Rumour Real reason Sydney got trade ban.

[Obeanie1]

When the afl announced they were planning a team for western sydney, everybody screamed about how hard it will be to win that market. Western sydney is controlled by rugby codes and soccer. Still the afl went ahead and to help their cause they signed folau to a masssive deal in an attempt to garner interest. The afl has pumped tens of millions of dollars into gws and they knew they would struggle to begin with.

Folau walking out was a massive blow for the afl. Not only did he not generate the interest in the game that they expected, he was a massive flop and walked out of the code. The afl were left red faced as they were beginning realise the magnitude of their task to establish a successful afl team in western sydney. However their was a light at the end of the tunnel. The worst kept secret was that lance "buddy" franklin, the games premier goalkicking machine and one of if not the biggest draw the game has ever seen, was heading to gws. The afl knew with buddy's arrival, sponsors would come, fan interest and attendance will rise and better players would be willing to join the giants. Gws were going to be PRIMETIME!!! and the afl's multi million dollar experiment would be a huge success and the afl would make their money back ten fold. Then......

The swans swooped in and signed buddy while no one was looking. The afl's master plan had been thwarted and gws would have to start again. The afl left with egg on their face.

That is the reason for the ban

The reason why the Swans were banned was because the egg on face to the AFL has been building and building until it no longer could be ignored or allowed to continue.

The egg on face being the bull sh!t advantages the AFL / Demetriou had engineered over the past ten years to unfairly boost the Swans and the AFL's marketing campaign in NSW. Now with GWS attempting to develop and the Swans obviously being a long term success the change in management finally allowed the AFL to rectify the situation. Demetriou was a dictator and he was more interested in boosting his own annual bonus by handing the Swans advantage over advantage that other clubs did not have and in doing so improve TV ratings in NSW.

The AFL conducted a in depth survey on what was most important to fans and the answer came back "the integrity of the game". In one sentence the AFL was pushing equalisation but all the hand outs to the Swans engineered by Demetriou was exactly the opposite, especially after the sustained success the Swans had enjoyed.

The AFL then decided to scrap the COLA "scam" and IMO then AFL found out about another big name free agency signing by the Swans and then decided to stop it.

Next should be the academy system in its current format. Why is there a Swans academy and a GWS academy?

Why can't there be a AFL NSW academy with both clubs and the AFL pooling resources to develop NSW talent?

Both clubs should then bid against each other to retain the talent in NSW. In this case Heeney would be at the Giants and fair enough.

 

[Membling]

The AFL conducted a in depth survey on what was most important to fans and the answer came back "the integrity of the game". In one sentence the AFL was pushing equalisation but all the hand outs to the Swans engineered by Demetriou was exactly the opposite, especially after the sustained success the Swans had enjoyed.

The AFL then decided to scrap the COLA "scam" and IMO then AFL found out about another big name free agency signing by the Swans and then decided to stop it.

Next should be the academy system in its current format. Why is there a Swans academy and a GWS academy?

Why can't there be a AFL NSW academy with both clubs and the AFL pooling resources to develop NSW talent?

Both clubs should then bid against each other to retain the talent in NSW. In this case Heeney would be at the Giants and fair enough.

Because any business model would generally not invest money into a scheme in which a direct rival could reap better yield from for equal or more investment.

Easiest way to ensure future development would allow each club to have academies in qld and nsw. Easy done.

 

[Obeanie1]

Because any business model would generally not invest money into a scheme in which a direct rival could reap better yield from for equal or more investment.

Easiest way to ensure future development would allow each club to have academies in qld and nsw. Easy done.

Except all of the "non expansion" state clubs already invest heavily into junior development in their state but don't get the massive advantage the Swans get handed on a platter by the AFL.

Junior development is an initiative every club and the AFL support. So why do expansion clubs get unfair advantages over other establish AFL clubs? Especially those who have seen little on field success for decades?

So what is the problem with every club and the AFL contributing to junior development and equally sharing the spoils of that 'investment' as you put it?

Why should an established and successful club like the Swans get advantages others do not?

 

[Membling]

Except all of the "non expansion" state clubs already invest heavily into junior development in their state but don't get the massive advantage the Swans get handed on a platter by the AFL.

Junior development is an initiative every club and the AFL support. So why do expansion clubs get unfair advantages over other establish AFL clubs? Especially those who have seen little on field success for decades?

So what is the problem with every club and the AFL contributing to junior development and equally sharing the spoils of that 'investment' as you put it?

Why should an established and successful club like the Swans get advantages others do not?

Each state already has an ingrained and massive junior system already in place. Whatever agreements they have with respective AFL governing bodies is completely irrelevant. Also the amount of investment to establish a sporting code is huge and should be done by the AFL, which they have been largely unwilling to do.

Note the highlighted 'non expansion' and 'expansion'. It reads more as traditional and non-traditional in the sense that the markets are:
1. Underdeveloped.
2. Not at saturation point.
3. Not the dominant code.

The problem is that each and every market has completely different access to the pools of talent available to them. Occasionally, the go home factor comes into play eg Bris 5, GWS, early years at the Swans.

I've already put my opinion that academy system should be in place for every club until there is a viable juniors pool to draw from.

The reason why a 'communal pool of talent will not work, ala the NSW scholarship scheme, does not work as there is little incentives for individual clubs to put forward sums of money for little to no investment.


Why should an established and successful club like the Swans get advantages others do not?

No club should receive an advantage. Plain and simple. All grounds should have the same dimensions for one. But serious , as repeated again and again, development in this region is simple. open academies to all clubs for the nsw/qld region. Mitigates any advantage, develops region. Win-win. If you have a problem with how the afl decide to do it, take it up with them.

 

[Superstar swan]

The academies have been in place for a number of years and has bever been a problem untill heeney burst onto the scene. The way see it is that fat head and the rest of the footy public coukdnt give a rats all this time when we had the same "unfair advantage / access" to the dud players that were mostly coming through the academies at the swans financial expense. Exact same situation as the cola. It was never a problem until we won the 2012 flag.

 

[Obeanie1]

The academies have been in place for a number of years and has bever been a problem untill heeney burst onto the scene. The way see it is that fat head and the rest of the footy public coukdnt give a rats all this time when we had the same "unfair advantage / access" to the dud players that were mostly coming through the academies at the swans financial expense. Exact same situation as the cola. It was never a problem until we won the 2012 flag.

The problem became more obvious as the Swans continued an extended run playing finals without going through a downturn cycle and signing multiple free agents on big money and at the same time also had access to academy players.

Where other teams such as Bulldogs continued to struggle without those artificial support mechanisms.

That and the emergence of the second team in NSW who are a legitimate 'development club' it was obvious as the nose of your face that the Swans should not get the same hand outs as an emerging club.

Stand up on their own two feet with hand outs and then win a premiership and they will finally start earning respect from the rest of the competition and opposition supporters.

 

[Superstar swan]

The problem became more obvious as the Swans continued an extended run playing finals without going through a downturn cycle and signing multiple free agents on big money and at the same time also had access to academy players.

Where other teams such as Bulldogs continued to struggle without those artificial support mechanisms.

That and the emergence of the second team in NSW who are a legitimate 'development club' it was obvious as the nose of your face that the Swans should not get the same hand outs as an emerging club.

Stand up on their own two feet with hand outs and then win a premiership and they will finally start earning respect from the rest of the competition and opposition supporters.

Before the 2012 season, our list was ridely regarded as mediocre with no legitimate stars except for a few ageing over hill players. By the end of the year we won the flag and all of a sudden our players became superstars and we signed tippett. Yet because we won the flag and signed tippett we were regarded as cheats.

What i dont understand is how a team of no names at the start of the year who then win the flag magically become worth a lot more per year,given the contracts were exactly the same.

If we had gone out in straight sets that year, the outroar over the tippett signing would not have occured. Yet because our season was extended by 2 weeks we are cheats

 

[Bicco]

The Swans are like a 30 year old millionaire living with their parents and still asking for pocket money.

 

[cryptor]

The Swans are like a 30 year old millionaire living with their parents and still asking for pocket money.

And that 30 year old millionaire only became a millionaire by hoarding benefits and leeching off others. But still spends all their time claiming they do it tough.

 

[Tedeski]

.........or.........

maybe the Swans have just been a well run club making the most of their advantages.

Much like West Coast made full use of the drug culture in their prime using it to their fullest.

Also similar to Hawk's use of pokie money, taken from people with problems, to get themselves out of financial mediocrity.

Carry on!

 

[Obeanie1]

.........or.........

maybe the Swans have just been a well run club making the most of their advantages.

Much like West Coast made full use of the drug culture in their prime using it to their fullest.

Also similar to Hawk's use of pokie money, taken from people with problems, to get themselves out of financial mediocrity.

Carry on!

What a dead set tosser of a post.

If you can't win a debate on the merit of your argument just post crap and then say "carry on".

Top effort, you just painted yourself as an idiot.

I really like the fact that Swans supporters can't agree that they should have the same access to players as all the other established clubs. It basically says that without special help and hand outs from the AFL they would fail as a club. They aren't good enough to stand on their own two feet and compete on a level playing field.

Many supporters from established clubs call that cheating and to a degree it is.

So until they do win a flag on their own merits without "special assistance" and welfare handouts all their success has a ** next to it.

 

[Colonial]

What a dead set tosser of a post.

If you can't win a debate on the merit of your argument just post crap and then say "carry on".

Top effort, you just painted yourself as an idiot.

I really like the fact that Swans supporters can't agree that they should have the same access to players as all the other established clubs. It basically says that without special help and hand outs from the AFL they would fail as a club. They aren't good enough to stand on their own two feet and compete on a level playing field.

Many supporters from established clubs call that cheating and to a degree it is.

So until they do win a flag on their own merits without "special assistance" and welfare handouts all their success has a ** next to it.

Would love to know whats classed as an even playing field. Rather impossible to have

 

[Bicco]

Would love to know whats classed as an even playing field. Rather impossible to have

I would say 1) selected clubs being able to pay players more than other clubs to entice players to come to your team and 2) having exactly the same access to the national pool of players that every other team does. Every Vic, SA and WA team have an even playing field. Unless you're being literal, in that case some heavy earthmoving equipment should do it!
New clubs should be helped, don't get me wrong, just not clubs that have being established for 30+ years and have made 4 GF's in 9 years winning 2 of them.

 

[Obeanie1]

I would say 1) selected clubs being able to pay players more than other clubs to entice players to come to your team and 2) having exactly the same access to the national pool of players that every other team does. Every Vic, SA and WA team have an even playing field. Unless you're being literal, in that case some heavy earthmoving equipment should do it!
New clubs should be helped, don't get me wrong, just not clubs that have being established for 30+ years and have made 4 GF's in 9 years winning 2 of them.

Exactly.

I keep asking Swans supporters on here when do they think their club will finally become "established" so as not to need AFL welfare and handouts that other established clubs don't get.

They seem to ignore the question or claim that the Swans remain at a terrible disadvantage. Except the facts are they have made finals 8 or is it 9 years in a row, played in 4 grand finals and won 2.

 

[Tedeski]

What a dead set tosser of a post.

If you can't win a debate on the merit of your argument just post crap and then say "carry on".

Top effort, you just painted yourself as an idiot.

I really like the fact that Swans supporters can't agree that they should have the same access to players as all the other established clubs. It basically says that without special help and hand outs from the AFL they would fail as a club. They aren't good enough to stand on their own two feet and compete on a level playing field.

Many supporters from established clubs call that cheating and to a degree it is.

So until they do win a flag on their own merits without "special assistance" and welfare handouts all their success has a ** next to it.

In reply to tosser posters.

 

[Obeanie1]

In reply to tosser posters.

The best substitute for intelligence is silence.

Instead you posted crap that had no bearing on the facts nor the topic being debated.

Simply shows you lost the debate and decided to be a tosser.

Now run off and continue enjoying your teams AFL assisted and propped up success. The rest of us will continue to point this out in the slim hope that one day someone in the AFL will actually implement what they are preaching about equalisation and we eventually have a national competition where all teams operate under the same rules.

Hmmmmm, might watch the 2014 grand final again, nothing like watching the Swans lose and lose badly.

 

[Colonial]

I would say 1) selected clubs being able to pay players more than other clubs to entice players to come to your team and 2) having exactly the same access to the national pool of players that every other team does. Every Vic, SA and WA team have an even playing field. Unless you're being literal, in that case some heavy earthmoving equipment should do it!
New clubs should be helped, don't get me wrong, just not clubs that have being established for 30+ years and have made 4 GF's in 9 years winning 2 of them.

Yet it isnt even. With the 99% of players come from traditional states etc, as such theres the old go home factor.

 

[inamedthegiants]

The Giants and Suns are entitled to our academies. We are 25 -35 years away from being able to draft a potential father/son.

 

[Bicco]

Yet it isnt even. With the 99% of players come from traditional states etc, as such theres the old go home factor.

That's clutching at straws a bit as a reason for the swans to have concessions, which is what I'm discussing, not GWS or GC.
Mind you you're right, but players can't just leave if they want without going into the draft or a trade being done unless they are a FA.
Sydney got Tippet recently on a pseudo go home factor and GWS Griffen for whatever reason that was.
Basically I'm trying to say the 'go home factor' is no reason for an increase in salary cap. Hell, Adelaide teams could claim concessions because it's dull compared to Sydney which is exciting and a better place to live. Which is true, so people Want to live in Sydney, so Sydney's houses are more expensive. At the moment Swans players get more money AND a 'better' lifestyle. It's pretty much win-win for their players which is what gives the rest of the comp the shits.

 

[Bicco]

The Giants and Suns are entitled to our academies. We are 25 -35 years away from being able to draft a potential father/son.

Entitled is an interesting choice of word. You're not entitled to anything. Freo have never had a FS pick as we only started in '95, so what, in your opinion, are we entitled to?

 

[Boxhead_31]

Didn't the AFL basically announce the reason? The AFL wanted to dump the COLA immediately. But Sydney said that they want two years to phase it out and said that they wouldn't poach anyone over that time. The AFL then agreed to that and took Sydney's comment about poaching players and made it a trade ban. In effect, the trade ban was the quid pro quo for allowing two years of extra COLA. Seems that Sydney could have avoided the trade ban by agreeing to remove COLA immediately. In the end, Sydney went with the lesser of two evils in the trade ban.

Not sure if there is anything more in it than that.

So why were the Giants still allowed to trade then?
They still have COLA built into their playing contracts and have to get down to the same level as Sydney in the same time frame.

 

[inamedthegiants]

Entitled is an interesting choice of word. You're not entitled to anything. Freo have never had a FS pick as we only started in '95, so what, in your opinion, are we entitled to?

You had access to 4 WAFL clubs, East & South Freo, Perth & Swan Districts for the last 19 years and do so for the last year this year.
We have nothing to draw from.

 

[fabulousphil]

Individual club academies should stay, the resources should not be pooled into one NSW academy.

Club academies grow the club, ( brand) and kids identify with a club, want to play for a club and will support it for life whether they make the grade or not, a single NSW academy will not achieve this to any great extent IMO.

ATM it is actually exciting times for kids in the Northern state academies, a record year of draftees and next year is shaping to have some high rated picks as well.

i can only relate it to WAFL academies ( development squads) once kids are picked in those under 14,15,16 etc squads, whether they barracked for that particular club or never even followed a WAFL club, they learn the history, see the 1st graders train etc they usually follow that club for life.

 

[Bicco]

You had access to 4 WAFL clubs, East & South Freo, Perth & Swan Districts for the last 19 years and do so for the last year this year.
We have nothing to draw from.

That is 100% incorrect. The only access we've had to those players is through the draft like everybody else.

 

[inamedthegiants]

That is 100% incorrect. The only access we've had to those players is through the draft like everybody else.

You mean Wikipedia lied to me?