List Mgmt. Rebuild or refresh?

[Willo_23]

Re: Jack and Cotch, quite happy for them to go around one more time but maybe on the premise that if we have other guys we want to get games into at various stages, that they might have to take a backseat and miss a few weeks.

 

[Mr Magic]

Re: Jack and Cotch, quite happy for them to go around one more time but maybe on the premise that if we have other guys we want to get games into at various stages, that they might have to take a backseat and miss a few weeks.

We should have rested a lot of other players when we played weaker teams. There is no excuse,

Even guys like Baker, Short, Pickett, Edwards could have weeks off. Next year even McINtosh could have a week off and Broad as well as Grimes to protect his hammies not to mention Tarrant if he wants to win a premiership.

People whinge about me taking Tarrant out v Brisbane. If Stack comes in, they win, Tarrant comes back in and wins a premiership this year why complain?

 

[A Tiger 4 lyf]

Hoping the club,Jack and Trent come to the right conclusion, would be tough to watch seeing em go round again



Sent from my iPhone using BigFooty.com

 

[sante]

Hoping the club,Jack and Trent come to the right conclusion, would be tough to watch seeing em go round again



Sent from my iPhone using BigFooty.com

And rob us the chance to say goodbye?

 

[tiger_tough]

Hoping the club,Jack and Trent come to the right conclusion, would be tough to watch seeing em go round again



Sent from my iPhone using BigFooty.com

Did you miss Jacks 3 goals from 50m? It'd be tougher not having him go around again.

 

[Rioli2Rioli]

How many kids do we want on the list ??

We have 19 players 23 and under

trading in a 25 year old guaranteed quality mid instead of an unknown 18 year old pick 11/12 is the right trade

 

[Coach_Required]

If we have to give up our 1st rounder for Taranto its a done deal IMO. Last night proved that Ross & Sonsie need help going forward. Prestia's hammies are no longer reliable, Cotchin doesn't have much left and Dusty is the same.

I would love to get Taranto and even Hopper as well, if only.

 

[A Tiger 4 lyf]

And rob us the chance to say goodbye?

Round 1 is our home game


Sent from my iPhone using BigFooty.com

 

[A Tiger 4 lyf]

Did you miss Jacks 3 goals from 50m? It'd be tougher not having him go around again.

Would be a decent return for a last game


Sent from my iPhone using BigFooty.com

 

[JR82]

I think one of our problems is what to do with Baker and Short. They are a little on the utility side, jack of all trade master of none.

I think Baker is a forward that could help in the guts in a situation like last night. Baker for me is not a back. Then what do we do with Stack who is a back and should have played last night?

I know most will not agree with me but I would trade Baker simply because although I rate him he does not suit our mix of other players in their roles.

Even by your standards this is nuts

 

[db26]

For me Short is trade bait would never have given him a 5 year deal his no midfielder and our back 6 is settled.

 

[KeilorUnder9s]

We need 2 good contested midfielders, it’s not that much to find really.

 

[tigerdan]

This years rookies performed as good as you could hope for given our draft position since 2017.

If we trade for Taranto we have to draft a key forward and get him on the conveyor belt.

Back line is set.

Next picks for onballers with great stats but overlooked for being a bit too small.

Very late picks can be spent on speculaive bean pole ruckmen.

There's probably some guys who want opportunities elsewhere. Happy to trade for future picks even if they are 3rd or 4th rounders.

 

[Mr Magic]

I think we might have to rebuild.

JR and Cotch can stay on but we might have to the draft.

I know its been two years since a GF for us but we need to get younger than the Swans it seems.

Taranto and Hopper might be too old for us given our list profile compared to others.

We might need to trade Baker to so we can get younger and stronger

Dimma must know if we do not get younger eventually he will lose his job. Is Swans another baby bombers?

Can our oldies be a Buddy Franklin?

Rebuild so we can win in 2024 but might sneak it in 2023

 

[Tygrys]

I think we might have to rebuild.

JR and Cotch can stay on but we might have to the draft.

I know its been two years since a GF for us but we need to get younger than the Swans it seems.

Taranto and Hopper might be too old for us given our list profile compared to others.

We might need to trade Baker to so we can get younger and stronger

Dimma must know if we do not get younger eventually he will lose his job. Is Swans another baby bombers?

Can our oldies be a Buddy Franklin?

Rebuild so we can win in 2024 but might sneak it in 2023

I like your thinking. There are people here peddling a false dichotomy. That if you go into 'rebuild' which in this case means the draft and not Taranto and Hopper that you are not aiming to win or can't win the flag. Nail the draft and quite often, especially with how physically developed these kids are, and especially if you are selecting midfielders, they are ready to significantly contribute from year one. And instead of getting five to six good years that you'll probably get with Taranto you're getting 10 plus with a draftee.

Now will a draftee contribute as much in year one as would a Taranto or Hopper, probably not. But to me that's only an argument if you think the rest of the list is absolutely primed for one final tilt at the flag. Whatever we do (and I am not violently against Taranto and Hopper if they don't cost too much ie unless they effectively wipe out both our draft hands for two years) I just hope the logic of their recruitment isn't the same as Brisbanes under crazy Vossy. That somehow we can 'squeeze' one more premiership out of Riewoldt, Cotchin, Grimes, Martin and co in their twilight. If they play on and contribute, and if they even all there next year, great. But just accept the most we can expect from them are as contributors but not as the players that once carried us to flags.

Anyhow, whatever way you cut it, recruit for the long term and as Sydney has shown quite often the present takes care of itself.

 

[Hamsatma]

For me Short is trade bait would never have given him a 5 year deal his no midfielder and our back 6 is settled.

absolutely agree, from memory he had one good game in the midfield against an average opposition team? Has shown nothing in the mid since. Rioli has gone past him in defence

 

[SumTingWong]

For me Short is trade bait would never have given him a 5 year deal his no midfielder and our back 6 is settled.

I agree. If we get Taranto and Hopper I can't see him playing midfield. So where does that leave him?

 

[Hamsatma]

How many kids do we want on the list ??

We have 19 players 23 and under

trading in a 25 year old guaranteed quality mid instead of an unknown 18 year old pick 11/12 is the right trade

If that's the trade it's a no brainer. I think it will be more and even then still the right trade. TT is a quality player and if we want to be playing and winning finals we need him. Not to mention our suspect record on first rounders recently

 

[Mr Magic]

I like your thinking. There are people here peddling a false dichotomy. That if you go into 'rebuild' which in this case means the draft and not Taranto and Hopper that you are not aiming to win or can't win the flag. Nail the draft and quite often, especially with how physically developed these kids are, and especially if you are selecting midfielders, they are ready to significantly contribute from year one. And instead of getting five to six good years that you'll probably get with Taranto you're getting 10 plus with a draftee.

Now will a draftee contribute as much in year one as would a Taranto or Hopper, probably not. But to me that's only an argument if you think the rest of the list is absolutely primed for one final tilt at the flag. Whatever we do (and I am not violently against Taranto and Hopper if they don't cost too much ie unless they effectively wipe out both our draft hands for two years) I just hope the logic of their recruitment isn't the same as Brisbanes under crazy Vossy. That somehow we can 'squeeze' one more premiership out of Riewoldt, Cotchin, Grimes, Martin and co in their twilight. If they play on and contribute, and if they even all there next year, great. But just accept the most we can expect from them are as contributors but not as the players that once carried us to flags.

Anyhow, whatever way you cut it, recruit for the long term and as Sydney has shown quite often the present takes care of itself.

It is a interesting scenario. If you get Taranto and others, you lose others cause they do not get a go. At the same time if you go to the draft it gives you time to go past the likes of Melbourne because they where higher up on the ladder. Also the youth more likely to stick because they have time on their hands but not forever obviously. If it does not work, can always go the doozy later.

The other thing if Melbourne comes off others might want to leave because might want to leave like a Harmes because the sweetspot is over.

It is a interesting situation now in Hawthorn, trying to get rid of players no one wants.

If we had of got Parker when he was floated from the Swans last year at one point could have been interesting, but imagine if they had of kept the guy that went to Adelaide or even a Hewett to CFC.

Geelong might have to go through Melbourne and then play the Swans in the GF. imagine Geelong getting beat by the Swans in the GF because they are too old

 

[sante]

For me Short is trade bait would never have given him a 5 year deal his no midfielder and our back 6 is settled.

Should be one of our wingman imo. Put Pickett into the midfield?

 

[energyquant]

I agree. If we get Taranto and Hopper I can't see him playing midfield. So where does that leave him?

I said this all along with Short. Very few AFL footballers transition into the midfield if they didn't play that position as a junior. You need to play that position all the way though your junior footy to have midfielder instincts that are honed by thousands of game-day centre bounce attendances. Short doesn't look a natural midfielder to my eyes and I don't think he can learn the position in the AFL. His defensive work at the clearance is always going to be a problem.

I'm not sure I'd trade Short, simply because he doesn't have that much trade currency. We've felt tall all year in the backline though, so I'm fine with Short, Rioli and Baker all playing in our back 7. It means Gibcus spends a year building strength and confidence in the VFL and letting him fight it out with Biggie as the replacement for Tarrant.

 

[Mr Magic]

I said this all along with Short. Very few AFL footballers transition into the midfield if they didn't play that position as a junior. You need to play that position all the way though your junior footy to have midfielder instincts that are honed by thousands of game-day centre bounce attendances. Short doesn't look a natural midfielder to my eyes and I don't think he can learn the position in the AFL. His defensive work at the clearance is always going to be a problem.

I'm not sure I'd trade Short, simply because he doesn't have that much trade currency. We've felt tall all year in the backline though, so I'm fine with Short, Rioli and Baker all playing in our back 7. It means Gibcus spends a year building strength and confidence in the VFL and letting him fight it out with Biggie as the replacement for Tarrant.

I think your underselling our the importance of our backline. I don't think all can be there back against the highest opposition.

I think for Rioli its more commenable he can mitigate a Cameron potentially than running off the backlne because others can always run off the backline and its about how well players can matchup up even as a team against others and Rance is not there anymore and Grimes will not always be there either

A guy like Banks, I think he might play in the guts yet, amongst others, lets see how he develops.

We will know a lot more next year especially about our youth

 

[energyquant]

I think your underselling our the importance of our backline. I don't think all can be there back against the highest opposition.

I think for Rioli its more commenable he can mitigate a Cameron potentially than running off the backlne because others can always run off the backline and its about how well players can matchup up even as a team against others and Rance is not there anymore and Grimes will not always be there either

A guy like Banks, I think he might play in the guts yet, amongst others, lets see how he develops.

We will know a lot more next year especially about our youth

I want our guns back there. Hence Daniel Rioli + Short + Baker. That's where they have all played their best footy.

I played half back most of my time in footy. IMHO, it's the most important position on the ground

 

[ForeverHardcore]

For me Short is trade bait would never have given him a 5 year deal his no midfielder and our back 6 is settled.

Short won a b and f in a premiership year as a rebounding half back

There is definitely room to fit him back down there
Rioli replaced Houli
Houli and short were a great combo and it worked fine at the start of the year

Baker/Houli/Short/Vlastuin all fit down back in the 2019/2020 flags so I think it can work again next year

Just need to find some mids as Short needs to play down back
The lack of drive Thursday night was evident

 

[Rioli2Rioli]

Going to the draft to pick up quality gun mids but there is only 1 problem , We dont have a top 5 pick
its pick 11/12 and will be speculative similar to Dow , RCD etc and will take 2-4 years to get ready and we have lost 3-4 senior players that rotate through the mid.

We need 2 ready made mids to remain up and the kids to continue their development