution of humans holistically. This is evolution, keep up, or face the consequences of artificial selection.

This is the golden question.
If their culture means they are wearing towels on their heads and singing badly , the answer is no-one.
If it means they are condemning their women to second class status and beating them? Many of us would condemn them?
Should we put up with it in Australia when we have laws to the contrary, not a chance.
Will i judge them for this sort of primitive shit.
Yes i will .
If aboriginals want pay back, by throwing spears.
That is uncivilized, and illegal. No matter how traditional it is.

 

[austinnn]

This is the golden question.
If their culture means they are wearing towels on their heads and singing badly , the answer is no-one.
If it means they are condemning their women to second class status and beating them? Many of us would condemn them?
Should we put up with it in Australia when we have laws to the contrary, not a chance.
Will i judge them for this sort of primitive shit.
Yes i will .
If aboriginals want pay back, by throwing spears.
That is uncivilized, and illegal. No matter how traditional it is.

Well no we shouldn't put up with it, but when we judge we have to consider the cultural historic context don't we?

I might find elements of a particular religion barbaric, but only 400 years ago religions considered more humane were equally barbaric. We tut-tut about countries turning themselves and each other into blood-soaked rubble over petty disputes and revolutions, forgetting that now-stable sensible western countries were doing the same thing not that long ago.

We understand that they need to get their shit together just like we did.

TL:dr dont judge

 

[CursingFijian]

I think the thing that may elude home grown Australians is that when people like me transition from one country to Australia, we arrive not knowing how to behave like an Australian. So when I arrived in beautiful Australia from day zero I only knew how to be a good Fijian, and that didn't change overnight. All my customs, values, nuances, accent, interactions were all 'exotic' to everyday Australians. Some fell in love, figuratively and literally, with my colourful differences, and accepted me for who I was straight up and down. But, I know that my islander styles grated on many others, and there were plenty who didn't think twice to tell me what I was doing 'wrong' - especially people occupying positions of authority. There was a smaller group of people that was straight up scared of me.

Early in my transition I found support amongst people that understood me, again figuratively and literally. So basically I hung out with other Fijians. Most Australians who observed my early behavior may have drawn the conclusion that I was NOT trying to blend into Australia. But I really was. In fact I was trying really hard. I remember turning on the radio to ABC in the first week I was here and I could not understand the context of anything that was being discussed. NOT. ONE. THING. So I literally made a pact with myself that I would listen to nothing else but the ABC radio until I could keep up with the daily conversation. 20 years later I can't tune out. I listen to the news and I shake my fist at the clouds about current issues. But that took practice. And some migrants are really good at practicing, while others are dead set hopeless and just withdraw into a comfort zone, and over a long period of time start to feel at odds with their environment. There have been many Fijians who have come to Australia that I have after years suggested need to go back to Fiji. Not for the benefit of Australia, but the individual.

Those who do stay though and have families here (like myself) universally find that propogating their 'culture' to children raised in Australia from an early age is impossible. Children of migrants growing up in Australia always have the aussie operating system installed. Doesn't mean the kids aren't proud of their Fijian heritage. They are. But they are even more proud to be, and identify, as Australians. It's truly heart breaking when sometimes they come across individuals who reject them as Australians because of their appearance.

What I'm trying to say is that migration is a complex process and successful integration requires time and effort from the people transitioning. It also requires the country we are adopting to be supportive and forgiving if we don't present impeccably at the outset. I think MacMum might like me now, but maybe she wouldn't have liked me when I first got here. I don't know.

All up though this is the first time I have been able to have a conversation like this. So I'm kind of proud of us for being able to do that. I have taken no offense from any posters on this forum. Even when I'm butting heads with you.

 

[Nutsngum]

The same thing that gives you the right to disagree with them. We are a free country. Same thing that allows churches to demand that people live by their laws even if no one else wants to live by them any more.

Nuclear energy by the way is more expensive, dangerous and leaves spent fuel that ends to be stored for huge amounts of time. It's terrible, I was in Japan when they had the Fukushima disaster. That is a long term problem for the whole world because Japan wanted a stable energy source.

If Fukishima had been a coal power plant the entire area around would have been devastated by incredibly toxic coal waste slurry that is regularly stored at coal powerplants. The fukushima disaster was a result of government mismanagement and their culture of culpable deniability. What we have running worldwide are reactors designed in the ****ing 1960s because nuclear development is severely hindered by mass scaremongering.

 

[austinnn]

I think the thing that may elude home grown Australians is that when people like me transition from one country to Australia, we arrive not knowing how to behave like an Australian. So when I arrived in beautiful Australia from day zero I only knew how to be a good Fijian, and that didn't change overnight. All my customs, values, nuances, accent, interactions were all 'exotic' to everyday Australians. Some fell in love, figuratively and literally, with my colourful differences, and accepted me for who I was straight up and down. But, I know that my islander styles grated on many others, and there were plenty who didn't think twice to tell me what I was doing 'wrong' - especially people occupying positions of authority. There was a smaller group of people that was straight up scared of me.

Early in my transition I found support amongst people that understood me, again figuratively and literally. So basically I hung out with other Fijians. Most Australians who observed my early behavior may have drawn the conclusion that I was NOT trying to blend into Australia. But I really was. In fact I was trying really hard. I remember turning on the radio to ABC in the first week I was here and I could not understand the context of anything that was being discussed. NOT. ONE. THING. So I literally made a pact with myself that I would listen to nothing else but the ABC radio until I could keep up with the daily conversation. 20 years later I can't tune out. I listen to the news and I shake my fist at the clouds about current issues. But that took practice. And some migrants are really good at practicing, while others are dead set hopeless and just withdraw into a comfort zone, and over a long period of time start to feel at odds with their environment. There have been many Fijians who have come to Australia that I have after years suggested need to go back to Fiji. Not for the benefit of Australia, but the individual.

Those who do stay though and have families here (like myself) universally find that propogating their 'culture' to children raised in Australia from an early age is impossible. Children of migrants growing up in Australia always have the aussie operating system installed. Doesn't mean the kids aren't proud of their Fijian heritage. They are. But they are even more proud to be, and identify, as Australians. It's truly heart breaking when sometimes they come across individuals who reject them as Australians because of their appearance.

What I'm trying to say is that migration is a complex process and successful integration requires time and effort from the people transitioning. It also requires the country we are adopting to be supportive and forgiving if we don't present impeccably at the outset. I think MacMum might like me now, but maybe she wouldn't have liked me when I first got here. I don't know.

All up though this is the first time I have been able to have a conversation like this. So I'm kind of proud of us for being able to do that. I have taken no offense from any posters on this forum. Even when I'm butting heads with you.

Really interesting. I am what might be called a reluctant immigrant into France. I moved here to live with my girlfriend, (now wife), who is French herself. We bought a house, got married and had a couple of kids. I didn't particularly care for France or its culture. I make a half hearted effort to get better with the language, but its rigid and illogical nature annoy me for some reason. When in Japan and Spain, I fell in love with the languages and devoured them and got better much faster (also helped that I was single), but French; well, I guess I just use enough to get by.

I take a passing interest in the culture and politics of the place, but although I'll eventually be a citizen I doubt I'll ever be a Frenchman, and that's fine by me.

I wouldn't mind leaving either, and starting a new home for my family, maybe even back in Australia if I found the right career there. But this is where we are for now and I like it, (a lot more than my wife who is sick of the place). It's got plenty going for it, France, better than most places.

Not all migrants have their adopted home in their heart. I still created two extra French people and contribute to the economy, never cause any trouble. Am I such a bad immigrant?

 

[Yawkey way]

Yeah, you get Chinese looking farmers around Bendigo who speak with a strong Aussie drawl and people ask them where they are from. Their ancestors came in the 1850s. It's interesting around Shepparton now, they have had a big muslim influx because the town was dying. Old school Aussies have integrated very well because they realise they have a new lease on life with people repopulating them. In another generation they will all be as Aussie as the rest of them.

Yes it has helped some country towns and it's pretty funny the assumptions we make like we have all these little macros written into our brains.

I saw a show on the Chinese museum in Bendigo once and this guy there was white with a Chinese accent and the same Anglo/Irish last name as my wife's family.

When my wife came home I was telling her about it and having a laugh, this guy really looked like her dad and they are from up around the Bendigo area.

My wife just had a laugh at the time as she is as fair as you can get with natural white/blonde hair. Years later her aunt sent her a family history, her great grandmothers name was Ah Chow.

Now family's are complicated but this woman was alive when my wife was a child and her dad must have been well aware of his history, I have no idea why she didn't know but it's pretty funny/sad.

I saw a show on some national front loons in Britain, they were full on nut jobs extreme racists. They got some of them to agree to DNA testing, well were there some embarrassed people when the results came back. Some were in denial others just went well who would have though and had an instant change of heart.

I have a pretty comprehensive family history for both sides of my family going back on my fathers side so far it's a joke and for several hundred years on my mothers side of the family. I would have liked to be a bit exotic but I am about as white as you can get, one of my cousins in the states even had a DNA test which confirmed it.

So knock yourself out st trav I really am a boring old white guy.

 

[Barrels]

Anyone able to sell Sunbury to me?

 

[StFly]

Anyone able to sell Sunbury to me?

Don't do it.

 

[Yawkey way]

Anyone able to sell Sunbury to me?

Why? I used to go shooting at jacksons creek and mushrooming as well, now it's just an outer suburb.

 

[gringo2011]

I've wondered the same thing. I'm pretty sure I saw a report on Aussie TV years ago about a town that turned itself around economically with a huge influx of immigration from a specific country, I can't remember where. The town's sons and daughters had moved to the big city and it was dying but the migrant families breathed new life into the place and so on.

Loads of places ripe for this type of change now. Many Aussie kids don't like living in tiny isolated hamlets with very little interest culturally, but for anyone fleeing persecution on wartorn countries or dictatorships and misery, these towns are exactly what they want, and nowhere with unrestricted internet access is truly isolated now. Win-win.

There was a quick way in for refugees up around the fruit picking regions a few years back. Shepparton I stumbled upon when I went through there, it's got a he amount of middle eastern people and a few north Africans. The town is a small regional city and it's got new malls, all the shops you find in most bit towns etc. It looks like it's thriving and has a good vibe, it's gone from a dull faded farmers hub to a proper mini city. I think they had to make them stay for a certain amount of time as part of their visa application from memory.

It has more kebab shops to the square meter than anywhere in Australia and the competition seems to have pushed the quality up.

http://www.abc.net.au/triplej/programs/hack/shepparton-mosque/6993804

 

[gringo2011]

Anyone able to sell Sunbury to me?

The Ashes, and the old mansion is pretty nice.

 

[gringo2011]

Really interesting. I am what might be called a reluctant immigrant into France. I moved here to live with my girlfriend, (now wife), who is French herself. We bought a house, got married and had a couple of kids. I didn't particularly care for France or its culture. I make a half hearted effort to get better with the language, but its rigid and illogical nature annoy me for some reason. When in Japan and Spain, I fell in love with the languages and devoured them and got better much faster (also helped that I was single), but French; well, I guess I just use enough to get by.

I take a passing interest in the culture and politics of the place, but although I'll eventually be a citizen I doubt I'll ever be a Frenchman, and that's fine by me.

I wouldn't mind leaving either, and starting a new home for my family, maybe even back in Australia if I found the right career there. But this is where we are for now and I like it, (a lot more than my wife who is sick of the place). It's got plenty going for it, France, better than most places.

Not all migrants have their adopted home in their heart. I still created two extra French people and contribute to the economy, never cause any trouble. Am I such a bad immigrant?

I have French friends in Australia, they are probably my favourite people, this family have become Australian citizens and are much better at doing stuff with in Australia than me. They have bought into the culture with out the cringe and really love their adopted country and it's lack of old world baggage. It's actually good to see the country through their eyes because of that. I have another French friend that lives in Paris and he lived here for a year or two with his girlfriend and he's an adopted Aussie. He incessantly posts about everything Australian and loves John Butler trio so reposts crap all the time.

The French for all their supposed arrogance were really friendly when we were there and I always get on well with them. I could easily live in France.