Autopsy Rd 2 Blues suffer bitterly disappointing loss to arch rival

Who played well for Carlton in Round 2?


  • Total voters
    244
  • Poll closed .

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TheVapors

Rookie
Apr 19, 2009
28
141
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Out of all the comments made regarding our centre clearances, I daresay I've included more reasoning, and pinpointed the exact examples, for the basis of my opinion than most.

If you want detailed play by play description of each bounce, you can watch the game. A summary is just that.

So far as it needing to come with caveats, posting it on a discussion forum rather than sending it to the club with my resume should be all the caveat needed.


If I was going to write a paragraph on each play, then yes these points may have been noted.

Given I chose not to highlight that Dow was poor in the contest however, I didn't see the need to highlight potential allowances for it either.


So what is your actual opinion of the whole play, and how would you choose to summarise it concisely?


But you're not analysing the play, you're analysing my interpretation of it. You're nitpicking the odd description which has been made through the lens of seeing every contest in detail, and attempting to keep the summary to a digestible length.

Ultimately if my comments paint the picture that Walsh was excellent and Ed and Dow poor, then they have correctly represented the impact that each had in the centre (imo).

If you disagree and want to challenge that view, I'd be keen to hear the reasoning and respond.

If you just want to tell me I'm biased while offering up nothing of substance in retort, what is your end goal exactly.
My original post, upon viewing your analysis while watching the game, simply pointed out that what was reported was dependent on the individual player. Walsh could do no wrong, while others were simply labelled as "poor" without context. As your post was generating a fair bit of comment, I thought it needed to be pointed out that people should form their own opinion.

I didn't come on here to comment on the actual play. I came on to make a comment about someone else's analysis. This is a public forum. If you don't like you analysis being discussed then don't post it.

Our players get potted a lot on this forum, some more than others. I have no particular issue with this, but if I think it's unfairly done then I'm happy to make comment on it. In this case, I think some of our players were being unfairly represented by your analysis, so I commented on that.

If you do want my opinion, I don't think Dow was as bad as most are making out. His centre clearance work wasn't great, but it wasn't as bad as you made out in your analysis. As far as I know, a broken tackle is when a player breaks free entirely. Not when they manage to get a poor handball or kick away. At a few non-centre clearances, he made some good plays by hand. His first quarter was pretty solid. I don't think he was anywhere near best on, but he was far from worst.

I am analysing your analysis of the play. I've never attempted to do different. In terms of your comments on what I'm analysing. I simply commented to the fact that you assume I'm bad at analysing football because I don't agree with how you represented that play. I've never said or made an assumption that you're bad at analysing the play, more so that what you choose to convey is biased by your opinion on individual players and that people should keep this in mind.

It appears that we differ in opinion in how we analyse and rate our players, which is entirely fine. I'm happy to agree to disagree and keep this from getting into a drawn out argument that gets off topic. Happy for you to have the last word and keep it at that.
 

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branedotorg

Premium Platinum
Nov 9, 2007
3,166
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Probably. This puzzles me though. Teague likes to have faith in the same players to rectify the situation, but does this mean he doesn't have faith in the players outside the team to come in and have an influence?
Remember last year, out on our feet, with a pile up of games and a big finals chance we played the same squad over and over.
 

BigBreakfast

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Simmo was the leader down back, I was hoping Weiterbot would jump straight in, but it "appears" not to have happened.
I thought one of our captain's played in the backline? Having said that, the backs are going ok, including Plowman. Our defensive capacity across the ground has been lacking. If we didn't turn it over as much, the backline would be under less pressure. Watch Port play.
 
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SkyhorseTamer

Norm Smith Medallist
Jun 4, 2016
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Had eight kicked on him and ended up the eighth ranked player on the field.

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Week 1 lynch was rated the worst on ground and the guy that did that to him was rated 5th worst or so. Weits was easily one of the best week 1. The ratings metrics are absolute ass.
 

SkyhorseTamer

Norm Smith Medallist
Jun 4, 2016
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Question has to be asked, if a team directly target ONE defender for countless entries, you would think the coaching panel would react by either ..

a) Getting someone to drop into the hole in front or ..
b) shuffle the deck chairs ...

I put it to you some of the leads that were targeted at plows man ... no one would have stopped "one V one"

Neither happened. Makes you wonder doesn't it ..

Right up there with letting Adams of the chain and taking until HALF TIME for someone (Teague/Line Coach etc) to tag him (Ed Curnow) .......
The 20 of 30 games conceding 5 goals goes with these observations. They go into games with the wrong tactics and don't adjust fast enough. Or go in with good tactics and the opposition adjusts and we don't counter. Ultimately its all on Teague. Even if some of it isn't his immediate match day responsibility its his coaching team.
 

SkyhorseTamer

Norm Smith Medallist
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Yeah it's true some of those entries couldn't be stopped, hence the reason I pointed out the sh*t defensive pressure from the midfield.

Definitely coaching staff to blame too, but at the same time Plow has to take some accountability too. He needs to use his voice and direct, he needs to keep his feet in the goal square instead of getting pushed over so easily and he needs to be better at marking his opponent so he can't create space and easy leads to run into.
If I had 3 goals kicked on me and saw I was being targeted I'd be yelling and trying to force changes with coaches and team mates. Plow has to take responsibility more.
 
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If I had 3 goals kicked on me and saw I was being targeted I'd be yelling and trying to force changes with coaches and team mates. Plow has to take responsibility more.
Shouldn't need Plow to point out the obvious, but on that point, he's far too laconic. It's almost as though he has a toke before the game. Never looks phased, never looks like he's hurting, like he's sucking in the big ones. He's a little bit of a different cat IMO.
 

Metalcrusher

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Jan 22, 2015
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Shouldn't need Plow to point out the obvious, but on that point, he's far too laconic. It's almost as though he has a toke before the game. Never looks phased, never looks like he's hurting, like he's sucking in the big ones. He's a little bit of a different cat IMO.
True, otherwise what would be the point of Head Coaches? Line Coaches? Should just let the players do their thang .... working wonderfully so far at CFC.
 

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JustaBattler

Everyone Looks Better In Blue
May 31, 2012
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My original post, upon viewing your analysis while watching the game, simply pointed out that what was reported was dependent on the individual player. Walsh could do no wrong, while others were simply labelled as "poor" without context. As your post was generating a fair bit of comment, I thought it needed to be pointed out that people should form their own opinion.

I didn't come on here to comment on the actual play. I came on to make a comment about someone else's analysis. This is a public forum. If you don't like you analysis being discussed then don't post it.

Our players get potted a lot on this forum, some more than others. I have no particular issue with this, but if I think it's unfairly done then I'm happy to make comment on it. In this case, I think some of our players were being unfairly represented by your analysis, so I commented on that.

If you do want my opinion, I don't think Dow was as bad as most are making out. His centre clearance work wasn't great, but it wasn't as bad as you made out in your analysis. As far as I know, a broken tackle is when a player breaks free entirely. Not when they manage to get a poor handball or kick away. At a few non-centre clearances, he made some good plays by hand. His first quarter was pretty solid. I don't think he was anywhere near best on, but he was far from worst.

I am analysing your analysis of the play. I've never attempted to do different. In terms of your comments on what I'm analysing. I simply commented to the fact that you assume I'm bad at analysing football because I don't agree with how you represented that play. I've never said or made an assumption that you're bad at analysing the play, more so that what you choose to convey is biased by your opinion on individual players and that people should keep this in mind.

It appears that we differ in opinion in how we analyse and rate our players, which is entirely fine. I'm happy to agree to disagree and keep this from getting into a drawn out argument that gets off topic. Happy for you to have the last word and keep it at that.
The problem with your narrative regarding your response to Brackets 's post is that it smacks of smartarsery which you might get away with if it were accompanied by some kind of humour and self deprecative concession.

Instead it took a respone post to call you out and only then did you go on to state your real agenda. In fact you chose to criticise a posters opnion - referenced by acctuall events and by player - to criticise.

If you wish to celebrate Dow's magnificence - how about you just post your reasoning up front instead of all the snide lead up.

Go for it I look forward to your observations- we could all do with some positives supported by facts - may well be the forum has become too critical about too much - but Collingwood loss has pretty much cashed in a lot of chips from the team, certain players and the coaching team - a whole lot more neutrals now than optimists - and that is on player and coach peformance in both games.
 

forever blue 1

Team Captain
Mar 7, 2021
365
393
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I
The great thing about champions is they just find a way to adapt to change and find another way to excel. It's just what makes them who they are.

I'm backing him in, and it won't take too long either.

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li love Crippa
But how long ?
This isn’t about the 2 first round games ...
 

forever blue 1

Team Captain
Mar 7, 2021
365
393
AFL Club
Carlton
The problem with your narrative regarding your response to Brackets 's post is that it smacks of smartarsery which you might get away with if it were accompanied by some kind of humour and self deprecative concession.

Instead it took a respone post to call you out and only then did you go on to state your real agenda. In fact you chose to criticise a posters opnion - referenced by acctuall events and by player - to criticise.

If you wish to celebrate Dow's magnificence - how about you just post your reasoning up front instead of all the snide lead up.

Go for it I look forward to your observations- we could all do with some positives supported by facts - may well be the forum has become too critical about too much - but Collingwood loss has pretty much cashed in a lot of chips from the team, certain players and the coaching team - a whole lot more neutrals now than optimists - and that is on player and coach peformance in both games.
It’s just an opinion JaB
We are all entitled to. I well amd truly will say apart from 3 players
Carlton completely sucked on Thursday night. They are all bs talk at the moment.
every year,they promise the world and deliver an atlas
 

BigBreakfast

Norm Smith Medallist
Sep 19, 2019
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If I had 3 goals kicked on me and saw I was being targeted I'd be yelling and trying to force changes with coaches and team mates. Plow has to take responsibility more.
Do we know that he didn't? In the pros, coaches should be better that waiting for a player to tell out for a hand though.
 

JustaBattler

Everyone Looks Better In Blue
May 31, 2012
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Simmo was the leader down back, I was hoping Weiterbot would jump straight in, but it "appears" not to have happened.
Docherty is down back and he is Captain - mate- how many Chiefs do we need? There are only 6 of them and they ar a subteam anyay - you'd think they had figured out how to play by now..and what each other ccan or cant do..etc etc...I dont thiunk our defence is as big of a problem as the midfield anyway
 

BigBreakfast

Norm Smith Medallist
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Thdn he would've stopped starting 2 metres behind his opponent and played a metre in front, as you do vs fast leading opponents.
Fair enough. Might also have ripped strips off at least a couple of mids who were not accountable further up the field. He will not be the only deep back who is exposed under this new set of rules. If you go back and have a look at earlier eras, some pretty good backs were towelled up by quality hit up forwards. We just haven’t seen it in a while and one of ours got exposed.
 

SkyhorseTamer

Norm Smith Medallist
Jun 4, 2016
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If you go back and have a look at earlier eras, some pretty good backs were towelled up by quality hit up forwards.
And did they let their midfielders and coaches know? Ofc.

The structure we are playing has been shredded both weeks. Plow was just targeted. That strategy would've worked on most of our backs the way we setup
 

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