Reid at CHB

[mdc]

I like him getting some experience in defense.

I'm not a big fan of pure lead-up CHFs in general tbh - they need to be very good field kicks to be effective (see ROK). Even a stud like Reiwoldt can look decidedly average playing that role.

 

[Capital Pie]

one other thing, playing reid at chb was a shrewd move in terms of his development and come back. it is easier to transition him back into the game in defence esp with the current vfl set up. he didn't need to go chasing the ball as it invariably came to him.

it also helps to develop his defensive skills which will come on handy as he plays up forward more.

 

[The Royal Sampler]

The theory about Reid to CHB seems to me to be about hiding his poor disposal by foot. Unfortunately poor kicks will be poor kicks , no matter where you put them.

Well, yeah, if you want to ignore 80% of my post.

"Reid to CHB" is about;
a) taking the pressure off Reid's set shot kicking, and

b) alleviating a key forward surplus
c) alleviating a key defender deficiency
d) playing a player in a role to which I think he'd be well-suited
e) allowing Brown to move to a spot where he'd be better suited

Also, his strength and contested marking ability are just fine for a 195cm KP player taken less than 2 years ago very bottom-aged.

On JA, I think he might be able to play FB or a rebounding defender at times, and obviously has the capacity to play forward, but probably not CHB due to his height at 191cm.

 

[shawthing09]

I am a huge Reid fan. I think in general most times his field kicking is effective. His technique is flawed most the time he gets the ball spinning end over end to a target in general play so I am not going to be looknig to much into the technique side of things.

That said his defensive pressure as a foward has been an issue so I am unsure about how he would go as a defender. He has also shown that in body on body contests at least for now, he has struggle keeping his feet. His hands are good and his contested marking is good over head with a player chasing him or out in front of a pack etc, I do think he'd struggle if a foward decided to go toe to toe with him. If he was to go to CHB long term I think he would very much be a Waite / Bock / Cornes CHB. Taking the lead up guys racking up cheap kicks. I actually think that the only certainty is that he could make it as that type of player either the lead up CHF playing more liek a wing men. Or the CHB playing like a wingmen. As a foward kicking pending he has the potential to be more then just that cheap kick getter but the kicking is the issue.

 

[shawthing09]

Totally seperate issue but I heard BT asked on triple M why it is that so many players that are good footballers and poor kicks take so long to show any improvement in kicking if any at all. His answer was intriguing. In short he said clubs didn't put any importance on kicking overall and used Ried as an example.

 

[Dave The Man]

Totally seperate issue but I heard BT asked on triple M why it is that so many players that are good footballers and poor kicks take so long to show any improvement in kicking if any at all. His answer was intriguing. In short he said clubs didn't put any importance on kicking overall and used Ried as an example.

Nah Really - You can tell by how many Bad Kicking Player we have we don't have don't care about Good Kicks

 

[StillWaiting5689]

I like him getting some experience in defense.

I'm not a big fan of pure lead-up CHFs in general tbh - they need to be very good field kicks to be effective (see ROK). Even a stud like Reiwoldt can look decidedly average playing that role.

Reiwoldt is a very good field kick, will hit his target lace out nearly everytime, the bloke just can't kick for goal reliably.

 

[kevind]

Totally seperate issue but I heard BT asked on triple M why it is that so many players that are good footballers and poor kicks take so long to show any improvement in kicking if any at all. His answer was intriguing. In short he said clubs didn't put any importance on kicking overall and used Ried as an example.

BT is a mug. Hawthorn have a recruiting manifesto that no player is recruited to the club who has poor kicking skills.

 

[Quicky]

BT is a mug. Hawthorn have a recruiting manifesto that no player is recruited to the club who has poor kicking skills.

We should steal their manifesto!!!

 

[shawthing09]

BT is a mug. Hawthorn have a recruiting manifesto that no player is recruited to the club who has poor kicking skills.

I should have explained myself better. The conversation was in reference to Rhys Palmer and then why players who are clearly talented when drafted but have suspect kicking tend not to improve. Someone suggested that it was a age thing, that you can be to old to be taught how to kick. The pannel referenced guys like Kenelly and Marty Clarke and said especially in Clarkes case he is now one of the best kicks in the league.

Someone went of on a tagent about Tiger and how he took a massive time off golf to totally reconstruct his swing because you need to relearn and get rid of all your old bad habits. BT then pretty much linked it to that. He said the players do X amount of time at the end of training learning how to kick but then spend the rest of training kicking with their old bad habits and not having the time to go through the proper corrections and hence they never lose those bad habits.

As for Asain With the Fro's AFL greater then VFL in regards to field kicking can you please explain what difference the level has in terms of the skill of kicking? That is almost the dumbest thing I have heard. The ball is not a different shape it's not like someone would kick in a different manner.

 

[well left]

I'm a fan of Reid and a fan of giving him some time in defense. I also would not be concerned about the fact that he may not have had a man on the weekend. He is a young kid who has had a tough year playing in a team who was playing its last game. The plan would have been for him to run around and get his hands on the ball and get a feel for it in case he is needed in the AFL in the coming weeks.

I still think we should draft a KP back in this draft but it would be great if we can develop some defensive skills in Reid. Anthony is our other KP back and I reckon he can play KP but if Reid is capable of playing at both ends like Cornes, Bock etc then we should be set for KP for a good couple of years.

 

[Kirby]

I should have explained myself better. The conversation was in reference to Rhys Palmer and then why players who are clearly talented when drafted but have suspect kicking tend not to improve. Someone suggested that it was a age thing, that you can be to old to be taught how to kick. The pannel referenced guys like Kenelly and Marty Clarke and said especially in Clarkes case he is now one of the best kicks in the league.

Someone went of on a tagent about Tiger and how he took a massive time off golf to totally reconstruct his swing because you need to relearn and get rid of all your old bad habits. BT then pretty much linked it to that. He said the players do X amount of time at the end of training learning how to kick but then spend the rest of training kicking with their old bad habits and not having the time to go through the proper corrections and hence they never lose those bad habits.

Yeah, i heard that segment from BT too. He explained that alot of it got down to the amount of time allocated by clubs. The programs the players are under are run by fitness staff and they tend to "hog" the time so there is not much time left to do remedial work on kicking. There was also the issue of potential injury to a player who for instance went out and practiced kicking for 6 hours a day (like Tiger did with his swing).

BT also mentioned how difficult it is to change much with a player's action but that you can have some success with improvements on such things as flight of the ball i.e getting some loop on it etc.

 

[brspdt201013]

I thought it was very encouraging. He had 22 touches and 7 marks in 65% game time. Not bad for first game back.

Will our CHF for the next 10 years.

 

[Bonuspoints]

Yeah, i heard that segment from BT too. He explained that alot of it got down to the amount of time allocated by clubs. The programs the players are under are run by fitness staff and they tend to "hog" the time so there is not much time left to do remedial work on kicking. There was also the issue of potential injury to a player who for instance went out and practiced kicking for 6 hours a day (like Tiger did with his swing).

BT also mentioned how difficult it is to change much with a player's action but that you can have some success with improvements on such things as flight of the ball i.e getting some loop on it etc.

If this is the case then why aren't players spending time in the off season correcting it. If I was a fringe player or a player determined to take my game to the next level then I'd be making it a real focus if it was my weakness. I think there was a basketball Olajawon (note spelling is incorrect) who would spend his off seasons practicing his post moves, in particular the fade away jump shot. He paid kids to go get the balls and just spend hours doing it. So why can't our guys do something similar. The players and coaches get paid well enough so why the heck note have them spend a good chunk off the off season when they're young to develop a good technique and make it natural.

 

[Daicos Mullets]

Chopper is an enigma. He could well be the most talented of our 'kids' yet there are guys who look to be taking up spots in our future campaigns, and we're yet to really work out where Reid could end up.

We've got Dawes penned down for the goalsquare, Anthony has two spots lined up, Browny is our fullback, even guys like McCarthy and Wellingham have shown that they will figure down the track.

Reidy, we just don't know.

So I ask (it's been touched on before, but it needs be re-asked):
For those who have seen more of him than others, how is his tank, and what are his footskills like around the ground?

At this stage, I'm not sure we're he'll fit in regards our forward line (Cloke, Dawes, Rusling, etc.) and down back, I'm not sure either (size, natural forward). I'm thinking Richo-like wingman...

I like your thinking as a Richo type winger. His size & pace could be really damaging & his lighter frame wouldn't be as much of an issue.

I'm not really convinced about him as a CHB, he gets beaten too easily in those static, body on body contests. He really needs to build some strength & bulk to be able to match it in those sorts of situations. I'm really not sure if he's got the body type to be able to build that bulk.

Chris Dawes has made a good debut, but he's been shown up for pace during games. I think that would be too much of a liability at CHB.

 

[Bay Pie]

I think Reid could be a very good CHB especially given his speed. He would be great on the lead up forwards, like Tarrant, in a similar role to what Jared Brennan played for the Lions in his 1st few years. Obviously if he got matched up on a J.Brown type they would try to take him to the goal square, but N Brown could then swap roles. He could also provide run off HB as his field kicking has been OK. Will only get better with fitness, strength and experience.

Reid did play on a wing in the U18 champs of 2006 and averaged around 15-20 possessions, so he has good mobility. I wouldn't expect much next year given his size and age but I do think he will be an important player for us in the future.

People forget he was 2 days off being ineligible for the 2006 draft. He is 2 weeks older then Kreuzer, so basically a 1st year player.

Would we be calling for the trading of a 1st year player that has shown some signs in the AFL?

 

[4#Didak#4]

Have already posted my thoughts on Reid @ CHB in an earlier post:

http://www.bigfooty.com/forum/showthread.php?t=483399

Anthony has shown a lot up forward for us this year despite being regarded as a backman. His defensive pressure up forward is fantastic, leads well and kicks straight (which is nice to see given some of our recent goal kicking history).

I am inclined to leave him there next year which makes for a crowded list for forward selection: Rocca, Cloke, Dawes, Reid, Rusling, Anthony, Medhurst. We cannot play them all up there as we will need another small or two included.

Cloke obviously CHF & Medhurst floating inside 50.

Rocca assuming fit will play FF, Dawes is his backup and future replacement & will no doubt be required sooner rather than later, but in the meantime back to VFL for Dawes.

Rusling if fit will play as he gives the forward line an extra dimension.

This leaves the third tall forward Reid or Anthony. I think Anthony at this stage brings more to the table. Reid back to VFL to get his body right and maybe just maybe be groomed as a future CHB?

Thankfully someone down at Collingwood reads Bigfooty! I am taking all credit for this move

I take the point about needing JA to go back. A look at our back six shows we do lack depth that is not a problem up forward:

Harry, Goldsack, Brown, H Shaw, Maxwell, Clarke or similar small.
I have left Wakes & Presti out as they can't be in future planning.
So Anthony would slot in well there.

However I still like the idea of trialling Reid up back. He is quick & tall and seems to read the ball well, would help his development as a forward, takes pressure off him that he is currently getting in terms of expectation as the next gun Pies forward. Obviously needs to beef up.

With that list above no one other than Brown will help cover the best forwards in the competition. Franklin, Roughead, Fevola, Pav, J. Brown have all destroyed us in recent years and JA is not suited to stop those sort of players so would not "solve" our backline problems. I can see Reid as a player in a couple of years capable of giving Franklin a big contest. If we can't stop those guys in the future we aren't true contenders.

Given our forward line riches why not give it a crack?

Well sounds like we are giving it a crack and think its for the best, I think he is well suited to CHB in the modern game. What have we got to lose in trying?

Any chance of putting me on the coaching panel - they are stealing my ideas anyway plus I would do it for free

 

[well left]

Any chance of putting me on the coaching panel - they are stealing my ideas anyway plus I would do it for free

Don't be stupid - I know we have some losses from selling a few hotels but I think we could still afford to pay you a small salary for your efforts!