Raph Clarke getting caught

[johnny_barker_27]

He has been crucified for getting caught early by Max Rooke which led to the cats first goal- not being aware of what was going on, dopey, lumbering etc etc.

Reckon it was Sam Fisher's fault- I was there as a neutral supporter barracking for Saints- my immediate reaction was put the shepherd on. Was terrible by Fisher, he would have known Clarke was blind sided, was in a perfect position to shepherd and protect Clarke but did nothing. Made Clarke look like the goose.

This may already have been mentioned but was interested to know what the saints fans thought/ or noticed it.

 

[Murraj1966]

Still doesn't hide the fact Clarke shouldn't have waited that long to even attempt to kick. He just stood the mark and didn't even look like he wanted to kick. Either way if Fisher had shepherded Raph he would've waited still and gotten tackled by someone else. He's as thick as they come in footy...

 

[johnny_barker_27]

Fair reply- he didnt really redeem himself afterwards.

Sounds like one of those players you cringe everytime he gets it (Tom Murphy or Simon Taylor for us).

 

[Plugger35]

I think that was just a classic Raph clanger where he had a complete lack of awareness of his surroundings and the pace of the game, don't think it was any fault of Fisher's.

I was hoping those sorts of clangers were behind him but he just doesn't seem to learn. In any game of AFL, let alone the frenzied first few minutes of a GF, you can't afford to just waltz lazily around half back assessing your options. You could see him being run down by Rooke a mile away, yet he just didn't seem to have any awareness of it. Needless to say that was the first of many expletives I unleashed during the course of the game.

 

[johnny_barker_27]

I think that was just a classic Raph clanger where he had a complete lack of awareness of his surroundings and the pace of the game, don't think it was any fault of Fisher's.

I was hoping those sorts of clangers were behind him but he just doesn't seem to learn. In any game of AFL, let alone the frenzied first few minutes of a GF, you can't afford to just waltz lazily around half back assessing your options. You could see him being run down by Rooke a mile away, yet he just didn't seem to have any awareness of it. Needless to say that was the first of many expletives I unleashed during the course of the game.

You probably wouldnt want to watch a replay but if you get a chance- check out Fisher- just as unawares as Raph there- pretty ordinary form for a teammate. But yeah, can see where you coming from.
Spewin you guys got done, must say I have new found respect for the likes of Goddard & Stevie Baker. Good luck in 2010

 

[Plugger35]

You probably wouldnt want to watch a replay but if you get a chance- check out Fisher- just as unawares as Raph there- pretty ordinary form for a teammate. But yeah, can see where you coming from.
Spewin you guys got done, must say I have new found respect for the likes of Goddard & Stevie Baker. Good luck in 2010

Yeah I won't be going out of my way to watch any replays. Haven't ever watched a replay of the '97 GF either, apart from the odd snippet here and there. So I'll probably just have to take your word about Fisher, although he has been a gun player for us for a number of years and I would be one of the last people to criticise him.

 

[Bourky23]

watching the replay you can clearly see Sammy yelling out "RAPPHHHH! RAPHHHH!" but he is in la la land and quickly mown down by Rooke.

Don't be blaming Chips for this. In the time Raph had the ball he should have

a) handballed to Fisher (much better user of the footy)

or

b) should have kicked it himself.

Not Fisher's fault Raph has zero awareness

 

[Murraj1966]

Your attacking him in THIS thread!

*late night post was wrong*

 

[mailman4]

fisher went around the back for the handball (as he's a much better kick) and was ignored by raph who then played on, this meant fisher was in front of raph and couldn't lay a shephard...raph's fault not fish.

btw raph's gotta go

 

[Cuz2Plugger]

Fair reply- he didnt really redeem himself afterwards.

Sounds like one of those players you cringe everytime he gets it (Tom Murphy or Simon Taylor for us).

Put it this way, No one knows what Raphs going to do next...cause neither does he,

He's still developing(?) and the club must know what they are doing......(?)
.........................................................
.........................................................................
Suffice to say, Ive never seen anything like it in a GF.

 

[Squizz]

Whilst not wanting to single out a particular passage of play, and accepting that errors occur, it was one of the most avoidable gift of 6 points to the opposition I have seen.

Sam was calling for it, and he had a break on Rooke.

This is something the guys would do 40+ times in a game - have a running option round the back, with the receiver having the advantage of momentum on the player on the mark.

As soon as Raph didn't give, I completely lost it. No-one could work out what was wrong with me, as nothing eventful had happened (yet).

Any player (at any decent level) would know that you need to look for the player's opponent - a milisecond glance is all that is required. Either give and shepherd or don't leave the mark - it is that simple. All Raph did was drift off the mark sideways.

I'd say he was trying to give Sam a better advantage by drawing the man on the mark a little, but people in Mongolia who have never seen game of football before knew what was going on. Rooke went from tailing Sam (in vain) down the ground to being a goal scorer.

I will never be able to put this one out of my mind.

 

[krusden]

You probably wouldnt want to watch a replay

Neither would raph - but i bet he's been made to watch it over and over and over again until it sinks in that we weren't playing freo or melbourne we were playing geelong.

Players, and not just raph, remembering who we're up against + their tackling + their speed = a better result next time

 

[Falchoon]

I definitely blame Fisher, at least equal with Raph. He should not have let his opponent within cooee of Raph.

 

[Squizz]

I definitely blame Fisher, at least equal with Raph. He should not have let his opponent within cooee of Raph.

You're looking to eliminate the concept of "handball receives" or expecting Sam Fisher to run 50% faster than his opponent

 

[Charlotte]

Put it this way, No one knows what Raphs going to do next...cause neither does he,

He's still developing(?) and the club must know what they are doing......(?)
.........................................................
.........................................................................
Suffice to say, Ive never seen anything like it in a GF.

You then perhaps did not watch the Geelong v Hawks grand final last year and see some of what Varcoe did (and he still does) One of the reasons why Raph looks so "Where to go" is his job is not to actually get the football it is to keep it out of play from the opposition. (Hence why he hit it out in the forward line against Doggies and did not mark it) But he does need the back up. I believe the club does know what they were doing. I would feel much better if he was playing forward like he used to though

 

[NeilElvis]

The OP is correct. Chips led Rooke right to Raph as he tried to make an option for Raph to handball to. Raph was looking for an option further up field & after he has a quick look around doesn't see Rooke who is directly behind him.

Chips does yell, "Raph, Raph" but he does so as Rooke is right on Raph's tail.

Something like this is simply a communication error between teammates & Raph is not the first player to get caught trying to create the play.

Onballers get caught doing the exact same thing every week... but they are not vilified like Raph is.

 

[Murraj1966]

They aren't given shit cos it's rare. Raph stuffs up on far more occasions, so when he stuffs up again, the rage increases.

 

[okeydoke7]

Partially agree with the OP. I am a Raph fan, but thought he was really dissapointing on the big stage. He should have had the awareness, yes. But it was partially Fisher's fault. Firstly, yes he should have laid a shepard, clearing Raph's path. Secondly, Rooke wouldn't have been ALLOWED in the vicinity if Fisher wasn't just standing around. If Fisher wasn't hovering within a few metres, Rooke would have been made to clear away. Fisher is entitles to hover around, but if he does, and Raph plays on, he has to lay a shephard.

 

[Squizz]

Who is Fisher shepherding???

Raph had not cleared the man on the mark - you want Fish to shepherd Rooke out so Raph can take the man on the mark on?

Can't believe that posters don't understand that all coaches want their players to provide the handball option round the back to create some run - not for a player to run 25-30m to shepherd their own man out!!!

 

[NeilElvis]

Who is Fisher shepherding???

Raph had not cleared the man on the mark - you want Fish to shepherd Rooke out so Raph can take the man on the mark on?

Can't believe that posters don't understand that all coaches want their players to provide the handball option round the back to create some run - not for a player to run 25-30m to shepherd their own man out!!!

Have a look at the replay Squizz.... Chips runs within 3-4 metres of Raph & brings Rooke to the him. The problem Raph was looking at an option out on the wing and ignore's Chips 'lead'. He actually looks around BEFORE he runs off the mark & can't see Rooke because Rooke is directly behind him.

If Chips had given Raph more space to run off the mark (as all coaches want their players to do as well), Rooke would have been forced to make a decision; pressure Raph & allow Chips an uncontested possession or stay on Fisher's tail & allow Raph to kick the ball to whoever it was making a lead on the wing.

If Raph saw Chips so close to him, he should have realised that Rooke was probably bloody close. Having said all of this, this whole episode happened in a 3 second period at the start of a GF.

Anyway, who cares....We kick the missed opportunites & Geelong supporters are arguing over how crap Kelly was to allow Milne to kick 3 goals and it's time for Milburn to retire after Schneiders won a Norm Smith with a 4 goal performance.

 

[Sainters66]

He has been crucified for getting caught early by Max Rooke which led to the cats first goal- not being aware of what was going on, dopey, lumbering etc etc.

Reckon it was Sam Fisher's fault- I was there as a neutral supporter barracking for Saints- my immediate reaction was put the shepherd on. Was terrible by Fisher, he would have known Clarke was blind sided, was in a perfect position to shepherd and protect Clarke but did nothing. Made Clarke look like the goose.

This may already have been mentioned but was interested to know what the saints fans thought/ or noticed it.

You're WRONG about Fisher. WRONG, WRONG, WRONG.

He was yelling at Raph to get rid of it. Watch the replay and get back to your own board.....

 

[warrior_4]

Who is Fisher shepherding???

Raph had not cleared the man on the mark - you want Fish to shepherd Rooke out so Raph can take the man on the mark on?

Can't believe that posters don't understand that all coaches want their players to provide the handball option round the back to create some run - not for a player to run 25-30m to shepherd their own man out!!!

Fisher is not to blame in this instance....raph was on the mark and could not get tackled... fisher was trying to make an option for him as he saw that raph was like a rabbit in headlights and was looking lost....so decided to run around the back of him to create space and an option raph steps of the follows fisher and thus steps off the mark being tackled by rooke...fisher did not want the ball because he had rooke on his tail and didnt call for it...he yelled raph raph when raph actually moved away from the mark so tell him that rooke was behind him....however it was all too late

 

[Squizz]

Chips runs within 3-4 metres of Raph & brings Rooke to the him. I don't see what the problem is with that - Fish had momentum and Raph didn't.

The problem Raph was looking at an option out on the wing and ignore's Chips 'lead'. If the option was there, Fish was just as well placed to hit the target.

If Chips had given Raph more space to run off the mark (as all coaches want their players to do as well). If you watch, Raph was not exactly running. Didn't seem to have made his mind up as to what he was doing.

If Raph saw Chips so close to him, he should have realised that Rooke was probably bloody close. Bingo!

Anyway, who cares....

I do! Why can we not address things before they cost us big time? If a player works hard and calls for the ball (particularly a gun like Fish who is a proven ball carrier who we want to give off to), you better have a pretty _ucking good reason to not honour it.

 

[Falchoon]

You're looking to eliminate the concept of "handball receives" or expecting Sam Fisher to run 50% faster than his opponent

Don't go overboard, I think Fishers timing was off and Raph should have stepped left rather than right

 

[Cuz2Plugger]

You then perhaps did not watch the Geelong v Hawks grand final last year and see some of what Varcoe did (and he still does) One of the reasons why Raph looks so "Where to go" is his job is not to actually get the football it is to keep it out of play from the opposition. (Hence why he hit it out in the forward line against Doggies and did not mark it) But he does need the back up. I believe the club does know what they were doing. I would feel much better if he was playing forward like he used to though

Honestly cannot remember what Varcoe did in 08 GF. What did he do? I know his pace was pretty good last week in the final qtr, also though that his disposal wasn't great.

I'm still on the fence with Raph, (though sometimes it boils over) hope he becomes more decisive, aware...etc. Sports Psych?

Mybe he will. Maybe as you say we could use an unguided missle up the ground more. His decision making need a hell of a lot of work.

Would an Andreas Everitt fill his shoes in the backline?