Opinion Respecting the ANZAC's

[jjsmitty8]

Was originally going to start this thread off by saying "not sure if it's thread worthy", but then I see the run that a lot of other garbage gets around here and I just decided to go for it since it's more thought provoking.

Wanted to put a discussion I've been having with people at home and work to the family here in the Magpies forum.

SO let me set the scene, this year I'm fortunate enough to be attending the ANZAC day game on Saturday afternoon. I'm 23 years old, I have no direct knowledge of any family fighting in the war although it has been mentioned to me that we may have had ancestors who did. My respect for the ANZAC's is immense and the Dawn Service is something that for at least the past 5 years I have been attending whether that be on my own or with people I can inspire to come. It's a small token of my appreciation to be up at the crack of dawn to acknowledge the service men and women who gave their lives to provide this country we are blessed to reside in.

Anywho, the point of my thread is to ask a simple, yet perhaps controversial question.

Is it disrespectful to film the Last Post with my iPhone at the MCG on Saturday?

Now, it might not seem a big issue to some, but to others it may very well be. Is it taboo? Is it just 'unaustralian'? I don't want to unknowingly offend someone in the crowd, and although I feel I won't be the only one, what if I am? It's the centenary year, and it's been 6 years since I've been to the annual game, it's just a moment I'd love to capture because I want to be able to re-live that moment. Just not at the expense of causing an uproar.

Additionally, I don't feel it's at all disrespectful to film during the national anthem and catch that almighty roar when the anthem finishes, and the siren blows.

Thoughts?

 

[Jasper84]

For me personally, it is the only time of the year that I actually stop everything I am doing and just pay respect. I don't think a camera is required to do that.

But I think it is good that you raised the issue and frankly we could do with more threads on general etiquette.

 

[Bard]

'unaustralian'

Using that tag in any context is more shameful than recording the Last Post on your phone....

Why do you want to record it though? As a Film student questions of ethics are constantly raised in regards to filming documentaries, and at the end of the day I personally believe it comes down to 'why'. If your reason to do so is ethical and moral then I see no issues with it.

You briefly touch on it by saying it's because you want to re-live the moment... but it seems a little vague. Are you planning to re-live the moment by just watching the video again on your phone once? Why do you want to re-live the moment? At the end of the day if you're 're-living the moment' to once again pay your respects to the memory of those who have served then you're just propagating what ANZAC day is about and therefore it is a positive thing... I suppose.

 

[sr36]

For me personally, it is the only time of the year that I actually stop everything I am doing and just pay respect. I don't think a camera is required to do that.

But I think it is good that you raised the issue and frankly we could do with more threads on general etiquette.

Is it ok to claim I've 'slept' with someone's mother when I'm at the footy?

 

[Bard]

Is it ok to claim I've 'slept' with someone's mother when I'm at the footy?

Did you sleep with their mother?

 

[sr36]

Did you sleep with their mother?

No sleeping was involved.

 

[Kappa]

As long as you don't stand with it above your head and carry on like a teenager at a music festival I doubt people will even notice...

 

[jjsmitty8]

Using that tag in any context is more shameful than recording the Last Post on your phone....

Why do you want to record it though? As a Film student questions of ethics are constantly raised in regards to filming documentaries, and at the end of the day I personally believe it comes down to 'why'. If your reason to do so is ethical and moral then I see no issues with it.

You briefly touch on it by saying it's because you want to re-live the moment... but it seems a little vague. Are you planning to re-live the moment by just watching the video again on your phone once? Why do you want to re-live the moment? At the end of the day if you're 're-living the moment' to once again pay your respects to the memory of those who have served then you're just propagating what ANZAC day is about and therefore it is a positive thing... I suppose.

Yeah, I do see your point. To start, I was kind of poking fun at the term 'unaustralian'.

Secondly, by reliving, I mean exactly what you described. Maybe on a technicality 'reliving' is the wrong term and I should have said 'film the last post and keep it as a memory.' I've got lots of things on my phone (ie. Photos from when I was working to the Oakleigh Chargers and we won the flag) (ie. When I went to Thailand with my GF). I'm not going to look at it every day, but it's definitely something I'll keep as a memory.

 

[ppoiter]

I dont see why it would be disrespectful but I also never see the point of filming anything like that on a phone. What you see on the phone afterwards is such a meagre representation of what was going on I honestly dont think its worth it. Why not just put it away and experience the moment? To everyone who gets out their phones at gigs, Im talking to you too

 

[Vicky Park]

Yeah, I do see your point. To start, I was kind of poking fun at the term 'unaustralian'.

Secondly, by reliving, I mean exactly what you described. Maybe on a technicality 'reliving' is the wrong term and I should have said 'film the last post and keep it as a memory.' I've got lots of things on my phone (ie. Photos from when I was working to the Oakleigh Chargers and we won the flag) (ie. When I went to Thailand with my GF). I'm not going to look at it every day, but it's definitely something I'll keep as a memory.

I'm glad you were poking fun at that term. It's a disgusting way to describe a person or their actions, which has crept into the national discourse in the last few years. What does it mean - someone who has an independent thought, and doesnt go along with the herd thinking? Cant have that happening, can we?

Not having a go at you JJ, but I must be 'unaustralian'' because I do have a different view of the whole Anzac story/Anzac Day phenomenon, which I'm not going into here. And it is not about the soldiers, or the men and women who lost their lives or were incapacitated by war. I had family badly affected by WWII, and I've seen the impact of the Vietnam War on people I know. Much respect for all in those situations.

But as for Anzac Day...

 

[Baltimore Jack]

I'm glad you were poking fun at that term. It's a disgusting way to describe a person or their actions, which has crept into the national discourse in the last few years. What does it mean - someone who has an independent thought, and doesnt go along with the herd thinking? Cant have that happening, can we?

Not having a go at you JJ, but I must be 'unaustralian'' because I do have a different view of the whole Anzac story/Anzac Day phenomenon, which I'm not going into here. And it is not about the soldiers, or the men and women who lost their lives or were incapacitated by war. I had family badly affected by WWII, and I've seen the impact of the Vietnam War on people I know. Much respect for all in those situations.

But as for Anzac Day...

Does it go something like this: "The Rich telling the Stupid to go and shoot the Poor"
But you are right probably not the right thread to discuss such wider issues and I apologise in advance.

 

[Vicky Park]

Does it go something like this: "The Rich telling the Stupid to go and shoot the Poor"
But you are right probably not the right thread to discuss such wider issues and I apologise in advance.

Not far off BJ. But I have also known WWII and Vietnam vets who want nothing to do with Anzac Day, and have never celebrated it. Might be something like this: "The attention and fanfare given to Anzac Day could be better directed at assisting returned soldiers with mental and physical health problems".

 

[NT.Thunder]

The day is about remembering those that have served during and more importantly those that paid the ultimate sacrifice during previous and ongoing conflicts. It's not about a football game, it's not about a public holiday its not about whether shops can trade this that or the other.

I think it's important we go about our daily lives somewhat as we normally would; but just for a second on Saturday, stop and think about those that have paid the ultimate sacrifice so that you and your families can go about your normal lives.

I'm from a family with a long history of service in the military including WW1 ANZACS, WW2, Vietnam and the recent Middle East operations and am very proud of this. I'm very proud of my family that has supported those deployed and to those that have had to deal with the loss of a family member. I'm very conscious that the day does seem to be taking on a more commercialized approach in some circles which is disappointing.

In terms of filming the Last Post. It's not something that I would ever dream off because it really is a spine tingling moment thinking about the sacrifices many Australians and New Zealanders have made, it can be very surreal depending on where you are. This is the time that all your thoughts should be remembering those not fortunate enough to be standing next to you.

Dawn Service at the AWM Saturday morning will be an amazing experience.

This is my Great Grandfather who was at Galipoli and I'm amazingly proud of his service and thought I would share this for anyone interested which was on ABC open.

https://open.abc.net.au/explore/92691

A collection of some our family decorations I have.

 

[JB1975]

I wouldn't be offended to see someone filming the moment, but I suppose I'm like many in that I can't see why it needs to be filmed. It seems to me that the more people we have filming and photographing a moment, then the more of a 'performance' that moment becomes. I sometimes fear that we forget as much as we remember on Anzac Day: the horror of war, the frequent futility it, the way in which soldiers have come home but have continued to live in their own personal hells. But whatever my concerns, the Last Post should still be a moment to reflect and to cast your mind back into these experiences of young men just like you, to think and to feel, to let that sad tune wash over you.

I sometimes think that the more we're concerned to capture a moment for posterity, the more removed we must become from that moment in time. It can also make other people more detached from the experience, more self-conscious, to have cameras snapping and filming their sacred moment.

So, I would say that you wouldn't be greatly offending anyone if you filmed it. I would also say that it's great that you're thinking about the significance of your actions for other people, and you're evidently a thoughtful and reflective person. Whatever you choose to do, I'm sure it'll be in the right spirit.

 

[Anzacday]

I would've thought filming anything on your phone means you're not in the moment and that may be the true "crime".
A lot of experiences are missed simply by not being in the moment and concentrating on your phone.
Each to their own though.

 

[mattys123]

I dont see why it would be disrespectful but I also never see the point of filming anything like that on a phone. What you see on the phone afterwards is such a meagre representation of what was going on I honestly dont think its worth it. Why not just put it away and experience the moment? To everyone who gets out their phones at gigs, Im talking to you too

Basically this, unless you are in the MCC members are in the first few rows, odds are your phone won't capture the moment with any clarity anyway.

Each to their own I reckon, holding up a phone isn't disrespectful, but I would like everyone to remove their hats, the number who still don't on ANZAC day during the pre game ceremony is staggering.

Personally I just stand there and observe, been to every Pies vs Bombers AD game now, and the respect and observance level has been at an all time high in recent years.

 

[Matt_352]

I wouldn't be offended but, no need to fil it in my opinion. its to honour our fallen servicemen and women.

 

[Ted Parker]

Is it disrespectful to film the Last Post with my iPhone at the MCG on Saturday?

Thoughts?[/QUOTE]

Just absorb the moment son and focus your attention paying respect and reflecting on the ANZAC deeds.
There's plenty of better coverage on Fox or Ch7 of the moment you can recap later on.
And take your cap off! That goes for all of you, old and young alike.

 

[TheGreatGrundy]

Why do you want to film a moment that becomes a moment, the same moment, every year? When you film your trip to Thailand, you do so because its personal and you are not going to repeat that same experience again. The last post is the last post every year. Will you also want to film next year's last post or will you be satisfied with film of just this year's last post? I cannot see the point of filming it. If you are that much into Anzac day, do as others have suggested and live in the moment rather than trying to preserve that moment on your phone.

 

[Matt_352]

If it were me idbe standing there absorbing the moment , it is such a special moment.

 

[Markfs]

The day is about remembering those that have served during and more importantly those that paid the ultimate sacrifice during previous and ongoing conflicts. It's not about a football game, it's not about a public holiday its not about whether shops can trade this that or the other.

I think it's important we go about our daily lives somewhat as we normally would; but just for a second on Saturday, stop and think about those that have paid the ultimate sacrifice so that you and your families can go about your normal lives.

I'm from a family with a long history of service in the military including WW1 ANZACS, WW2, Vietnam and the recent Middle East operations and am very proud of this. I'm very proud of my family that has supported those deployed and to those that have had to deal with the loss of a family member. I'm very conscious that the day does seem to be taking on a more commercialized approach in some circles which is disappointing.

In terms of filming the Last Post. It's not something that I would ever dream off because it really is a spine tingling moment thinking about the sacrifices many Australians and New Zealanders have made, it can be very surreal depending on where you are. This is the time that all your thoughts should be remembering those not fortunate enough to be standing next to you.

Dawn Service at the AWM Saturday morning will be an amazing experience.

This is my Great Grandfather who was at Galipoli and I'm amazingly proud of his service and thought I would share this for anyone interested which was on ABC open.

https://open.abc.net.au/explore/92691

A collection of some our family decorations I have.
View attachment 126996

My grandfather was at Gallipoli. He was in the 2nd wave that followed on a hour or two after the first wave on the 25th April. He died from many health problems, most of them associated with his war service. He got 2 medals. One was awarded in the 1950s. I think the first medal was for being there as well. There were no stories written about him saving his fellow soldiers, although he might have done it. I spoke to my father about it recently and my grandfather rarely spoke of the war. He sent back letters and edited versions were printed in the Egerton newspaper. None are too complimentary about the reasons that they were there. He was a country boy from a family with very little money but he could ride and shoot and was one of the first people in Victoria that volunteered. I am proud of the dignity that showed in his life. I only remember him as a small boy. Other than that, I feel a contempt for people who start wars, even those who "have no other choice" ....such as the honourable john howard who had no choice but to send troops to Iraq. I find it peculiar that Winston Churchill who instigated the Gallipoli campaign, got to write books, become PM of britain and have a long life.... yet 9000 australians died at gallipoli...

 

[Markfs]

Was originally going to start this thread off by saying "not sure if it's thread worthy", but then I see the run that a lot of other garbage gets around here and I just decided to go for it since it's more thought provoking.

Wanted to put a discussion I've been having with people at home and work to the family here in the Magpies forum.

SO let me set the scene, this year I'm fortunate enough to be attending the ANZAC day game on Saturday afternoon. I'm 23 years old, I have no direct knowledge of any family fighting in the war although it has been mentioned to me that we may have had ancestors who did. My respect for the ANZAC's is immense and the Dawn Service is something that for at least the past 5 years I have been attending whether that be on my own or with people I can inspire to come. It's a small token of my appreciation to be up at the crack of dawn to acknowledge the service men and women who gave their lives to provide this country we are blessed to reside in.

Anywho, the point of my thread is to ask a simple, yet perhaps controversial question.

Is it disrespectful to film the Last Post with my iPhone at the MCG on Saturday?

Now, it might not seem a big issue to some, but to others it may very well be. Is it taboo? Is it just 'unaustralian'? I don't want to unknowingly offend someone in the crowd, and although I feel I won't be the only one, what if I am? It's the centenary year, and it's been 6 years since I've been to the annual game, it's just a moment I'd love to capture because I want to be able to re-live that moment. Just not at the expense of causing an uproar.

Additionally, I don't feel it's at all disrespectful to film during the national anthem and catch that almighty roar when the anthem finishes, and the siren blows.

Thoughts?

I'm not sure why you have "immense" respect for the Anzacs and yet you haven't bothered to find out about how your family was affected by the war. There is plenty of information online, especially if you had a relation involved in WW1. Don't take this wrongly, but I would find it hard to have strong feelings about something that I dont know much about. My grandfather wrote letters that were published in a newspaper. He landed at Gallipoli on 25th April and I will let him do the talking. He wrote this on July 26th 1915.

"Some of the wounded say that they are anxious to get back to the firing line. I've seen enough of the firing line to do me the end of my days. I think somebody should write to Australia and contradict a lot of those letters that the soldiers are writing - they are generally exaggerated about their landing. I believe the 3rd brigade did come across a small trench with half a dozen Turks or so, but most of us didnt see a Turk all day long, although we were under heavy rifle and shrapnel fire. The country was so hilly and shrubby that it was impossible to see them"..

Maybe other soldiers had other experiences but this is more real to me than some glossy booklet from the government...

 

[jjsmitty8]

I'm not sure why you have "immense" respect for the Anzacs and yet you haven't bothered to find out about how your family was affected by the war. There is plenty of information online, especially if you had a relation involved in WW1. Don't take this wrongly, but I would find it hard to have strong feelings about something that I dont know much about. My grandfather wrote letters that were published in a newspaper. He landed at Gallipoli on 25th April and I will let him do the talking. He wrote this on July 26th 1915.

"Some of the wounded say that they are anxious to get back to the firing line. I've seen enough of the firing line to do me the end of my days. I think somebody should write to Australia and contradict a lot of those letters that the soldiers are writing - they are generally exaggerated about their landing. I believe the 3rd brigade did come across a small trench with half a dozen Turks or so, but most of us didnt see a Turk all day long, although we were under heavy rifle and shrapnel fire. The country was so hilly and shrubby that it was impossible to see them"..

Maybe other soldiers had other experiences but this is more real to me than some glossy booklet from the government...

Yep, valid points. I don't really have much of a response other than the simple fact that I just do. Everyone feels differently about the day and the events, me personally, I don't have an extensive knowledge but being raised to appreciate them is probably the main contributor.

Like i said, everyone feels different and is entitled to their opinions, I'm not going to jump down their throats though.

At least I achieved my goal in creating discussion lol.

 

[Markfs]

Yep, valid points. I don't really have much of a response other than the simple fact that I just do. Everyone feels differently about the day and the events, me personally, I don't have an extensive knowledge but being raised to appreciate them is probably the main contributor.

Like i said, everyone feels different and is entitled to their opinions, I'm not going to jump down their throats though.

At least I achieved my goal in creating discussion lol.

Well let me throw this one in..... I hear a lot about the ANZACs going to war to defend freedoms. I would suggest that a person taking an innocent photo of a dawn service is within the boundaries of a freedom....no harm to others.... and I will go further. The AnZACs are typically presented as men who disliked pomp and ceremony and official functions that are based on the english attitude of being correct and proper. I would think that taking a photo perfectly expresses one's "australianness".

 

[NT.Thunder]

I'm not sure why you have "immense" respect for the Anzacs and yet you haven't bothered to find out about how your family was affected by the war. There is plenty of information online, especially if you had a relation involved in WW1. Don't take this wrongly, but I would find it hard to have strong feelings about something that I dont know much about. My grandfather wrote letters that were published in a newspaper. He landed at Gallipoli on 25th April and I will let him do the talking. He wrote this on July 26th 1915.

"Some of the wounded say that they are anxious to get back to the firing line. I've seen enough of the firing line to do me the end of my days. I think somebody should write to Australia and contradict a lot of those letters that the soldiers are writing - they are generally exaggerated about their landing. I believe the 3rd brigade did come across a small trench with half a dozen Turks or so, but most of us didnt see a Turk all day long, although we were under heavy rifle and shrapnel fire. The country was so hilly and shrubby that it was impossible to see them"..

Maybe other soldiers had other experiences but this is more real to me than some glossy booklet from the government...

Just amazing to read. I get shivers every time I read or see something like this, the thoughts, feelings, emotions running through the ANZAC's heads.